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Thorn of Amethyst
Noncreature spells cost (1) more to play.
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Thorn of Amethyst Discussion
SynergyBuild on Roon
6 hours ago
That wins turn one, you fetch a Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, Phyrexian Delver, Pestermite, reanimate the Delver, to reanimate Kiki-Jiki, copy the delver, return the mite, Pestermite + Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker to win.
The deck Grixis Twin can win a a ton of ways turn one, so can flash-hulk, and food chain tazri, etc.
You honestly gave the second worst example for a deck to win fast with Teferi, it is a stax deck, Blood Pod is a tad bit worse, it is a beatdown stax build, so even a perfect god hand might not win with it turn one.
The stax lock you gave takes way longer than turn 4 to pull off, and infinite removal won't affect storm, so I don't know why you think that stops your opponents, Winter Orb can shut off a table on its own, that is what stax is, not a combo. Tangle Wire slows down a tables tempo a ton. Smokestack might take some time, but it works, Armageddon single-handely has won many a game. Stax is about those cards, not Acidic Slime.
Armageddon, Ravages of War, Catastrophe, Cataclysm, Ruination, Decree of Annihilation (cycle it), Sphere of Resistance, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, Thorn of Amethyst and the like are real stax cards. A 3 card combo that costs 11 mana (not including Palinchron's cost, it is kind of free.) isn't what turns a deck into a stax deck.
I said a control deck should run 30+ answers, none of the decks I mentions after were control, I apologize, that was on me. Control is a cEDH strategy, in the way it is in Tier 2-2.5, but I was only talking tier 1 lists, so it didn't fit there, I apologize again if I didn't mention that.
Yes, Roon is a tier 2.5 list on that tier list, I respect that entirely, you know the decklist that was mentioned there? Prison Can Roon Your Life, a stax deck, you know what cards it runs? Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, Vryn Wingmare, Thorn of Amethyst, Sphere of Resistance, and do you know what it doesn't run? Acidic Slime, Deadeye Navigator, Palinchron, cards like that.
Hokori and Seedborn Muse are good cards, I will give you that, honestly, my suggestions are one of two, turn the deck into Prison Can Roon Your Life, or something of similar competitiveness, like Bant Flash + Protean Hulk, or drop the "competitive" hub.
14 hours ago
I want to preface this with that I don't want to claim you, your deckbuilding skills, or this deck is bad. I simply want to make notice of the "competitive" tag you placed on this list. I would like to see it removed due to what I believe is a mistake and might be misleading.
Competitive lists are normally Tier 1 to 2.5 lists that tend to either:
A - Be able to race out wins with a tad bit of protects, turn 1-4 wins need to be regular.
B - Able able to set up a lock on the game like Trinisphere + Winter Orb + Tangle Wire, and pull a win through that lock.
C - Be able to counter or remove any combo win or stax lock your opponents drop before they win, and then pull a win yourself.
These three archetypes are "Combo", "Stax" and "Control" respectively. Occasionally decks do fit multiple archetypes and are a hybrid of them.
This deck cannot race between turns 1-4 with a lack of good ramp like Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, Chrome Mox, Mox Diamond, and though you run a lot of good tutors, you have a clunky and expensive suite of combos, all of which have little synergy with your commander, and the rest of the deck. The list looks like a stax-combo hybrid, with a fair number of good hatebears and some good cards like Authority of the Consuls against kiki-combo, however you don't run tax effects like Sphere of Resistance, Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, Glowrider, Vryn Wingmare, Thorn of Amethyst along with a lack of good land destruction like Armageddon, Ravages of War, Cataclysm, etc. leaves your deck lacking as a stax build too.
Since you can't effectively race or stax a game out, with the abundance of lifegain cards and useless cards like Virtus the Veiled you have a deck without enough answers to be control either.
Here are some lists that are considered Tier 1, the most competitive, for reference:
1 day ago
Hah! Love the Titania's Song, I thought I was the only one!
Decree of Annihilation doesn't trigger Ruric Thar, the Unbowed and is a cantrip Armageddon. Epicenter, Impending Disaster, Boom and Ruination are great ways to turn the table in your favor as well, with all of your dorks. Trinisphere, Sphere of Resistance, Thorn of Amethyst, Lodestone Golem, and other tax effects to improve on the way the land destruction shuts off your opponents. Running more tutors for Magus of the Moon is also great, think Sylvan Tutor or Imperial Recruiter type effects.
6 days ago
Well, these discussions matter a lot.
Cromat may be a better commander than Mairsil, the Pretender at a Laboratory Maniac combo if the addition of green and white with support cards like Grand Abolisher, Silence, Abrupt Decay, Autumn's Veil, Nature's Claim, and Swords to Plowshares are good enough that you don't need a commander with minor benefits.
In that way, I think every 5 color commander should be Tier 2, as I can make any of them a decent list (or a hundred decent lists). No, they don't have to support a combo if their colors are powerful enough on their own.
On the other hand. I could run any random grixis commander, and build a list that though might be slightly worse than Kess, Dissident Mage, could make a very good deck using the shell of Grixis Twin. That deck might even be more powerful than Azami, Lady of Scrolls. Think about that. The fact that Karona, False God, with the list of Grixis Twin might be better than many tier 2 lists, yet is tier 5?
