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Legality
| Format | Legality |
| 1v1 Commander | Legal |
| Archenemy | Legal |
| Arena | Legal |
| Block Constructed | Legal |
| Canadian Highlander | Legal |
| Casual | Legal |
| Commander / EDH | Legal |
| Commander: Rule 0 | Legal |
| Custom | Legal |
| Duel Commander | Legal |
| Gladiator | Legal |
| Highlander | Legal |
| Historic | Legal |
| Historic Brawl | Legal |
| Legacy | Legal |
| Leviathan | Legal |
| Limited | Legal |
| Modern | Legal |
| Modern Beyond Horizons | Legal |
| Oathbreaker | Legal |
| Pioneer | Legal |
| Planar Constructed | Legal |
| Planechase | Legal |
| Quest Magic | Legal |
| Vanguard | Legal |
| Vintage | Legal |
Rules Q&A
Angelic Skirmisher
Creature — Angel
Flying At the beginning of each combat choose first strike, vigilance or lifelink. Creatures you control gain that ability until end of turn.
Apoptosis on
Gear Up!
4 months ago
Specific changes. All of these changes optimize card draw, tutoring, protection to board state, create synergies and infinite combos, and optimization to allow instant speed responses.
OUT: Ardenn, Intrepid Archaeologist (thought this would be awesome, disappointed in performance) Assemble the Players (sub-optimal card draw) Aurelia's Fury Bitterthorn, Nissa's Animus (land drops have not been a problem and by the time I draw it, I needed something else) Brimaz, King of Oreskos (love this guy, but had to cut) Chained to the Rocks Elbrus, the Binding Blade Flip (obtained better equipment) Fellwar Stone Hixus, Prison Warden (never happy when I had this in hand because you need to let the damage land, plus you fail to build board state when waiting to draw a punch) Illusionist's Bracers (I realized there was little in this deck that this could help) Kemba, Kha Enduring (I want the option of where the equipment goes) Kjeldoran Outpost (did help create a chump blocker and spend unused mana, but I didn't like losing the land) Lapse of Certainty (replaced with better options, but I love this card) Lightning Helix Path of Mettle Flip (never had good results) Prophetic Flamespeaker (under-performed) Puresteel Paladin (tough cut) Purphoros, God of the Forge (under-performed) Rogue's Passage Sea Gate Wreckage Silverblade Paladin (love this guy, tough cut) Sram, Senior Edificer (very tough and recent cut for Leonin Shikari and Merry, who are just better but I may put back in) Sword of the Animist (land drops have not been a problem and by the time I draw it, I needed something else) Wingmate Roc (love it but under-performed)
In: Esper Sentinel (card draw) Leonin Shikari (instant speed equiping is amazing) Merry, Esquire of Rohan (card draw) Enlightened Tutor (great for combos/synergies) Sigarda's Aid (so great) Pyrohemia (this card is a beast with Iroas! Even without Iroas must people don't have easy ways to deal with enchantments and this is a wraith on a stick. I've added it to all of my red decks and it's cousin (Pestilence) to my black decks in a slot I would normally hold for a wraith) Teferi's Protection (protect the board state) Excalibur, Sword of Eden Fighter Class (tutor!) Angelic Skirmisher (lifelink to stretch game and facilitates infinite combos) Splendor Mare (put it on Reckoner or Spitemare, give them indestructable, and gain infinite life, or move it to pyrohemia with nesting grounds to get massive amounts of life as you flamethrower the whole table!!) Mask of Avacyn (better option then shroud from boots, you need to be able to dynamically react/voltron) Mob Rule (this just finishes games) Smothering Tithe (ramp) Sunforger (some say you must build around this, I say you use this as a key tutor for when you need an instant) Nesting Grounds Spitemare The One Ring (card draw, duh) Minas Tirith (card draw) Sunhome, Fortress of the Legion (value engine, mana dump) Phyrexian Vindicator (beefy flier, helps get Iroas online, and difficult to remove) War of the Last Alliance (tutor) Hall of Heliod's Generosity (bring back pyrohemia and flamethrower the world all over again!!) Mask of Memory (card draw) Boromir, Warden of the Tower (protect board state)
multimedia on
Liesa but Angels
5 months ago
Hey, good WIP for Angels, nice Avacyn and Tithe.
When you break it down to the very basics of what you need for Angels it's three things: Angels, ramp and draw. Angels because you want to cast/attack with Angels, ramp because you want to be able to consistently cast your higher mana cost (4+ CMC) Angels and repeatable draw because you want to keep having Angels in your hand to cast. The better Angels you want to attack with, including Liesa, have a high mana cost, without more ramp you'll have a more difficult time casting them. Consider more lower mana cost (1-3 CMC) ramp and more repeatable draw sources?
