|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Duel Decks: Blessed vs. Cursed (DDQ)||Common|
|Avacyn Restored (AVR)||Common|
Combos Browse all
Creature — Zombie
Undying (When this creature dies, if it had no +1/+1 counter on it, return it to the battlefield under its owner's control with a +1/+1 counter on it.)
Butcher Ghoul Discussion
3 weeks ago
Since this is a budget list, I'll list some budget recommendations. Cool? Cool, let's do this
Corpse Knight should be in. He's half of Zulaport Cutthroat but for half the work- you put the tokens in, they just lose life, no need to sacrifice anything (so you can maintain a board state while being doubly threatening). This is one of my favorite new cards so I'd recommend you add this in on either of your lists. It's half the cost of Poison Tip Archer, for example, so that could be a straight upgrade for this slot.
Generous Patron is very, very good. 1 mana = 1 card draw by sacrificing a creature token is huge.
Retribution of the Ancients is better than Phyrexian Swarmlord.
Geralf's Messenger makes an infinite combo with Ashnod's Altar and Ghave that kills all of your opponents. Any Undying creature + Ashnod's Altar + Ghave = Infinite creatures at minimum, so I'd recommend Butcher Ghoul , Young Wolf , and Geralf's Messenger . They're overtly good counters sources assuming you have a sac outlet (1 mana = 1 token is good), but go infinite at the drop of a hat. That's better than Verdant Force, Avenger of Zendikar, and Vindictive Lich, as it forwards your gameplan faster.
You don't need Mana Geode. Sakura-Tribe Elder is one mana cheaper and grabs any basic, so I'd recommend that.
No Cathars' Crusade seems odd. It goes infinite with Devoted Druid and Ghave, but it also gives counters everywhere and makes you threatening even when not in an infinite combo.
That's all I've got for now. Hope this helps!
1 month ago
This is very similar to a deck I worked on with someone else https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/16-06-19-gb-undying/. It is a very cool deck and I never thought of running hapatra, seems sweet as a controlling draw combo. Just those 2 cards together make me excited about this deck again, partly because this interraction doesnt use the graveyard. Although this deck is very super sweet, in testing with the deck I made, there needs to be a different approach or better undying creatures printed for the deck to be really good. I strongly suggest you play Retribution of the Ancients , I have a full explanation of why on my deck description. also with undying creatures, it is nice to upgrade them and just swing in, so I recommend some combination of Viscera Seer and Carrion Feeder . those in conjunction with retribution let you machine gun creatures down. also I noticed you dont have Strangleroot Geist , Id replace your Butcher Ghoul with them. Anyways, cool deck! +1
2 months ago
I love the idea of Extraplanar Lens honestly! I am just at a loss of what to cut for it, the list feels real tight as is, I don't really want to lower my creature count much more. But I am thinking Midnight Banshee is a wee bit slow, even though it is free counters... It is still 6 mana, perhaps it can go.
I REALLY want to make room for Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed , seeing as how I have multiple ways to bring him back, and he can bring back virtually ANY card outside of artifacts in this deck. (I guess not the devoid guys, but still.) A way to recur my high threat enchantments would always be useful.
Anyone have any other suggestions? I was considering one more undying creature to potentially go infinite with Geralf's Messenger . Sadly the only card I can think of is Butcher Ghoul which is really mediocre outside of the infinite combo with Geralf's Messenger . Maybe I don't need it as I do have a few ways of creating tokens from things dying. Any thoughts on this?
2 months ago
Hey! Saw your deck posted before FLATSO99's and thought I'd comment since I also play Ghave.
First off I assume your goal with this deck is to play "fair" with a go-wide tokens and counters strategy with some options to win with a combo, but I'd like to offer my primer for you to take a look at and borrow anything you like. I go into detail the different combos you can get from Ghave and how they work as well as a list of combos found in my list.
Commander / EDH
SCORE: 230 | 145 COMMENTS | 24346 VIEWS | IN 97 FOLDERS
That being said, I have a few suggestions for how you can strengthen the deck even if you're not looking to combo off as soon as you can.
Your mana curve is a bit high, and I think you can cut some of the more mana-heavy cards to trim the deck and let it play more smoothly. For instance I see Butcher of Malakir but no Dictate of Erebos or Grave Pact . I understand if it's a budget problem, but I personally run Grave Pact thanks to it's lower cmc. Yes, Martyr's Bond does the same thing and even extends to permanents other than creatures, but I find it's not worth the mana cost. You could probably cut that one, too.
I know you mentioned Walking Ballista , and I eventually cut Triskelion in my own deck for it. It only needs an extra card (either a sac outlet or Blood Artist effect) to combo with Mikaeus, the Unhallowed which will still often be cheaper on the mana to cast than just Triskelion .
Unless you're building the deck around it, I'd cut anything with Landfall. It's almost never worth it if you're not making it a big theme in your deck.
I'm not a fan of Faerie Macabre . There are better cards for graveyard hate. Bojuka Bog comes to mind which you should run if you really need the grave hate. If you're insistent on having a spell fill that slot, Shred Memory is better as it also acts as a tutor for a 2 cmc card.
