|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Eternal Masters (EMA)||Rare|
|Commander 2013 (C13)||Rare|
Combos Browse all
As an additional cost to cast Toxic Deluge, pay X life.
All creatures get -X/-X until end of turn.
|Have (4)||rockleemyhero , brokendwarf , Lucan2000 ,|
|Want (12)||achrist , tr33s , kridily , FancyKilerWales , Blizzaxe , Nerd_253 , Phantomvert , C-4567 , nursejason , professorPleb , rakshasa86 , Zerxes_WolfHawk|
Toxic Deluge Discussion
1 day ago
Lets look at what we should be adding,
I'd remove Revel in Riches . You really do want to be able to play that at flash speed to get your value from it.
Phyrexian Arena There is better card draw you can get.
Ghostly Prison With death triggers there are ways to remove your opponents creatures rather then worry about making them pay 2 mana per to attack.
Sword of the Animist . Only good if you are attacking a lot.
Skullclamp That one can go either way. I opted to remove it from my build. I found better options.
Thrilling Encore If done right you won't need your opponents creatures.
3 days ago
I am a little confused as to your choices of Planeswalkers, and also why you have so few mass removal and protective spells and evasion & recursion...? Heroic Intervention , Thassa, God of the Sea , Cyclonic Rift , Toxic Deluge , Swan Song , Negate ....?
I get the Proliferate antics, but without getting in some infect damage, it virtually does nothing. It just feels a little fragile to me and feels like you need ways to combat the more controlling decks and also the decks that can easily provide chumps in the way of your combat damage. I do like the amount of card draw. And the proliferate strategy can work, I just don't know if going ALL IN without having some ways to interact with the stack and a massive boardstate is making this 100%.
Infect is nasty though! GG's.
6 days ago
As far as budget alternatives, here are my suggestions:
Damnation and Toxic Deluge : these are hard to replace because we don't have too many options that do what they do for the same mana cost. You could consider something like AEtherize or Whelming Wave .
Force of Will , on the other hand, is very hard to replace. Whatever you choose to include instead of it won't be the same. You want Will because you can tap out and still have a response, therefore something like Arcane Denial would be suboptimal. At the same time, another "free" counterspell like Foil won't be ideal because it rips two cards from your hand instead of one. The only decent option, I think, would be Pact of Negation , even though it's more useful as a protection for game-winning combos instead of player-OTKs.
Intuition is another card that is incredibly hard to replace, as it's one of the 2/3 best cards in the deck. You could go with a Corpse Connoisseur , but I recommend you to get a copy as soon as possible if you enjoy the deck as it is one of the best upgrades you can make.
Phyrexian Dreadnought , unfortunately, cannot be replaced. It's the key card of the deck. No other creature is that powerful for such a low CMC. Nyxathid and Eater of Days are a few options, but they pale in comparison with the Dreadnought.
As for your suggestions, I kind of like Archmage's Charm for the utility of its second mode. The only problem I have with it is its mana cost which can sometimes be awkward, making the spell not always consistent. I don't really like Dimir Charm . It's first mode is rarely useful as oftentimes we want to counter removal spells directed to Lazav during our turn, and those are almost always instants. The second and third modes are okayish, but other spells do the same things better. I do get that this is a versatile spell, giving you the option to do three different things, but I believe that dedicated spells will serve you better. If the first mode gave you the option to counter an instant spell I would consider it, but as is it's not ideal. Also, I'm not a huge fan of Force of Negation in this deck. The moment you want to be able to counter spells is often during your turn, when you are trying to kill a player and that player is trying to disrupt you. In that case, Force will be useless as it won't be free. On the other hand, it's also true that if you manage to kill an opponent, chances are you are forced to tap out. This leaves you vulnerable to disruption during the other players turns, and in this case Force will come in handy. I don't know. I'm not fully convinced, but I could change my mind.
I will be checking your own deck and give you some feedback!