In my opinion, a good rule for casual Commander deck building is having at least 10 sources of draw and at least 10 sources of ramp, allocate deck room for these. These are the most important two effects to have for smoother gameplay. Better overall gameplay makes playing Commander more fun since you'll get less frustrated with how your deck is running. Consider cutting a few of the lesser power cards compared to other cards here for more ramp and draw?
Add:
- Exemplar of Light, Resplendent Angel, Valkyrie Harbinger, Sanctuary Warden
- Arcane Signet, Talisman of Hierarchy or Mind Stone, Orzhov Signet, Wayfarer's Bauble
- Phyrexian Arena, Court of Grace, Mask of Memory, Collector's Vault
- Skullclamp or Transmogrant's Crown
- Knight of the White Orchid with Sunlit Marsh, Palace Jailer, Midnight Reaper
- Plumb the Forbidden, Night's Whisper, Read the Bones
Cut:
- Dragon Throne of Tarkir, The Pandorica, Halo Fountain, Entreat the Angels
- Unmake, Fate Forgotten and Isildur's Fateful Strike
- Legion Angel, Serra's Guardian, Emancipation Angel, Hailstorm Valkyrie, Vengeful Reaper
- Boon-Bringer Valkyrie, Seraph of the Scales, Angelic Skirmisher
- Season of the Burrow and Season of Loss
Some land upgrades to consider that are within the budget for the manabase: Caves of Koilos, Fetid Heath, Shineshadow Snarl, Great Hall of Starnheim, Tyrite Sanctum, Vault of the Archangel, Soulstone Sanctuary, Path of Ancestry
I hope this advice is helpful and I offer more if you're interested, about the potential adds/cuts I've suggested.
kirbysan on
[Primer] Helming the Host of Heaven *Update*
2 years ago
For Inspiring Overseer and Archangel of Tithes I’m debating Angel of Condemnation, Sigarda's Vanguard and Angelic Skirmisher.
Angel of Condemnation has been useful at times. In mid to late game we are usually holding up the 3 mana for an answer anyway and it would combo decently with Inspiring Overseer but I pulled it in favor of more free or impactful effects. When we use it on an enemies creature it doesn’t really remove it, it just delays it for a turn. And it only helps their strategy if they’re relying on etb effects. Also, since we’re running more recursion now I’m not so skittish to let things die. It would help us save things from single target exile though. I may need more play testing to see.
Sigarda's Vanguard is great as a finisher or to get through some big blockers but it’s typically a one and done. If we’re holding it from the start then it’s a dead card till we establish a board presence. It won’t be impactful after a board wipe. There may be some outs with Pyre of Heroes and recursion but like you mentioned it shouldn’t be something we’re building around. This would be a tough cut but it would make sense compared to Archangel of Tithes. Depending on the player with big flyers, they may not have the extra mana to pay for blockers. It’s still useful against non infinite attacks like the one game where Marneus Calgar had 16 angels and swung lethal since he definitely didn’t have 16 mana to pay.
Angelic Skirmisher is one of those cards that when you draw it with a decent board presence it’s amazing. Lifelink on attack, first strike on defense. But if you tutored for Lyra Dawnbringer then there’s your lifelink. If we have Archangel of Tithes then there’s your defense. It provides overlap on that lifelink but with additional tutoring it may become a dead card late game. It also costs 6cmc and we’re adding in Breathkeeper Seraph so pulling her could help keep our average cmc low.
I’ll have a couple games on the 23rd with my buddies so hopefully I can post some gameplay tech with the new swaps.
kirbysan on
[Primer] Helming the Host of Heaven *Update*
2 years ago
My typical decks are Muldrotha, the Gravetide recursion, Teysa Karlov aristocrats and a Shorikai, Genesis Engine mechs. Those three usually have big flashy plays for instant wins so this deck definitely plays different. I looked over your whole primer and took your advice to heart to reduce the number of changes and focus only on your new additions and lands. I ran a few games using your methodology for mid-range aggro decks and listed how the deck performed. Let me know if this helps helm the host!
1x Snow-Covered Plains for Cavern of Souls
1x Snow-Covered Plains for Mutavault
1x Snow-Covered Plains for Crucible of Worlds
1x Snow-Covered Plains for Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1x Snow-Covered Plains for Path of Ancestry
Rogue's Gloves for Sword of Fire and Ice
Karmic Guide for Emeria Shepherd
Baneslayer Angel for Serra Paragon
Angel of Invention for Steel Seraph
Starting hand was very strong, I held a Youthful Valkyrie, Bishop of Wings, Righteous Valkyrie, Vanquisher's Banner as my draw card and 3 lands which included a fetch and Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx.
T1 - Fetch to Plains
T2 - Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx + Giada, Font of Hope
T3 - Plains + Bishop of Wings + Youthful Valkyrie
T4 - Plains + Using Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx to cast Pearl Medallion & Mangara, the Diplomat which I had drawn into.
