Front:Liliana, Heretical Healer Flip
|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Magic Origins||Mythic Rare|
Combos Browse all
- Does Liliana, Defiant Necromancer's emblem bring back enchantments effected by Starfield of Nyx?
- Athreos and the Flip Planeswalkers
- Flameshadow Conjuring And flip cards.
- Flip Planeswalkers in creature form in graveyard and taking control of them
- How to handle each player controlling a Liliana, Defiant Necromancer emblem?
Liliana, Defiant Necromancer
Planeswalker — Liliana
+2: Each player discards a card.
-X: Return target nonlegendary creature card with converted mana cost X from your graveyard to the battlefield.
-8: You get an emblem with "Whenever a creature dies, return it to the battlefield under your control at the beginning of the next end step."
Liliana, Defiant Necromancer Discussion
2 weeks ago
The command zone is not the battlefield. Abilities of permanents do not normally function there, unless the either specifically say so (like Derevi, Empyrial Tactician) or effect how you cast spells (like Akroma, Angel of Fury). With Liliana, Heretical Healer Flip, if she's on the battlefield and another creature you control dies, her ability will trigger and tell you to exile it. You may choose to either exile it or put it in your command zone, but either way it will return to the battlefield as the result of the same ability. Under no circumstance can Liliana, Defiant Necromancer Flip be in your command zone, as sending it there as a planeswalker will just turn it face up again. Even if it could be a planeswalker there, you would not be able to use any of its abilities, as it wouldn't be a permanent, and you wouldn't be able to cast it, because it wouldn't have a casting cost. Nothing can target a card in the command zone, but the only thing you'd be able to do with it anyways would be cast it, so that's not a huge issue.
If your commander would be put into your hand, you may choose to put it in the command zone instead, but you usually shouldn't. The commander tax only applies based on how many times you've cast it from the command zone, and only applies when casting it from there, so casting it from your hand avoids the tax entirely. If you cast it from your hand nothing special happens, you won't have to send it back the the command zone or anything odd. Command tax acts as a normal additional cost, and standard cost reduction can be applied to it. If you've already cast Geist of Saint Traft twice and control an Urza's Incubator set to spirit and a Conduit of Ruin, casting Traft from the command zone will cost as long as it's your first creature spell for the turn.
1 month ago
The creature in your example won't get returned. If an effect is trying to do something to an object after it changes zones, it will look for the object in the first zone it moved to. The effect will lose track of the object if something else causes it to move out of that zone.
In your example, the creature goes to the graveyard and triggers both Diabolic Servitude and the emblem from Liliana, Defiant Necromancer Flip. The Servitude trigger moves the creature from the graveyard to exile. At the beginning of the next end step, the delayed trigger created by Liliana's trigger will try to find the creature in the graveyard, but it's gone. The delayed trigger will do nothing when it resolves.
603.6c Leaves-the-battlefield abilities trigger when a permanent moves from the battlefield to another zone, or when a phased-in permanent leaves the game because its owner leaves the game. These are written as, but aren't limited to, "When [this object] leaves the battlefield, . . ." or "Whenever [something] is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, . . . ." (See also rule 603.10.) An ability that attempts to do something to the card that left the battlefield checks for it only in the first zone that it went to. An ability that triggers when a card is put into a certain zone "from anywhere" is never treated as a leaves-the battlefield ability, even if an object is put into that zone from the battlefield.
1 month ago
Does Liliana, Defiant Necromancer Flip's emblem make a creature that was returned with Diabolic Servitude return at the end of the turn? I know it wouldn't with Whip of Erebos because it replaces the death with exile.
1 month ago
My List. You can check this out for ideas.
A few recommendations I've got would be:
- Remove a few lands. 36-38 would be better. Also, try to use as many lands that can sac themselves as you can.
- Remove cards that don't synergize with your theme. i.e. Eldrazi Conscription. Sure It can enchant a creature and do work, but I'd rather use something like It That Betrays for permanent stealing and because you can reanimate it.
- Speaking of reanimation effects, I'd consider Liliana, Defiant Necromancer Flip, and Ever After. Living Death could also be strong.