1 week ago
Recently I challenged a guy (who obviously knew edric is banned in duel but accepted) to a first to 2 duel. His was The Scarab God . G1 I opened with 3 lands and merfolk. On my opp's turn 2 he blew up my BP with Wasteland . I failed to draw 3rd land and had to cast Noxious Revival on my upkeep, which was countered. By the time I could cast Edric it had already been too late; opp cleared w Toxic Deluge and I couldn't outrace his cmdr. G2 opp started with Sol Ring and Seized my Dispel . I began with Dryad Arbor , cast Edric and drew a couple cards. Then, opp cast Vampiric Tutor and Baleful Strix . I drew a couple more and held up Flusterstorm , hoping to chain my turns shortly after. The next thing I knew, opp summoned Massacre Girl . I guess the land count and the Curiosity strategy did hurt.
1 week ago
Massacre is low key one of the best board wipes vs my cEDH deck. It doesn't kill your anje, you cast it for free(fairly often), you clear up all dorks and hatebears, and best of all it is a budget card.
Pithing Needle , Damping Sphere , Cursed Totem and Nihil Spellbomb are all good for karn if you can't play lattice (not enough mana or lattice has already been countered ect.) They each also stop a different strat than one another.
I disagree with a few of your choices simply based off the fact that some of the ones you chose to stop relevant things my deck does, don't fully stop my deck andare usually too high of mana cost to be relevant in time. The one I am comparing to again is cEDH, so take my suggestions knowing the speed of your current meta and decide if my points are relevant in your playgroup.
Ob Nixilis, Unshackled - I will willingly pay 30 life to tutor my combo for the win.
Painful Quandary - is a high mana cost to try and stop combo imo. Many combos can go off before this hits board, through only casting a couple spells, or using this cards discard as an outlet for reanimation. My deck happens to do all of these things.
In Garruk's Wake - is an absurdly high mana cost for a board wipe. Sure, your stuff lives, but at what cost sometimes? It is better to have a cheap way to nuke the board when you absolutely need such as Blasphemous Act , Toxic Deluge , or Massacre .
Whip of Erebos - I don't hate this card by any means, I just feel like the sideboard should be more for toolboxing to prevent another player's win con than for something like lifegain. This is 100% a meta call though, because if your group is very aggro this makes more sense to me.
Hopefully this helps in some way and is not just a wall of text.
1 week ago
What I suspect is going on is that your opponents are doing a lot on the aggro front. There're a few ways you can deal with this.
First, you can discourage your opponents from attacking you. Propaganda is probably the best-known card for this, but there're plenty of others. No Mercy comes to mind -- it was one of my favorite cards when I was a kid. Crawlspace and Silent Arbiter are good ways to limit the number of attackers an opponent can pressure you with, and assuming no trample, you likely can just chump away whatever they're hitting you with. Finally, Meekstone will keep the most dangerous ones tapped. I think any of these will probably be better than AEtherize , especially since none of them are 'single use.'
You also seem to be light on wrath effects. Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow ninjutsu ability gets around commander tax, meaning he'll really only ever cost to put down -- so feel totally free to wrath with him on the board. Kindred Dominance strikes me as being way too much mana to do real damage in the earlier stages of the game, especially if you're fighting a bunch of aggro decks. Damnation is, I think, preferable here, as are Toxic Deluge and Cyclonic Rift . Damnation and Toxic Deluge being four and three mana, respectively, means you can conceivably cast them before you're getting smacked but while your opponent has a summoning-sick army. Cyclonic Rift 's overload ability IS seven mana, but being instant speed makes up for that (at least in my opinion).
If you include wrath effects, non-creature token producers are worth including -- they'll give you creatures to 'return' with Yuriko's ability while surviving the wrath themselves. Bitterblossom is the best here, though like most good cards, it's relatively expensive. Other options include Breeding Pit , Graf Harvest (if you wrath Yuriko to the 'yard, you can exile him to the command zone to create a token, then ninjutsu him out on the token when it attacks), Spawning Pit and Volrath's Laboratory (which can make ninjas).
If you decide to run some of the above cards, they should replace your one-for-one removal cards. In general, EDH games will have you facing three opponents, and therefore three times the number of cards you have. You therefore want cards that will effect more than a single card your opponent has. Hero's Downfall and Grasp of Darkness may be great in one-on-one formats, but in EDH they simply don't pack enough punch. (One interesting exception to the 'limit your one-for-ones' rule is the inclusion of counter magic. In general, I think of counterspells in EDH as more than one-for-ones, since A) they can save more than one of your cards if you counter something like By Force or Fire Covenant , and B) they can stop combos cold, making your opponent waste all the combo pieces s/he/they cast before the countered card.)