T5 - I drew 1 off Mangara, the Diplomat. Jhoira had played a Words of Wind forcing us to bounce Pearl Medallion. Yuriko saw our scary board state and hit us with a few unblockables but we still remained above 40 life.
Land + Pearl Medallion + Smuggler's Share (drew) + Starnheim Aspirant (drew) + Righteous Valkyrie.
T6 - I drew 1 off Smuggler's Share and 2 off Mangara, the Diplomat. Jhoira started building their boardstate with their commander out and a bunch of rocks. Yuriko had a few creatures out and was chipping away at our life totals.
At this point I could've slow played it further but with 2 draw engines out I felt comfortable in restocking my hand.
I played Vanquisher's Banner + Archangel of Thune + Valkyrie Harbinger drawing 2 and swung in for a bunch bringing both of them to their low 20's while I shot up to 60+ life.
I drew 1 off Smuggler's Share and 1 off Mangara, the Diplomat but Yuriko played a Toxic Deluge for 11 wiping our creatures and bringing their life total into the low 10s.
T7+ - At this point my memory is foggy, I replayed Giada and a few low cost angels with Vanquisher's Banner which refilled my hand a bit. But Yuriko miracled a Devastation Tide and played an overloaded Damn. Eventually Jhoira got knocked out by Yuriko after trying to rebuild their board state twice. By the end I had whittled Yuriko down to lethal and played Bruna, the Fading Light Meld reanimating Gisela, the Broken Blade Meld from the graveyard but never got to swing with it as Yuriko conceded.
Starting hand was decent but I don't remember much of it since it got wheeled away with a turn 3 Windfall.
T1 - Fetch to Plains + Soul Warden
T2 - Seraph Sanctuary + Giada, Font of Hope
T3 - Plains + Crucible of Worlds
Lost 5 cards in hand to Windfall and drew a new 5. Jhoira played a Winter Orb and Yuriko played a Null Rod to shut down Jhoira's mana rocks. It also shut down my equipment in hand which was a Sword of the Animist and Mask of Memory. I stopped keeping track of the turns and cards played since the whole game slowed to a crawl. The one saving grace was that I never missed a land drop with the fetch land in the graveyard.
Yuriko kept playing Thieves' Guild Enforcer and changelings to try an alternate mill win strategy. I was hit with a board wipe and Giada was targeted twice. I overloaded Winds of Abandon which left the Jhoira open to be killed. I attempted to cast Emeria Shepherd which would've been perfect with my fetch land and 20+ cards in the graveyard but it was removed after it hit the board. Yuriko played 4 extra turns spells to try and whittle me down from high 30's to 8 but they ran out of answers and were dead on the crackback.
I should've mulliganed this hand as it didn't have a draw spell but I didn't want to hold up the table and the curve looked good.
2x Plains, Teferi's Protection, Angel of Condemnation, Starnheim Unleashed, Resplendent Angel, Herald of War
I was able to build up a decent board state and there were no wipes all game. However, Faldron played a Wand of Wonder and began using my removal spells against my angels. Marneus dropped a Divine Visitation mid-game and started pumping out 4/4 Angels w/ Vigilance which stalled my attacks towards him signifcantly.
Towards the end of the game I was able to tap Starnheim Unleashed for 9 creating 4 Angels with Giada on the board pumping them to double digit beasts. Marneus had the scariest board state but only 4 Angels at the time so I figured I could swing wide and knock them out.
Unfortunately the Ulamog player attacked with a single unblockable voltroned Wurmcoil Engine against Marneus who cast an Entrapment Maneuver netting 10 4/4 Angels.
In the end Marneus had 16 Angels attacking me and I tried to buy time with a Teferi's Protection which got countered with a Dovin's Veto.
Starting hand was great against these commanders:
4x Plains, Dowsing Dagger Flip, Battle Angels of Tyr, Smuggler's Share
T1 - Plains
T2 - Plains + Giada, Font of Hope
T3 - Plains + Smuggler's Share
T4 - Plains + Dowsing Dagger Flip & equipped, swing and flip to Lost Vale, cast Battle Angels of Tyr with Giada and Vale.
Mid-game Shorikai played an Organic Extinction doing a one-sided board wipe and started hitting for double digits with vehicles. I tried to rebuild with Emeria Shepherd but she was countered by Aesi. Fortunately, Shorikai ended up scooping to play Warhammer making it a 3-man pod and all our board states were pretty even. I had drawn a card on each of his turns due to their Shorikai ability. Aesi had provided me a couple treasures but wised up and started dropping lands on opponents turns with Burgeoning.
