Plumb the Forbidden

Instant

As an additional cost to cast this spell, you may sacrifice one or more creatures. When you do, copy this spell for each creature sacrificed this way.

You draw a card and you lose 1 life.

Legality

Format	Legality
1v1 Commander	Legal
Alchemy	Legal
Archenemy	Legal
Arena	Legal
Block Constructed	Legal
Canadian Highlander	Legal
Casual	Legal
Commander / EDH	Legal
Commander: Rule 0	Legal
Custom	Legal
Duel Commander	Legal
Gladiator	Legal
Highlander	Legal
Historic	Legal
Historic Brawl	Legal
Legacy	Legal
Leviathan	Legal
Limited	Legal
Modern	Legal
Oathbreaker	Legal
Pioneer	Legal
Planechase	Legal
Pre-release	Legal
Quest Magic	Legal
Standard	Legal
Standard Brawl	Legal
Tiny Leaders	Legal
Vanguard	Legal
Vintage	Legal

Discussion (50)

Last_Laugh on Marchesa the Black Rose - Sacrifices must be made!

1 month ago

Not a bad start, but I do have several suggestions for you. I'll keep things budget friendly and break it down by category.

Finisher: Gray Merchant of Asphodel will end games. With alternate sources of +1+1 counters the lifegain doesn't matter at all. Even with an expensive Marchesa build, this is my #1 go-to finisher.

Alternate +1+1 Counter Sources: Vigean Graftmage is really good here. It comes down before and immediately protects Marchesa and it's 2 free sacs on each player's turn (itself plus 1 other). Sage of Fables likewise immediately protects Marchesa and allows you to abuse any wizard etb/death triggers every turn. Unspeakable Symbol is one you use in response to removal targeting anything without a counter (don't proactively put counters on everyone).

Card Draw: Grim Haruspex is easily your 2nd best draw engine here behind Danny Pink. Liliana's Standard Bearer will draw cards for everything that died the turn Marchesa returns it. Plumb the Forbidden helps you dodge non-destroy wraths (instant speed and pseudo dodging counterspells makes this card). Lethal Scheme helps you surprise protect up to 4 creatures without counters without tapping lands and to remove a creature while drawing some cards.

Enchantment Removal: Cards like Solemnity and Rest in Peace are the bane of Marchesa. Don't get caught with your pants down... Chaos Warp, Feed the Swarm, and Canoptek Tomb Sentinel are your only 3 realistic options and ALL 3 deserve spots.

Feel free to check out my list for ideas, I've had her built for about 9 years straight now so if you have any question, shoot. Upvotes on any of my decks are appreciated (especially Marchesa since it'd be upvote #200 lol). Every Masochist Needs a Marchesa to Love Them

Last_Laugh on Marchesa, the Black Rose

1 month ago

This is a good start, but I have several suggestions for you. I'll keep things budget friendly, break it down by card function, and if you'd like I can help suggest some cuts too.

Enchantment Removal: So you don't get caught with your pants down against effects like Solemnity/Rest in Peace. Feed the Swarm, Chaos Warp, and Canoptek Tomb Sentinel all deserve spots.

Alternate +1+1 Counter Sources: Sage of Fables/Vigean Graftmage come down before and immediately protect Marchesa. Sage let's you abuse any other wizard etb/death triggers every turn and Vigean allows you to abuse any 1 etb/death trigger (itself plus 1 other). Spark Double either copies Marchesa so they protect your board better and give double Dethrone triggers or it copies your best etb/death trigger every turn. Thran Vigil only works on your turn but works wonders here. Anduril, Narsil Reforged/Metallic Mimic are also great options but aren't as budget friendly (just sac Mimic to rename a creature type to whatever is most abuseable the time).

Card Draw: Danny Pink is a little more expensive but is absolutely nuts here. Lethal Scheme is card draw and surprise protection for anything without counters. Plumb the Forbidden in response to most non-destroy wraths will win games.

Feel free to check out my list for ideas. I run the same etb/death trigger abuse strat and have had Marchesa built for about 9 years now so if you have any questions, shoot. Upvotes on any of my decks are appreciated (especially since it'd be upvote #200!). Every Masochist Needs a Marchesa to Love Them

DreadKhan on lonely goth girl

1 month ago

I'm not sure if Teysa would even want a friend, but Michiko Konda, Truth Seeker is a bit of a kindred, maybe they could hang for tea?