A Tier 5 list that is better than a tier 2 list, isn't a tier 5 list, yet at that point, the best decks should be the best decks, not the commanders at the helm of them. Think about stax decks, you can build a mono-red stax list that works (albeit not the best, but not bad or anything) and even use the commander of Zirilan of the Claw for a bit of removal if you cheat out one of the dragons that deals damage on ETB. That deck sure might whoop a Tier 3 list every time, with a mix of fast-paced stax, using Winter Orbs and Static Orbs, along with Sphere of Resistance and Thorn of Amethysts and some removal like Blasphemous Act, all the while setting up a Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker combo for the win. That deck doesn't sound bad, right? Well Zirilan of the Claw is tier 4, apparently they can't even compete against tier 1 lists, but against them, it can work, red has Gamble, Pyroblast/Red Elemental Blast, and all of the colorless stax options, along with more card draw than Hokori, Dust Drinker has, no, it isn't as powerful a commander if you don't include color, but if the color has more power, than the deck can, and the commander's deck is what the commander's power is derived from.
I understand this list will be making changes in the near future, I am excited for that, but until then, I still think most commanders (like 80% or so of them) can be made into a list that is competitive (Tier 1-2).
To be honest, I could probably write up a playable list for most commanders. I am probably going to do that soon.
1 week ago
1 week ago
I mean, I don't see how this is stax, I see some very good cards, like Gamble, Imperial Recruiter, and Enlightened Tutor, but in terms of prison/stax, you only run about 6 cards: Thalia, Heretic Cathar, Ghostly Prison, Linvala, Keeper of Silence, Aura of Silence, Blind Obedience, and Cataclysm.
I'd suggest you drop the cards like Bruse Tarl, Boorish Herder and Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite for much more powerful stax cards. Also I'd think running some more tutors for Helm of the Host (the instant win) would be useful.
Other cards I'd suggest you run:
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben - hurts storm builds and greedy manabases more than your deck.
Ruination - You run enough basics that a 3-4 colored deck will crumble.
Armageddon - Aurelia, the Warleader makes this thing basically a win, as you can probably beat face enough to kill one person before they rebuild, whilst rebuilding on your own. At that point with a couple more stax cards you might be able to drop your opponents all together. Use Ravages of War as well if you can afford one.
Crucible of Worlds - With a lot of land-destruction, or fetchlands, this card gives you constant land drops, allowing you to rebuild like nothing ever happened a few turns after an Armageddon or Cataclysm. Acts as a half Sun Titan in some cases. Strip Mine/Wasteland make it really good too.
World Queller - this card is godly. It can be used as land destruction every turn, and with a Sun Titan or Crucible of Worlds, you might not notice it's effect, but can name planeswalkers while you have none to get rid of a pesky Ugin/Karn/Nicol Bolas. It can of course remove pesky artifacts or enchantments, and still beat face a bit.
Trinisphere - This deck has a pretty high CMC, so this card might barely affect it. It will totally hurt the elf player, the storm player, and any other low-cmc player.
Aven Mindcensor - This doesn't affect you, but hurts your opponents fetch lands, tutors, or any other searches.
Luminarch Ascension - Acts as a powerful alternate win condition if you lock out you opponents.
Magus of the Moon - If you run enough basic lands, this card won't affect you very much, because of the artifact mana you have. Other decks may crumble to it.
Otherwise I'd only suggest you run some more rocks (Mox Diamond/Chrome Mox/Mana Crypt and all of the legal fetchlands like Windswept Heath, Marsh Flats, Flooded Strand, Bloodstained Mire, Wooded Foothills, Scalding Tarn)
Cards to drop for this stuff:
Argentum Armor, Extraplanar Lens, Loxodon Warhammer, Mask of Memory, Sword of War and Peace, Tenza, Godo's Maul, Elspeth, Knight-Errant, Puresteel Paladin, Gisela, Blade of Goldnight, Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite, Bruse Tarl, Boorish Herder, Balefire Liege, Avacyn, Angel of Hope, Archangel of Tithes, Angelic Arbiter, 2-3 lands.
Otherwise, it terms of lands, drop Sunhome, Fortress of the Legion, Temple of the False God, Boros Garrison, Emeria, The Sky Ruin, Opal Palace, Rogue's Passage, Clifftop Retreat, and some basic mountains, add the remaining 6 fetchlands, and that should be about it!
2 weeks ago
Yeah, but how do I get that across to him, like at first I was super happy because a new player wanted to play Animar, but... yeah I think you get the point. I think he thinks Animar is stompy, and someone must have told him that stompy wasn't competitive, and so he saw the first competitive decklist for some real stax deck (Tana/Tymna Blood Pod or something, idk), saw Thorn of Amethyst and thought he fully understood everything that Animar was.
At least thats what I got, but how do I explain that Animar is a fast-paced creature-storm combo deck with large access to ramp and insanely fast wins, but isn't stax. I don't think he even knows what stax is, let alone storm or cedh-combo.
2 weeks ago
His arguement went way beyond my understanding of logic, something like "Animar decks want to make their creatures want to cost less, so since Thorn of Amethyst does the opposite effect to the opposite type of card, it in turn does exactly what Animar does!"
I couldn't figure it out.