This game lasted quite awhile so there was plenty of back and forth and a lot of answers were used on my board. Both Muldrotha and Aesi had an Unnatural Growth and were staring down each other. I patiently waited until they were both tapped out and had no answers to pull off this sweet combo:
I had Bishop of Wings & Giada, Font of Hope on the battlefield and tons of mana. I cast Bruna, the Fading Light Meld into Emeria Shepherd. Cracked a Myriad Landscape for 2 Plains bringing back Righteous Valkyrie & Gisela, the Broken Blade Meld. Since they had no responses I was able to merge to Brisela, Voice of Nightmares Meld Meld. Due to all the Giada triggers and lifegain I shot up from 20 life to 62.
Aesi was hamstrung due to Brisela's static ability and their creatures weren't big enough to swing into my massive angels. Muldrotha on the other hand attempted to swing in for a massive 59 damage due to Unnatural Growth but I used Teferi's Protection and won the game on my turn.
Starting hand had no draw again but did have lifegain synergies so I decided to keep.
2x Plains, Cavern of Souls, Windswept Heath, The Book of Exalted Deeds, Archangel of Thune, Angelic Field Marshal.
I was only able to get one use out of The Book of Exalted Deeds trigger before Archangel of Thune was blown up and The Scarab God exiled it and copied it for their board. I actually drew a Mutavault and decided to do the combo of putting the Enlightened Counter on it. However when we got to the mid-game I felt like that was the wrong move to do so early.
Late game I had the following:
Seraph Sanctuary & a bunch of other lands
Angel of Vitality w/ 3 +1/+1 counters
Angelic Field Marshal w/ 4 +1/+1 Counters
4x Clue Tokens
Between the Soul Warden, Angel of Vitality and Seraph Sanctuary I was gaining 2 life whenever they cast a creature and 3 whenever I cast an angel. If I'd let the book stay on the battlefield longer I could've had a free 3/3 angel on each of my turns. Instead I cracked clues rather than play out my hand to draw into more answers and win the game. The Enlightened Counter never came into play, but I reminded the table at the end that without any land destruction, I could've gone to negative life and still not lose.
Forgot to take a picture of my hand this game but I kept Smuggler's Share as my draw card which ended up doing nothing. The Faldron player had already played a few games against the Giada deck so purposely missed double land drops to not give me a treasure.
Faldron cast an Etali, Primal Storm turn 6 with no haste enablers so I blew it up my turn. However, Lazav decided to copy it and the board had no answers. Lazav began swinging and got 2 rounds of Etali triggers which was pretty brutal. Since Lazav became archenemy, we teamed up to take him down bringing his life total to 4.
Perhaps the most memorable moment this game was that Faldron had suspended a Wheel of Fate so the whole table was playing out their hands for 4 turns, completely expecting to draw 7. When he went to removing the last suspend counter, Lazav cast Notion Thief so instead of us each drawing 7, he drew 28 cards. Unfortunately for him, he didn't have any way to use those cards to stop the flood of salt from the table and was killed shortly after by a pissed angel.
I was able to clean up the table after a few rounds with this final board state:
Angel of Jubilation - just an anthem and would've shut down my fetches but I played it late game
Linvala, Keeper of Silence - didn't stop anything on my opponent's board because they were all triggered abilities
Starting hand was top heavy but decided to keep:
Plains, Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, Pearl Medallion, Sword of Hearth and Home, Well of Lost Dreams, Sword of the Animist, Archangel of Thune
I figured with 2 ramp equipments and lifegain comboed with the well I'd be setup for mid-game pretty nicely. What I didn't plan for was missing land drops for 2 turns and having Giada blown up twice. By this time, the Aesi/Faldron player had figured out that Giada was consistently winning and decided to put a stop to it.
However, that let Ydris really take the game away. By the end I only had 4 lands, Archangel of Thune equipped with Sword of Hearth and Home and a Pearl Medallion. Aesi died to a single 30+ swing from Ydris leaving myself and Lazav to deal with the massive board state.
I thought I slowed him down by playing Darksteel Mutation on Ydris when he had no cards in hand but he topdecked Sakashima's Protege to copy Ydris and start the pain all over again. With Ydris having lethal on board next turn the only way to stop it would be to top deck the one board-wipe in the deck. But Lazav shot himself in the foot by playing Gyruda, Doom of Depths tossing my top 4 cards into the graveyard. The top card was Winds of Abandon and Lazav whiffed on the Gyruda trigger much to his chagrin.
Starting hand was decent: Plains, Plains, Thorough Investigation, Thraben Watcher, Search for Glory, Dowsing Dagger Flip, Sword of Fire and Ice
T1 - Plains
T2 - Plains + Giada, Font of Hope
T3 - Plains + Thorough Investigation
T4 - Plains + Thraben Watcher
T5 - Nykthos + Dowsing Dagger Flip & equipped, flipped to Lost Vale, Sword of Fire and Ice
On turn 6 I was able to knock out Ghyrson Starn, Kelermorph with the sword setting him back a turn. He responded the next turn by blowing up my sword. After a 2 board wipes Ghyrson was back in a threatening position. I cast Darksteel Mutation on Ghyrson which completely shut down his strategy.