Pack Rat is unnecessary. I'd focus on the saproling tokens. You'll have better synergy in the deck that way.
I also don't think you're running enough elves to get the most out of Elvish Archdruid . I'd cut that in favor of other ramp. The ramp you have in the deck already is pretty good without him.
I notice you have Kitchen Finks which is an excellent combo piece, but have you considered running any undying creatures (besides the effect of Mikaeus, the Unhallowed )? I highly recommend Young Wolf as he's an easy route to getting as many tokens as you want. Strangleroot Geist or Butcher Ghoul can also be good. You could run more persist creatures if you like as well. I've liked having Puppeteer Clique and Woodfall Primus in my deck since if you can recur them over and over, you get some awesome effects. If you want cheap ones to play, Safehold Elite is a possibility, and Modern Masters now has Putrid Goblin which is basically Butcher Ghoul but with persist instead of undying.
Protean Hulk has been the center of most of my wins. Pattern of Rebirth is a quick way to cheat him out, but you should consider Natural Order as well since it gets the hulk out just as quickly. I see Karmic Guide , but I don't see Reveillark or Saffi Eriksdotter . I would highly recommend running at least one if not both of them. They create an endless recursion combo that lets you get everything back from your graveyard or trigger a Blood Artist effect to kill the table. Now I assume you use Leonin Relic-Warder with Karmic to go infinite. That's good, but I still say having the recursion availability to access your graveyard is a big advantage.
Anyway sorry for the super long comment. I just really like Ghave and wanted to leave some constructive criticism to help you with your deck. I generally prefer that kind of feedback myself. Hopefully this helps.
2 months ago
Hmm...what's the gameplan here with this deck? It seems all over the place, but I'm going to guess it's a mill deck with some pillow fort shenanigans in it.
30 lands seems a bit low for a deck with an average CMC of 3.6. I'd suggest bumping up the land count to at least 34! Consider taking out Isochron Scepter (it can only imprint 4 instants in your deck, and without Dramatic Reversal the Scepter is kind of underwhelming in my opinion), Syphon Soul , Clear the Mind , and Butcher Ghoul to get up to 34 lands.
Hope this helps!
2 months ago
take out Astral Cornucopia , Butcher Ghoul , Sign in Blood , Sightless Ghoul , Sengir Autocrat , Grim Haruspex , Animate Dead , and Orzhov Enforcer , you have a lot of card drawing already, and more bringing back things from the grave in masses rather than 1 by 1 put in Living Death , Key to the City , Agent of Erebos , Lord of the Void , Yahenni, Undying Partisan , Gonti, Lord of Luxury , Dictate of Erebos , and Carrion Feeder Dictate of Erebos is worth it, it will not only l=allow you to sac creatures and make theirs die but pull out counters, and other things, the real goal is to win, and with more demons on the field and Liliana's Contract you are more likely to get your win con, and if not you have back up options to get other ways to win
3 months ago
With the new War of The Spark set I think I found some options that makes this deck better. -1 Flayer of the Hatebound even though I only made this deck because of this card. I realize it's not a very good card due it's mana cost. Hurt my feelings but I still kept 1 for fringe top end plays. -2 Butcher Ghoul I needed room for +3 Dreadhorde Butcher I feel as if this card is better in pretty much every way accept for eating removal. It will help apply pressure faster and can be used as removal itself. -4 Fling +4 Heartfire this card will be better than Fling in every situation except for use on a 5 power Flayer of the Hatebound so I swapped them.
7 months ago
Oh yeah, you’re right. Thanks for the correction. It still results in the same outcome, but having the correct ruling for why is important. I’ll go back and fix that later.
Thanks for the praise! There really wasn’t a good explanation anywhere for Ghave’s possible combos and how they worked, so I decided to write one myself. I actually want to go back and rework the Combo Explanations section and make sure I’ve covered every kind of combo (but not every possible substitute combination because that would be ridiculous). I put a lot of value on aesthetics, so hopefully the Primer is pleasant to look at and easy to follow.
Your card suggestions are good, but consider what I would have to cut to include any of them. I’m going for efficiency, so a card would have to have more potential uses than what it’s replacing to merit a spot. I like Corpsejack Menace even though Doubling Season does his job and more. The question is how many combos does it allow, and can it replace something that has fewer so as to increase the deck’s combo synergy?
Butcher Ghoul has been considered before. In fact it was part of the list at one point, though I don’t remember what replaced it. Again the question is whether another undying creature would benefit the deck more than what is already in the mainboard.
Dictate of Erebos used to be beside Grave Pact and was removed for more ways to abuse the combos. Hardened Scales would be good if I can justify a cut, but I’m not feeling Requiem Angel . The cost is a bit high for what it does, and I don’t see it benefitting the deck as much as my current combo abusers.
Seriously, though, thanks for the kind words. That you said it’s the best you’ve seen means a lot!
Butcher Ghoul occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.0%