If you want people to attack a lot there is Angel's Trumpet, very handy that your Spirits have flying! Exquisite Blood is a combo piece, but it's also a strong card on it's own, it synergizes with your Commander very powerfully I'd say, if people come at you their creature's die, and if they go at each other then you gain life. Breena, the Demagogue can be used to make your stuff better. Shadrix Silverquill has a really good interaction with your Commander, if you give someone an Inkling and they come at you it dies and you get a 1/1, and if you give your board +1 counters twice than your 1/1s clobber inklings. I would run Transmogrifying Wand over Murder, it's 4 mana for the first creature but only 1 more for the next 2. You could also try something like Reckless Spite. I am a big fan of True Conviction, very good with a big token army.

It's a pretty janky card but I often enjoy using Axis of Mortality in White decks that are trying to stay on budget, you can punish or reward people as you see fit, it's a very strong political effect, and if people are losing creatures to your ability to lower your life total (while giving you evasive attackers) then you're probably gaining ground.

It's up to you obviously if you don't want to run more lands, but have you thought about including some MDFCs? I use Hagra Mauling  ^Flip and am happy to see it now and then, ETB tapped lands aren't great, but if the spell effect is also a playable effect their value is incredible. I'm sure you could find a use for Malakir Rebirth  ^Flip too, though that is less budget.

In the time that I've played Commander I've come to the conclusion that one of the hallmarks of a good deck is card draw, especially low to the ground effects. Stuff like Sign in Blood and Night's Whisper are very good in practice, there are also things like Village Rites, Corrupted Conviction, Plumb the Forbidden, and Reckoner's Bargain, these are all handy with your tokens, but also if you can't protect your Commander and they're getting blown up anyways, this can also prevent effects like Oubliette from working (which can be VERY helpful if your deck depends on your Commander, you might want a couple in the deck in case). If you think your tokens might stay 1/1s, or that you can get them to die with consistency then Skullclamp draws a lot of cards. Stinging Study draws a whopping 7 cards in this deck, for only 5 mana, I'd say that'd be handy late game.

Crow_Umbra on Felix Five-Boots - Reach for the Sky (v0.5)

3 months ago

Your mana curve is looking chef's kiss.

Overall, looking more solid since I checked it out yesterday. If you feel like you're now leaning too heavily into the +1/+1 counters theme, it could be helpful to swap a couple of Counters related slots with some more draw like Night's Whisper, Plumb the Forbidden, or just draw slots that aren't dependent on your creatures connecting with combat damage.

Also, if you want to condense your Counter Support slots into quality vs quantity, Railway Brawler could also help in that regard.

Last_Laugh on Marchesa, the Black Rose

3 months ago

I have several suggestions for you. I'll keep things budget friendly and if you're picking up what I'm putting down, I can also help suggest some cuts.

First off is enchantment removal. There's hardly any options in th5ese colors but I recommend running all 3 so problematic enchantments like Solemnity or Rest in Peace don't wreck your day. Chaos Warp, Feed the Swarm, and Canoptek Tomb Sentinel are all budget friendly and worth their weight in gold here. Another good boardwipe here is Last One Standing.

I don't really do theft in my Marchesa list, but Gisa, Glorious Resurrector is the exception and holy crap does she put in some dirty work.

Next is card draw. Liliana's Standard Bearer, Lethal Scheme, Plumb the Forbidden, and Sage of Fables are all good budget options here. Sage will also come down before Marchesa and immediately give her or any other wizards you run a +1+1 counter. Plumb in response to boardwipes or right before your turn will refill your grip (instant speed and pseudo dodging counterspells makes this card). Also, Danny Pink's price has been sloooowly climbing but it's a very real possibility you'll find one in your LGS dollar binder and omg is this thing absolutely nuts!

On the subject of alternate sources of +1+1 counters... Thran Vigil only works on your turn but it'll get new counters on anything you stole and sac'ed on your turn. Vigean Graftmage let's you sac 2 creatures on everyone's turn (itself + whatever) to abuse etb/death triggers like Gray Merchant of Asphodel or even Grim Haruspex card draw. Spark Double I guess falls into this category and copies either Marchesa for double Dethrone or whatever your meanest etb/death trigger is at the time.