Closed out the game with an overloaded Winds of Abandon and swung lethal at Roon. I was also able to hardcast Sephara, Sky's Blade which would've stopped any board wipe coming from Ghyrson. Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx was amazing yet again this game. I was able to tap it for 10 white using 8 to pay for the Winds and God-Pharaoh's Statue tax.
Starting hand was strong if a little slow: Fabled Passage, Windbrisk Heights, Eye of Vecna, Sanctuary Warden, Pearl Medallion, Battle Angels of Tyr, Serra Avenger
Ramp wasn't ideal and I saw the limitations of having too much colorless sources. The Plains, Windbrisk Heights and Giada, Font of Hope were the only 3 sources of white most of the game.
There were some pretty wild swings this game as Jared got all 5 colors turn 4 with some ramp and started dropping Kavu's. He played Knight of New Alara turning them into 8/8 tramplers and started swinging in for 24 damage each turn. Isshin dropped a Tectonic Giant, Fervent Charge & Aurelia, the Warleader to swing in with 21 damage each combat & an additional 6 to the face. With so much damage flying around, the loss life from Eye of Vecna was actually pretty annoying. I used it 4 times during the course of the game when I probably should've played the bigger threats since a board wipe seemed unlikely.
Battle Angels of Tyr was blown up immediately but I was able to drop a Angelic Skirmisher & Righteous Valkyrie mid-game. If I had attacked more early game with Skirmisher out I could've had this one but I made a huge misplay. Jared swung in with everything at me after pumping 2 Kavu's up to 13/13's. As I was only at 46 life, I didn't get the anthem off Righteous Valkyrie so I had to take 26 bringing me down to 20. Isshin swung in everything at Jared knocking them out and on second combat came at me when I was at 8. As Righteous Valkyrie was only a 6/7 blocking into their 7/8's I figured I could survive the turn with one unblocked and just gain the life back next turn. Isshin was tapped out but had 2 treasures that I forgot and used a Boros Charm to get lethal.
Starting hand was ok, no draw engine but great lifegain:
Flooded Strand, Secluded Steppe, Emergence Zone, Soul Warden, Starnheim Aspirant, Angelic Skirmisher, Segovian Angel
T1 Soul Warden netted me a ton of life over the course of the game as Jared & Isshin did not play any board wipes. After playing Angelic Skirmisher as well and a couple angels, I was developing an oppressive board state.
Tevesh/Arminx drew a lot of hate early game because they played a strong ramp turn with a bunch of expensive mana rocks but then durdled for most of the game. Jared played a Two-Headed Hellkite that they pumped to 10/10 and just started swinging. Isshin tried going wide with Adeline, Resplendent Cathar and a few combat tricks but with Soul Warden on the field I ended up always being net positive after thier attacks.
Eventually the board grew massive and any one of us could've knocked out Tevesh/Arminx as they were wide open. I was sitting comfortably at 60+ life due to Soul Warden and Angelic Skirmisher. Tevesh/Arminx ended up playing Ugin, the Spirit Dragon and wiping all our creatures.
We all rebuilt our boards pretty quickly with Tevesh only having Armix, Filigree Thrasher and a couple equipments. Isshin tried going for the combo and knock out 2 of us with Godo, Bandit Warlord & Helm of the Host but misplayed and couldn't equip Godo.
Jared and I knocked out the Isshin player because of the obvious combo but Tevesh/Arminx equipped their commander with Commander's Plate, Cranial Plating, Skullclamp and swung 17 commander damage at Jared. I blew up their Cranial Plating with a Generous Gift and brought them down to lethal. The game ended next turn like dominoes, Arminx killed Jared and I killed Arminx.
Game 3 loss was due to Marneus just having the better plays here. Even if I were able to prevent some of their bigger combos, they could've won off straight value. Removal and threat assessment by the other 2 were pretty light towards Marneus which definitely helped them win.
Game 7 loss was due to 2 players getting mana screwed. After not being able to curve out with Giada it was almost impossible to come back. Top-decking that Winds of Abandon may have helped but they were so far ahead it's doubtful.
Game 9 was a misplay. Playing against the Isshin deck I should've known that there would be combat tricks but I was used to slow battlecruiser decks and not 2 mid-range aggro decks.
Smuggler's Share has been hit or miss. If I'm playing against blue, I'll typically get the draw, if I'm playing against green, I'll get the treasures. However, if the opponents aren't playing either of those colors and/or play smart, they can often get around it and it's a dead enchantment on board. I'm still leaving it in because when it does work, it works very well.
Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx has been great overall. Early game it may not do much but mid to late game it really shines. I usually leave 2 lands and Nykthos up after T5/6 fully expecting a board wipe and using it to activate abilities or crack clues. I'd highly recommend this land over a basic plains.
Crucible of Worlds was a powerhouse in Game 2. Unfortunately I only ever drew it in 1 other game and it was immediately blown up after I used it once. I think it's worth it because if left unchecked provides you tons of ramp and if it draws out a threat then our draw artifacts or equipments live.
Emeria Shepherd is a bomb. 2 games it was instantly blown up because of how big a threat it was. When it was left unanswered, it absolutely carried the game. I think it's a definite swap for Karmic Guide to get that last push end game.
Darksteel Mutation was great the 2 times I used it. I think there's a need for another one-sided board wipe against decks that go wide and have flyers. In game 3 Marneus out angeled the angel deck and we simply didn't have enough token generation to get through.
Folk Hero wasn't mentioned in the gameplay reviews but I did draw and play it a few games. Unfortunately it was played later in the game when I already had other draw engines on board so its impact was minimal. However, it's definitely an improvement over Dawn of Hope as I didn't have to pay mana for the few cards I did draw.
You've mentioned that Avacyn, Angel of Hope deserves a place in this deck and I wholeheartedly agree, mostly because I bought the new borderless version from double masters specifically for this deck. However, her close cousin Sephara, Sky's Blade almost accomplishes the same thing except she only protects creatures. I think the only reason to end up running Avacyn is to lean into the land destruction that she's known for.
Guerric on
[Primer] Helming the Host of Heaven *Update*
2 years ago
I just wanted to respond to a few comments. Thanks for your patience!
True Conviction is a bit of a pet card for me, and I play it in a lot of decks, so its certainly a good suggestion. It's one of those cards that's always better than you expect it to be. The argument against it is that it is mana-intensive to cast and doesn't stick around too long as it is a target for removal. The weakness in this argument is that in decks where it is good you don't need it to stick around. As long as you can resolve it with a decent board, it will most of the time turn the course of the game and sometimes finish other players out of nowhere. It is a great card. I don't run it here because I have angels which do similar things. Sigarda's Vanguard, Lyra Dawnbringer, and Angelic Skirmisher do similar things while also being able to attack themselves and otherwise pump our team. In this deck we need as many angels as possible because we need to goldfish, and that limits our slots for enchantments that don't contribute to this theme. As such, I'm not playing it here, but those who are lacking some of the above angels may wish to. It's certainly good, I just feel in my case I need more synergy.
The Immortal Sun is, in my estimation, a pretty overrated card for most decks. It is at it's best as a hate card against super-friends decks which provides other benefits, so if that's a major thing in one's meta it is certainly worth considering. Aside from that, it does provide substantial benefits of course, serving as premium ramp, card draw, and an anthem to boot. That being said, doing too many things is not really an asset for a 6cmc card. It doesn't do any of these things at the point in the game where we need them (which is well before turn 6), and if we resolve it later, it will likely be removed before it can give us much benefit, leading to wasted turns. Compare that with True Conviction, which can immediately change the course of the game the turn it is cast, even if it is removed afterwards. I thought the card was cool when it first spoiled and I do have a former student who won a tournament because he used it to shut down and Atraxa player, but aside from cases where we are up against a powerful super-friends strategy and are fortunate enough to draw it, I think it just doesn't do enough at the time we need it to do the things it does.
You're welcome! Thanks for the kind words! You certainly can feel free to put fetch lands in. As you said, they would thin the deck. Even better would be to play lots of them with Crucible of Worlds and get all of your lands out! I just personally don't want to invest in fetch lands for that purpose in part because I don't want to spend the money on them and partly because philosophically I don't like playing off-color fetch lands in any deck, even though it currently still remains legal. That being said, if you want to, by all means do it! It will make the deck more powerful, particularly with Crucible.
I'm glad you are enjoying the deck! Too many lists for a deck like this tend to be good-stuff angels, or follow generic deckbuilding guidance that is misapplied here. Synergy is always the way to make a deck more powerful and consistent, and its actually even more important in aggressive decks than in control and combo decks.