I have some non-combat related suggestions, too -- I hope I'm not being presumptuous in offering them:
I'm sure you've noticed how awesome your Treasure Cruise is: being eight on a Yuriko flip but often costing around two or three mana at most to cast is pretty busted. There're other delve cards to consider, though I do think it is likely more than one or two in a list will occasionally cause issues when delve gets in its own way. Dig Through Time is a primary candidate here, as it is also eight mana, but it also happens to be an instant (yay!). Temporal Trespass also comes to mind.
In magic, there're a bunch of alternate casting-cost cards that work well with your general, as their CMC is usually pretty high. Unfortunately, some of them are expensive -- I'll just mention them, in case you have more money to blow than I typically do: Force of Will and Commandeer . Spinning Darkness , Gush and Misdirection are all more affordable and alright cards in their own right, though they are significantly less powerful.
Nexus of Fate is a pet card of mine, and I think it'd be genuinely good here. It hits for seven, but doesn't 'really' make you tap out since if it resolves you get another untap step right away.
A creature to consider is Baleful Strix . Having deathtouch and flying make it really hard to block, and if you keep ninjutsu-ing it back to your hand you can keep casting it for the draw trigger.
Top-deck manipulation is a good way to make sure your general hits his hardest, and your Brainstorm is a good start. Mystical Tutor isn't too much money, though the black version, Vampiric Tutor , definitely is a lot of money nowadays. Scheming Symmetry is an alright replacement, though you'll want to be sure to kill the opponent who searches, or at least remove his top card. Though they're pricey, Sensei's Divining Top and Jace, the Mind Sculptor really are the best ways to mess with your top few cards in the game; Jace has the added bonus, like Brainstorm , of being able to top cards that you want to reveal with Yuriko's trigger again. Dream Cache and Telling Time are both OK top deck manipulation.
Cantrips are good. I suggest running Preordain in addition to your Ponder and Brainstorm . It's not as good as the two you have (in this deck), since it can only leave one card on top of your deck for Yuriko triggers, but I still think it's worth playing. As a turn one play, it's gonna be hard to beat. (Of course, Ponder does still beat it.)
Finally, mass card-draw is a good thing. Even if it doesn't trigger Yuriko, having spells to cast is always preferable to not having them (exception: Mindslaver ). Windfall is excellent, especially if you put in Narset, Parter of Veils (I think you should). Fact or Fiction and Chemister's Insight are both good instant-speed draw spells.
Only good things! Hope this helped.
1 week ago
Hey man! Grixis is fun. I've got some thoughts... feel free to ignore any/all of them.
Your mana base is better than most, but it can still use some work. Consider City of Brass and Mana Confluence . Paying one life for an ETB untapped, chromatic land to generate mana is a great rate, and these two are functionally a second and third command tower. Generally, the one life cost-to-activate is irrelevant.
Similar to your land-base, mana rocks are a great way to hit your colors and ramp yourself faster than your opponents. Since you don't have access to dorks, you need to consider more two-mana mana-rocks; these are, in my experience, vastly superior to three-mana rocks. Consider running a few of the following: Talisman of Indulgence , Talisman of Dominance , Talisman of Creativity , Fellwar Stone , Arcane Signet , Mind Stone , Prismatic Lens and/or Coldsteel Heart . The diamonds ( Sky Diamond , Charcoal Diamond and Fire Diamond ) are really just worse Coldsteel Heart s. If you wanna go and bust the bank, Grixis decks often have the critical mass of artifacts necessary to make Mox Opal good; Mox Diamond and Chrome Mox are also great. Also Mana Crypt .
In general, one-for-ones like Hero's Downfall and Dreadbore are not going to be powerful enough in a format like EDH. You have three times as many opponents, meaning you're facing approximately three times the number of cards you yourself have available. So you're probably going to want to be able to remove multiple threats with one card -- this is part of the reason Wrath effects are so good. I like that you're running Damnation ; consider Toxic Deluge as another, similar effect that dodges Gaddock Teeg 's restrictions. I've always been a big fan of By Force as mass artifact removal, and Cyclonic Rift is always worth including. Finally, Fire Covenant is a great piece of mass spot removal.
