|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Masters Edition IV||Uncommon|
|International Collector's Edition||Common|
|Limited Edition Beta||Common|
|Limited Edition Alpha||Common|
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Red Elemental Blast
Choose one - Counter target blue spell; or destroy target blue permanent.
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Red Elemental Blast Discussion
3 days ago
TheHamster Yeah, the lack of enchantment destruction / counters is glaring for Red - I keep hoping they'll address it in a new set or something but no dice so far. As far as Red Elemental Blast, that feels too specific to devote one of my 99 to but perhaps worth putting into a sideboard for if I happen to be playing a mono blue deck.
pinecone2k3 I'm like 90% sure I have a Lightning Bolt in my collection back home, but I can't for the life of me think of a reason that I wouldn't have put it in here if I did. Impact Tremors looks fun as hell - I should double check though, does that trigger for the tokens that Krenko generates or is it strictly for 'actual' creatures?
Argy I am nearly certain that I pulled a Purphoros, God of the Forge back in my Theros or Born of the Gods fatpacks. I think I was so caught up in my blinkered "Gotta be only goblins" that I dismissed the usefulness of him without really stopping to consider it. Throne of the God-Pharaoh looks just nasty enough for me to get a decent chuckle out of playing it.
Thank you for the recommendations / advice all three of you.
5 days ago
I just try to throw in some stuff, maybe you can use some of it.
Well known combos which might be nice here:
Grim Monolith/Basalt Monolith + Power Artifact = infinite colourless mana.
Grim Monolith/Basalt Monolith + Rings of Brighthearth = infinite colourless mana.
Tidespout Tyrant + Sol Ring/Mana Vault/Mana Crypt = infinite colourless mana.
Tidespout Tyrant + infinite colourless mana + Candelabra of Tawnos/Palinchron = infinite coloured mana.
Tidespout Tyrant + infinite colourless mana + Izzet Signet/Mox Opal/Fellwar Stone/Gilded Lotus = infinite coloured mana.
Palinchron + Phantasmal Image = infinite coloured mana.Candelabra of Tawnos + High Tide or similar = good mana rock.
Future Sight + Helm of Awakening + Sensei's Divining Top = draw.
Dramatic Reversal + Isochron Scepter = a lot of infinite stuff possible.
I'd probably play Preordain, Gitaxian Probe, Impulse and Fact or Fiction. Maybe also Gush and certainly Frantic Search. These help you go through your pile quicker, which is quite important, since you don't have access to a lot of the good black tutors. Gamble and Intuition might be good, tutors are important for in cEDH. Turnabout seems good. I think most red cEDH decks play Pyroblast/Red Elemental Blast. Chain of Vapor probably belongs here and also Hurkyl's Recall. I think Dack Fayden belongs in every commander deck. Past in Flames. Baral, Chief of Compliance.
I'd streamline the deck towards fast combo (similar to a storm deck) and remove the stax elements. Usually if you try to be between fast combo and stax you don't do either right. I like Mind Stone, but for cEDH it's probably too slow. Library of Leng doesn't do enough in this deck I think.
6 days ago
Lol I can't tell whether you're being sarcastic or not about the "amateur" thing, but "curving out" would mean playing something on each turn. I would want lots of 1-drops because it ups the chances I will be doing something during the first turn of the game, then less two drops, and so on and so fourth. Ideally, this means we are likely to things like play a 4-drop on turn four, two 2-drops, or one 3-drop and one 1-drop because the curve is structured so we are less likely to see cards of increasing costs. This means we are building the deck such that it will perform as efficiently as possible on each turn of the game with as few lands as possible. Is this a sufficient explanation?
We ideally want to maintain the "decreasing staircase" curve, so if we were to remove something like Constant Mists we could not replace it with Choke without removing an additional 3-drop and adding a 2-drop. If we don't follow these kind of procedures when building a deck that is excels during the early turns, we promote the chances of getting awkward openers and poor subsequent draws.
That being said, the effectiveness of Red Elemental Blast and Constant Mists depends on your meta. Are you the fastest, most oppressive deck? Then, Constant Mists probably isn't necessary because if you get too far behind then you probably already lost. Most competitive decks experience a lot of blue in their meta's, so cards like Choke and Pyroblast are quite commonplace cards.
We ideally want to keep your aura count in the range 18 - 20, this will result in the lowest variance so you were correct in calling me out on one of the previous posts.
Cyclonic Rift, Toxic Deluge, and Arcane Lighthouse are the most commonplace answers to our strategy. Since you know this, Nevermore is a much more useful card. You should always be naming Rift or Deluge if blue or black is at the table. You unfortunately also have to worry about sacrifice effects, which is why I encouraged you to include Dryad Arbor awhile back as fetching it up can save you in a pinch. The most commonplace sac-effect you will have to be weary of is more than likely Living Death. It's difficult to account for sac-effects though as they warrant the addition of very narrow cards like Tajuru Preserver or Angel of Jubilation, which we don't want. I guess what I said was a bit roundabout, but Nevermore is probably the best option to stop people from playing the aforementioned problematic spells. Nevermore should rarely be a dead draw you either name a problematic commander or one of the aforementioned cards.
I have no idea what "Timmy player" means, could you elaborate? Recommending an "interesting" deck to someone is difficult because everyone has a different idea of what is interesting. If you enjoy quality decks that perform consistently, then the cEDH tier list has plenty of examples of decks that do just that. I can't really vouch for how interesting they are though. I guess some of the one's that I found to be more interesting were an angel of glory's rise + child of alara combo deck, a captain sisay paradox engine storm deck, a combo-control grand arbiter deck, and a pretty standard sliver overlord deck.