In 1v1 I'm not sure this deck has ever lost. It's just very fast, and is hard for only a single opponent to keep under control. I had a colleague play it against me 1v1 while I piloted my best control-combo deck and I lost. As regards removal, if it's one specific deck you have in mind to destroy I can't comment with any authority without playing against that specific deck. I can give some general advice here, however, and that is that you don't want to play as much removal as you think you do. In general the pundits at the command zone would recommend somewhere around 10-12 pieces of targeted removal generally speaking, and by being in mono-white we have access to some of the best removal cards in the history of the game. This might lead us to believe that we should go all out here, but those same pundits would remind us that these are general guidelines don't apply to every deck, and that the deck's overall strategy needs to be weighed in. Though I am a control-combo player at heart I have built many successful aggressive decks here, and played elves pretty extensively in modern, and I can say that in good aggro decks we just can't afford to play too much removal. In order to win and remain viable we need to be able to goldfish very fast while also devoting a lot of space to hoarding cards and other resources to rebuild when we get blown out and play new threats when our current ones get removed. We just don't have the space to put in a lot of removal- if we make said space we'll run out of gas or options. Never forget that one of the best forms of removal is player removal. If we're worried about someone combo-ing off we'll kill them, and our other opponents will thank us for it. We also are happy to let them share some of the burden of removal. If someone is about to win with a combo and we don't have removal but an opponent does, they will certainly use it! We already are helping them out by having the target on our backs much of the time, so it is time for them to do their part. That's not to say that we won't remove things, and the best removal cards in white are indeed in this list! We just have to be willing to have a bit less than other decks since we have other means of dealing with opponents, and since we can't afford to sacrifice resources for more.
wallisface on
Pure Lifegain
2 years ago
Some thoughts
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Most Modern decks typically can't justify running more than 4 cards costing 4-mana, and often run nothing above this. You've got a whopping 16 cards costing 4-or-more, which is going to lead to some really slow/clumsy plays. In particular, all those cards costing 6-or-more mana (Angelic Skirmisher, Devout Invocation, Mass Calcify, Iona, Shield of Emeria) have no chance at all of being cast in a game with your current landbase (You'll have ~50% odds of having 6 lands by turn 9, which is longer than any magic game will take, and also pretty-bad odds). I would suggest just keeping 3-4 of your 4-mana cards, and ditching the rest costing this-or-above.
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Even once you reduce the mana curve, you will still need to play more lands. With 21 lands, your odds of getting 4 into play in any reasonable time is still really poor. I'd suggest going to 23 minimum, but probably 24 is the correct number here.
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A word of warning that lifegain is one of the absolute weakest mechanics in magic, and without some massive payoffs for gaining life, it's never really worth it. I would suggest if you want to pursue a lifegain based deck to use cards like Righteous Valkyrie and Speaker of the Heavens as your build-around cards, as these are some of the very few cards available that make lifegain actually worth playing. An example budget decklist using those cards is here on mtgGoldfish. In any case, I would advise strongly against "gaining life just for the sake of gaining life", as this pretty-much always means your cards aren't doing more productive things, like establishing a stronger board-position, and usually just means the deck sets itself up for failure.
DeinoStinkus on
Heliods army
2 years ago
Alright!
Aegis Angel is a good card, don't get me wrong, but currently given the low number of Angels in the deck as a whole and with no Angel tribal, it might be worth looking into Avacyn, Angel of Hope or, some more budget options, Indestructibility, Gift of Immortality, Kindred Boon, Shielded by Faith, Spirit Bonds, or Timely Ward. All of these grant a single creature indestructible for a lower cost, albeit they are not attached to a big flier.
Nothing for Ajani's Pridemate. It's just a good card. If you're interested in other similar cards, Light of Promise, Archangel of Thune, Gideon's Company, Cleric Class, Heliod, Sun-Crowned, Cradle of Vitality, Celestial Unicorn, and Nykthos Paragon are some good ones.
Archetype of Courage seems a bit weak to me personally. Enchantment creature cards with the same mana value that are white and better for your deck (at least from my POV) include Eidolon of Countless Battles and Heliod, Sun-Crowned.
Banisher Priest is good.
Blinding Souleater could easily be replaced by Law-Rune Enforcer, or, if you'd prefer an artifact creature, Burnished Hart is just better in general.
Captain of the Watch and Cataclysmic Gearhulk are both good cards, though the latter doesn't seem to work too awfully well with your deck. I would consider putting in another destroy boardwipe such as Wrath of God or Fumigate.
Chardalyn Dragon is pretty bad, even for an artifact flier. Other fliers with the same mana value include Adarkar Valkyrie, Admonition Angel, Ancestor Dragon, Angelic Skirmisher, Archon of Coronation, Aven Brigadier, Empyrial Storm, et cetera... white is ton of amazing fliers! Put 'em to good use! XD If you specifically want an artifact creature to replace it, Wurmcoil Engine is a good one.
Consul's Shieldguard... see the Aegis Angel comments.
Court Street Denizen... see the Blinding Souleater comments, though this one is better so it's definitely worth keeping around if you want.
Drillworks Mole is a cool card. Basri Ket, Felidar Retreat, and Cathars' Crusade are good too.
Eldrazi Devastator is actually a card I used to run in my decks as a finisher. I would recommend something like Finale of Glory as an alternative that you can really sink your mana into.
Felidar Cub is nice, but War Priest of Thune is strictly better.
Glint-Sleeve Artisan is interesting, and I see how it plays into a bit of your artifact synergies, but if you want that, just use an artifact creature like Adaptive Automaton, Cloudsteel Kirin, or Etched Champion.