One card especially good with Cyclonic Rift is Windfall . Pairing Windfall with a Narset, Parter of Veils (which I think you should definitely run) leads to instant fun. More generally, mass, repeatable card-draw and/or selection is a great thing in EDH and decides most games. Phyrexian Arena is probably the most common way to generate card-advantage in black, but also consider Graveborn Muse , Treasure Cruise or Dig Through Time (I don't recommend both, as delve can get in its own way), Fact or Fiction , Painful Truths (which is quickly becoming one of my favorite cards), Faithless Looting , Dack Fayden and the like.
Adding more cards to your counter package seems like a plausible route for improvement. If budget is no object, Mana Drain and Force of Will are the two best counters available. Also consider Force of Negation , which is excellent against combo decks, Dispel , which is great against Ad Nauseam decks, Pyroblast , which is good usually against at least one or two of your opponents and (on the off chance you run Dack Fayden and ult him) can steal a permanent, Flusterstorm , Spell Snare , Spell Pierce and other such cheap 'n efficient counter spells. If you want to go REALLY deep, I've found Counterbalance to be a high variance EDH card that tends to be good more often than not; you're already running Sensei's Divining Top , which is what really makes Counterbalance busted.
Lore-wise, Nicol Bolas is good at enrapturing and manipulating other, lesser creatures. Consider a Mr. Steal-yo-Gurl package, which is both flavorful and powerful. Sower of Temptation and Control Magic can both make opposing Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre s into your own threats; Bribery is similarly busted, and does not risk getting removed by a Toxic Deluge or (more likely) Nature's Claim . Also consider Treachery and Corrupted Conscience .
Since you're in blue, you have access to the best cantrips in magic. I highly, highly recommend running Ponder and Preordain -- These two don't look like much, but they'll dig you to what you need and past what you don't more efficiently than any other card. Brainstorm is also good, but I'd suggest holding off adding it until you get some more fetch lands in your deck. (Fetch lands' shuffle effect will make sure you don't get stuck with two dead cards on top of your deck.) Prismatic Vista and the off-color fetches like Flooded Strand or Verdant Catacombs are good ways to fill this role.
Your general has built-in discard. Another package to consider, therefore, is a Waste Not package. This is a relatively unique package in that it actually does not need the namesake card in order to be good; Raven's Crime , Words of Waste and Syphon Mind are all good in their own right, and made busted when Waste Not is on the field. Stick a Geth's Grimoire in the mix, and you can really go to town (especially with Words of Waste ).
Finally, as a kinda fun-z last suggestion, there's a 'Words' combo I've always liked that you may find interesting -- remember, though, it's really not the best. If you pair Words of Wind with Baleful Strix and a lot of mana, you can repeatedly return Baleful Strix to your hand with Words of Wind 's ability and make your opponents keep returning permanents. This would likely work best if your Omniscience was on the field, as it would end up effectively reading: ': Each opponent returns X permanents they control to their owners' hands.' However, this is likely a win-more type of thing.
There're some cards I think you should consider cutting in order to make room for my above suggestions. Wasp of the Bitter End strikes me as likely too weak in a format with three opponents; similarly, since Toll of the Invasion only hits one opponent, this should likely be considered on the chopping block. I think a boardwipe like Toxic Deluge is probably a lot better than Tyrant's Scorn . Lazotep Plating is probably worse than a regular hard counter. Finally, if you like the idea of artifact-based ramp in (2), thirty-eight lands is too many. I recommend cutting three to five, depending on how aggressively ramp-heavy you want your deck to play.
Right. That's all I got. Good luck!
1 week ago
Toxic Deluge instead of Black Sun's Zenith . You also wanna add a Chromatic Lantern for some super nice color fixing! Cyclonic Rift is always a great blue card. You also dont have very many green ramp cards. you could do mana dorks Arbor Elf or spells like Farseek . Drawing cards is also always good Rhystic Study is nice. Thassa, God of the Sea is a great way to make things unblockable.
Toxic Deluge occurrence in decks from the last year
All decks: 0.2%
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.11%
UB (Dimir): 1.0%
WB (Orzhov): 0.46%
WUB (Esper): 0.73%
UBR (Grixis): 0.71%
BUG (Sultai): 0.74%