- Not reanimation, but Eternal Witness should be in here to reuse reanimation effects and other cards in general. Greenwarden of Murasa and Skullwinder would also work here.
Just a few suggestions I've got. Just remember to keep #2 in mind. Try to have as much synergy as possible.
1 month ago
3 months ago
Hi WhisperingBlade, thanks for the comment. Although hand attack is one of the most powerful things black has to offer, there wasn't really a spot for it in this build. Turn 1 is committed to AEther Vial or other 1 drops and hand attack spells get increasingly worse as the game goes on. I needed to reserve most of the space in this deck for creatures, and the rest had to be committed to removal. I do indeed run a greedy mana base and it can cause problems every so often. The reason I do is because AEther Vial allows me to cheat on mana and Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx capitalizes on, and amplifies this effect. Sometimes I tap into Nykthos, play another, and tap into it again which allows me to dump my hand or combo off with certain cards. I run two Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth because getting 3-4 black mana can sometimes be challenging with Arena and Nykthos. As you mentioned, extra copies can get tossed by Liliana, Defiant Necromancer Flip and Cryptbreaker but perhaps dropping down a copy of each for some basics is the right move as it reduces the chances of me getting mana screwed and makes Blood Moon less devastating. Garza's Assassin is one of my favorite cards in this deck (I'll have to update the description). AEther Vial can essentially make him a Slaughter Pact with no upkeep cost. His 3B devotion is great, and he really just provides insurance on the board. Against aggressive decks it's nice to be able to block one attacking creature and blow up another, and he's another way to trigger Liliana, Heretical Healer Flip. His recover ability I honestly don't use much, but there have been times when it was useful. Splashing green just seemed like the most logical choice. This deck started as purely mono-black and I've played around with other colors like red for Lightning Bolt and Terminate, and white for Path to Exile when Tron was bigger in the format, green for it's removal, but ultimately I settled on green when I discovered Deadly Allure, which is hilarious to admit. The GB removal package is just incredibly efficient and powerful, and helps make up for what B lacks on its own. I'm glad you like the deck! I'm going to play around with those lands and see what happens.
3 months ago
Very cool deck. Works both the zombie and devotion themes, and has several interesting choices. With those choices, I'd love to pick your brain on the deck to get a better understanding of it myself, as it seems incredibly unique. First, you seem to have decided to not run hand discard in the mainboard, why is that? I figure it is because you would rather commit to your own gameplan rather than throw off your opponent's, but maybe there is something else I am overlooking. Another thing I found intriguing was that there are more copies of legendary lands than I would expect. While I normally see 1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and 1-3 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, you seem to have opted for the more greedy option of a playset of shrines and 2 tombs. Why did you choose to go with that, and do they often become a problem, or do you just pitch extra copies to cards like Liliana, Defiant Necromancer Flip and Cryptbreaker? Another odd inclusion that I'm sure that you've been asked about is Garza's Assassin. While a really cool card, I just wanted to ask how reliable he has been. He obviously has really cool synergy with AEther Vial, he has the crazy devotion, and the life can be made up with Gray Merchant of Asphodel, but I would just like to know where that decision came from (he isn't in your description), as it isn't something I've seen very often (or at all, which is incredible to me how well you seem to have made it work). Lastly, I wanted to ask you why you opted to splash green instead of the other colors like red, blue, or even (it might be a bit of a stretch) white. I see some crazy synergy in the green splash with cards like Deadly Allure when used on Phyrexian Obliterator and Relentless Dead and it can cover black's weak spots such as trouble dealing with planeswalkers, artifacts, and enchantments. I just wanted to know if you had ever played around with alternative splashes and what the decision to land on green looked like. Anyway, incredible deck, and I look forward to hearing your reply!
4 months ago
The exact rule is this one:
903.12. If a commander would be put into the exile zone from anywhere, its owner may put it into the command zone instead.
Notice the "may". Putting the Commander into the Commander Zone instead of into exile is an option! You can let the effect resolve as intended, so that you can control Liliana, Defiant Necromancer Flip as your Commander.