Heliod's Pilgrim has a good effect and it's flavorful, just keep in mind you only have two Auras in the deck.
Inspiring Overseer and Knight of the White Orchid are good.
Kozilek's Channeler is a decent card, but given you like small creatures I'm not sure that paying extra for a big body is a great benefit. Worn Powerstone, Thran Dynamo, Arcane Signet, and if you want to splurge Pearl Medallion are all good ramp in white.
Lagonna-Band Elder can be replaced by one of the cards I told you about in my previous comment.
From there, all your cards are great until Soulmender, which again can be replaced by one of the cards in my previous comment, or even Fountain of Renewal. Same with Stone Haven Medic and Sungrace Pegasus.
Toolcraft Exemplar is a really cool card that I have NEVER seen before. If it's working well for you, you should try out Serra Ascendant as well. It runs in a similar vein.
Welcoming Vampire is good too.
Celestial Flare could be replaced by Silence.
Dauntless Onslaught could be replaced by Charge, Bastion Protector, Benalish Marshal, Ethereal Guidance, Glorious Anthem, Guardians' Pledge, or Path of Bravery.
Divine Verdict could just be replaced by plain removal, like Swords to Plowshares, Path to Exile, Journey to Nowhere, Cast Out, Conclave Tribunal, or Oblivion Ring.
Feat of Resistance is nice.
Gideon's Reproach - see Divine Verdict's feedback.
Gods Willing is good.
Kill Shot - see Divine Verdict's feedback. Actually, for the rest of these cards see that and Dauntless Onslaught's feedback.
Aligned Hedron Network is good.
Cloak of the Bat and Hero's Blade - see Dauntless Onslaught's feedback, but also Commander's Plate.
Spidersilk Net doesn't make a whole lot of sense. If you want another 0-mana artifact, look no further than Mishra's Bauble.
Font of Vigor - see previous comment
Siegecraft - Eldrazi Conscription is one of the best auras in the game, but Battle Mastery is nice too
Not Forgotten - Rest in Peace, Ashnod's Altar
Sunlance - any other removal that I've mentioned
Also consider Sphere of Safety.
I hope all this helps! ^^" it took a bit to write up but I think it'll help introduce you to some staples and ways about thinking about deckbuilding and power level. I sent you a friend request so that we can keep in touch and so that I can see and help you with your future decks!
Guerric on
[Primer] Helming the Host of Heaven *Update*
2 years ago
The first is to not underrate vigilance, which a turn three Thraben Watcher gave to me for the whole of the second game. Some players have rated it as a junk ability, but it's strong when you give it to everyone, and we have several cards that do that. Even before Angelic Skirmisher got me to over 100 life in the second game I was pretty unattackable throughout because of my angelic attacker/defenders.
I also got to play Eye of Vecna for the first time and thought it was great. It immediately replaces itself, and you always have the option to pay the to draw the card since it comes right after untap. It sort of becomes like a Phyrexian Arena that we pay for with mana instead of life loss, which we'll take because we are in white. In the first game I had the mother of all draw cards in Well of Lost Dreams in my hand, but I could never find the free mana to cast it because I was under a clock to put my opponent away. I still think Well is incredibly good, but it makes me nervous about Vanquisher's Banner and reminds me of the importance of low cmc draw pieces.
I also did not like Secret Rendezvous, and will probably replace it with Rogue's Gloves before I play this again. This isn't because I am a detractor from Rendezvous generally, it a less aggressive deck it would be a good political card and welcome white draw piece. It is pretty hard to give cards to anyone in this deck where you will definitely be viewed as a threat. I'm surprised I haven't played Rogue's Gloves earlier. Once equipped it just gets us a free card every turn, and that's what we need. As good equipment becomes more and more relevant here, it makes me wonder if it might not be worth adding Steelshaper's Gift to the deck. At some point I am going to do a tutoring pass on the deck, and that card will be high on the list.
I've also pretty much planned for awhile to replace Eerie Interlude with Guardian of Faith. Interlude doesn't bring your counters back when you use it to save yourself from a boardwipe, whereas Guadian does, making it a superior card in that instance. Nonetheless, in this game I used Interlude to save my Angelic Skirmisher from targeted removal, which felt really good. As I continue to ponder this change it is helpful to remember that while interlude is worse in terms of board wipe protection it is better in terms of having utility to re-order counters if Giada is out, replay ETB creatures, or just protect from targeted removal.
In both games the engine set up well, I was a constant threat, and in the first game he only barely overcame me in the end with some lucky draws and really strong play sequencing. I was excited to play the deck against that friend, who is definitely the strongest player in my play group. As I plan further refining and revisions, I will definitely be prioritizing lowering the cmc of support pieces to two or three cmc as much as possible as I think that is key to success.
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