Finally, it would really help me with future suggestions if you could be more vocal about what proposed changes you plan to act upon otherwise it feels as though I am trying to read between the lines and find how exactly you intend to change the deck (which effects the curve, which in turn effects the cards I suggest).
1 week ago
I had forgotten that fetches could pull dual lands, and I'm all for deck-thinning: that being said, I'll still have to wait a bit before I can purchase them. I'll wait until I acquire these cards before I update the lands in my deck list: that way I can test them out, though I'm pretty confident that they should work just fine.
Perhaps you could explain something else to an amateur like myself: I would have thought that because Chaos Warp is lower in cmc that it would be the superior choice to something like Cast Out, but maybe I just don't understand the curve.
Considering your idea of using oppression to incapacitate your opponent into submission, as opposed to relying on defensive cards like Dueling Grounds, do you feel like Constant Mists and Red Elemental Blast don't do do enough? Would something like Choke be superior to Pyroblast, due to its more devastating, long-term impact?
Cool, Angelic Destiny works great.
I kinda like the staxy approach of layering one type of prison on top of the other, in addition to the inherent diversity involved, but preventing your opponents from drawing/tutoring cards is a powerful effect. I had considered using Nevermore to oppose more commander-centric strategies, but that could possibly be a dead card, though Stranglehold rarely would be.
This is off-topic, but one of the reasons voltron is so fun for me is because it's so different from the standard decks that most players use and creates fun interactions. I like being able to humble the snobby spike player (not saying all spikes are snobby) that I occasionally play against and level the playing field so that other people can actually have fun, and while I wouldn't consider voltron entirely unorthodox, it is pretty uncommon to see it played.
Anyway, I guess what I'm asking is: are there are any other unorthodox deck types that you would recommend? I get tired of seeing the same decks all the time, so playing something both unique and competitive would be a lot of fun, and most people wouldn't know how to react to something like that. At heart, I'm probably a Timmy player, which is partly why voltron appeals to me.
1 week ago
well for enchantment destruction, since your in red, your only option is Permanent destruction in artifacts. Red doesn't do well against enchantments. as for counterspells, your also fairly limited to stuff like Red Elemental Blast and such.
1 week ago
Assuming my total number of disruption cards is seven, I was thinking that those slots would be filled by Gaddock Teeg, Grand Abolisher, Blind Obedience Aven Mindcensor, Armageddon, Red Elemental Blast and Constant Mists.
I was thinking of including an extra land destruction spell or counterspell, but I figured that diversification might be important, given the limited number of slots available: that's why I just selected one counterspell. Constant Mists Would definitely be an asset in my deck.
What do you think? That's assuming I adhere to 14 slots.
I guess another way of looking at it is that these are my 14 survival cards, and I tried to categorize them as best I could, albeit loosely. lol
1 week ago
Harmonize was a difficult include for me as well, but it's pretty much the only option G/W and Naya have for card advantage. I don't think giving it a test would be that detrimental as it's a pretty cheap card monetarily. I've had good experiences with it, but I get that not every card translates well.
Also, I wasn't saying you should be running the same exact disruption spells as I do, but that maybe you should consider running more of them. Cards like Possibility Storm, Pyroblast, Nevermore, Choke, Red Elemental Blast, Thalia, Heretic Cathar, and Blind Obedience are all decent options. Your ideal disruption card is something that comes down before Uril or is low cmc and is as asymmetrical in your favor as possible.
Artifact disruption cards (I.e. Stony Silence & Null Rod) are more for shutting down fast mana than they are hosing decks like Arcum Dagsson. Fast mana effects are too common in EDH (at least in my meta) to pass on aforementioned effects. If this is not the case for you, then I could see how you could forgo Null Rod and Stony Silence.
On a side note, I think we might have different definitions of "disruption". I don't necessarily believe removal to be disruption. To me disruption is an ongoing effect that negatively impacts a player or group of players. Thus, in my interpretation you would only have two disruption effects or ~2% (assuming Teeg and Abolisher will be in the next update, please correct me if you have decided to go ahead and include more than this).
It's always very difficult to maintain fast mana effects (like Avacyn's Pilgrim) as well as include cards that will carry you through the late game if your general gets wrathed. I've found that in addition to a plethora of indestructible and disruption effects, just knowing how to navigate the game is incredibly helpful. Sometimes you just can't win and you have to live with knowing that you'll occasionally get land screwed, someone will have the nuts, or the table will seemingly have an everflowing number of answers. It's just how Magic works.
I don't want to sound too cliche, but the best thing you can do once you've done solid conceptual work is play games as if they're a learning experience. Coming to better understand your deck and meta is crucial for consistency. People will most likely complain that you play the same deck too much, but if your goal is to build the voltron deck that works best for you then it shouldn't bother you.
NP. Although I can't playtest with you or learn your meta, I'm always open to helping out. Feel free to bring up discussion points as you see fit.
2 weeks ago
The problem with Ignition is that it requires Uril to be on board. In most cases you would want to wrath the board when you are behind (meaning Uril has low P & T or is in the command zone). I'm just not a fan of board wipes with requirements.
If your looking for another board wipe, I believe Divine Reckoning is worth considering.
With regard to cmc, always keep your curve in mind. You either want it to look like an ascending or descending staircase from 1 - 3 mana. Aggressive decks like voltron should be aiming for the later (descending).
Bolt, unlike other removal spells, is meta dependent because it only deals a set amount of damage. If you're having problems with early game creatures or someone in your playgroup has a general that can be hit by bolt, then it could be reasonable.
Grasp of Fate is probably the best removal spell that you are missing.
How I would make the changes...
Land -> Mox Diamond
Of course everything is up to your discretion. Feel free to debate, inquire about, or ignore anything you don't agree with.