I'm also guessing Rakdos Locket was supposed to be Rakdos Signet.

Feel free to check out my list for ideas. It's far from budget friendly overall but I run everything I recommended. Upvotes on any of my decks are appreciated. Every Masochist Needs a Marchesa to Love Them

RufusTheGrufus on Gonna Need A (Myrkul)

3 months ago

Okay, Necramus, as promised here are some 'spicy' suggestions for you to think about:

-Yawgmoth, Thran Physician: A creature-based sac outlet, source of card draw, and a way to incrementally whittle down opponent's creatures; I really like Yawgmoth in Myrkul personally.

-Similarly, while I see you are running Viscera Seer, you may also benefit from running other creature-based sac outlets such as Yahenni, Undying Partisan or Carrion Feeder. Fanatical Devotion is another interesting sac outlet I've considered running but haven't taken the time to playtest yet.

-Syr Konrad, the Grim: triggers twice, once when your creatures die, and also when you exile them to make enchantment tokens with Myrkul.

-Ondu Spiritdancer: With Myrkul, Lord of Bones and Grim Guardian on the battlefield, playing Ondu Spiritdancer and finding a way to kill it will infinitely ping all opponents to close out the game.

-Tyrite Sanctum: Offers a backup way to give Myrkul indestructible

-Windborn Muse: Build-your-own Ghostly Prison on a creature with Myrkul

-Loxodon Gatekeeper: Build-your-own Kismet on a creature with Myrkul

-Stinging Study: offers a big burst of card draw while also lowering your life total to make Myrkul indestructible.

-Options like Plumb the Forbidden and Deadly Dispute could be fun to both sacrifice creatures to turn into enchantments with Myrkul as well as generate card advantage.

In my tinkering around with Myrkul I can definitely relate to wishing that you could run more than 100 cards; I had the same problem with both Myrkul and Anikthea! They're both pretty open ended and also lean into super supported strategies, (enchantments, graveyards, tokens), so there's an over abundance of fun cards to build with; and ultimately I just ended up messing around with multiple builds for both of them. Overall I think your deck looks like a lot of fun to play, +1 from me!

Case42 on Hail Caesar, Emperor of the Mojave Wasteland

3 months ago

Lagomos, Hand of Hatred is a wonderful enabler for Caesar, as well as a tutor once you have enough creatures dying.

I would also personally try to include some more card draw. I've been tweaking and tuning my own version of Caesar, which focuses far more on the Aristocrats side, but the number one thing I've been trimming cards for is more card draw.

Deadly Dispute and Plumb the Forbidden are both great as you can just toss a token to them.

Dawn of a New Age is solid if you consistently maintain a large board state.

Final suggestion would be a Hall of Heliod's Generosity because of how impactful your enchantments can be.

Last_Laugh on Better Ingredients, Better Vampires, Papa Eddie's

4 months ago

I have a few suggestions for ya, but not a bad start.

Reconnaissance is worth its' weight in gold here. If you're unfamiliar with the card I suggest looking it up, it's pretty busted if you know what you're doing. Long story short is attack with EVERYONE safely, deal combat damage in most situations, and untap each creature at the most opportune time (including after combat damage is dealt... both 1st strike and normal) so everyone is untapped by the end of combat.

Purphoros, God of the Forge makes it so every vamp you cast domes each opponent for 4. It also lets you run Scapegoat as a finisher instead of just as 1 mana answer to wraths (trust me when I say bouncing all your stuff back to hand is 100% worth it in response to wraths so you actually have a grip full of cards to redeploy and get eminence triggers again).

On the subject of protection, this is probably the most important support type for aggro decks and there's zero of them in the deck. Don't get caught with your pants down or that is a miserable game where you end up with no hand topdecking cards until you lose. Teferi's Protection, Clever Concealment, Boros Charm, Flawless Maneuver, and I also lump Plumb the Forbidden in this section (same logic as Scapegoat). Seriously, run them ALL... unless your meta has like 0 removal you won't regret it.

Let me know if you're picking up what I'm putting down, I have more suggestions and/or help with cuts if you want it. Also, feel free to check out my list for inspiration. Upvotes on any of my decks are appreciated. Edgar's Dega Vampires