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|Commander 2015 (C15)||Common|
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Thought Vessel Discussion
1 day ago
Thanks for the feedback bud, I'm going to respond to some of the cards individually to give a more clear explanation for why I put them in there, and then we can maybe chat more about alternatives to some of the suggested cards. I'm planning on removing the Testing cards because I think it is a misnomer. Those are cards that weren't in a lot of other Sigarda decks, not particularly cards that I wanted the most feedback on. But that's my fault for not clarifying.
- Beastmaster Ascension, Cathars' Crusade, Door of Destinies, and True Conviction are what I would consider the primary win condition cards of the deck. They do generate a lot of heat, but that's why there are four of them. Hopefully during a game I would expect to see two of them. To be honest, I much prefer counters over static effects for two reasons: they stick around when the buff is removed, and static effects turn off things like Mentor of the Meek.
- Bow of Nylea is primarily in the deck because people don't like blocking deathtouch creatures. The activated abilities are insignificant in my opinion. If i have extra mana before my next untap phase I will add a +1/+1 counter to Sigarda, or tuck four cards back in my library if Angel of Glory's Rise is dead. I could definitely see the argument for cutting this card, and you mention better stuff, but do you have any recommendations for a mass combat enabler?
- Descendants' Path and Duskwatch Recruiter Flip are a way of seeing more of my deck. Selensya doesn't have a lot of multiple draw cards, and the ones that do are typically creature specific. The only card I would be genuinely sad to tuck is Angel of Glory's Rise, and both of these cards would either cast her, or put her into my hand. Also keep in mind I have 9 cards that make me shuffle my deck, or tucking things to the bottom of my library doesn't mean I won't see them. Also I don't want Duskwatch Recruiter Flip to flip, his activated ability is significantly more impactful than the generic ramp, in my opinion.
- The main difference between Grand Abolisher and Dosan the Falling Leaf is that Grand Abolisher stops people from doing things on my turn, Dosan the Falling Leaf forces people to play instants at sorcery speed, and doesn't stop activated abilities. I think Dosan either fizzles to things that I want to stop (Karlov of the Ghost Council, Spore Frog, and sacrifice effects), and only really messes with spellslinger type decks.
- I like Eerie Interlude when someone has Nevinyrral's Disk type effects out, but until you know someone has a board wipe, or you're going to combo it with your own board wipe, you're basically holding up three mana all the time. I would love suggestions on a permanent that will do this instead.
- I understand Magus of the Disk and Shaman of Forgotten Ways are removal targets, and that they have to survive a full rotation, but keep in mind that besides a board wipe, they both require two removal interactions because Sigarda, Heron's Grace will be out anytime they are. Magus of the Disk is in here to combo with Odric, Lunarch Marshal, though I admit that combo is a little jank. Shaman of Forgotten Ways is in there to shut down some of the lifegain elements or many of the decks I've seen, and because with the exception of a token deck, I expect to have the most number of creatures out. If you were to cut these two cards, what would you replace with them?
- Oblivion Ring is okay. I intentionally picked him over Fiend Hunter or Banisher Priest because enchantments have the least amount of removal, compared to the other nonland permanent types. If I was in Orzhov I would cut this for Anguished Unmaking or some similar effect.
- Thalia's Lancers: Don't forget Bow of Nylea and Tamiyo's Journal are also tutorable. Though most of the time I would be tutoring for one of the Odrics, or Kamahl, Fist of Krosa late game for the win.
- Werebear to me is the perfect mana dork. If I see him early, he provides me with a lot of ramp. If I see him late, he's a 5/5 human for CMC 2. There are a lot of Human mana dorks, but none of them save Shaman of Forgotten Ways does anything else of use.
Sorry that was longer than expected. About your recommendations:
- Bruna, the Fading Light and Gisela, the Broken Blade: To see for Brisela, Voice of Nightmares, you'd have to draw both of those, or one and Thalia's Lancers. The chance of seeing that happen in a game is somewhere in the ballpark of 10% after seeing 20 cards, so not great. I'm not really sure they have enough value on their own to justify that, I'd rather invest two slots in things that help my already big creatures get damage through.
- Sun Titan: Does not fit the tribal restrictions. Also, I don't really want a recursion sub-theme. There are cards to do it, but in my opinion, if you're going to do recursion, you want an engine of sorts, and that is getting too close to Marchesa. Plus recurring creatures doesn't really have a win condition unless it is an engine. They are valuable sure, but that's why Angel of Glory's Rise is the only recursion card in here.
- Oketra's Monument: I've never been a super fan of reducing generic mana costs, but only three of the white creatures won't benefit from this. I really wish the tokens were Humans, but to be honest this is a definitely maybe to include. I'm not sure what I would swap this with though, any opinions?
- Hero of Bladehold: Same slight problem with Oketra's Monument, but from my research, I can't find many good Human token generators. I might swap this with Angelic Overseer.
- Marshal's Anthem: Its CMC 4 to cast, and CMC 2*X to bring back. Unless I have Mirari's Wake out, I'm probably only bringing back 1 or 2 creatures, and the +1/+1 isn't really significant enough in my opinion. I'd rather try and fit in Collective Blessing somewhere.
- Growing Rites of Itlimoc
Flip: I think this card is really cool, and I think that I wouldn't cast this unless it was going to flip the same turn. Having Gaea's Cradle for CMC 3 can be really powerful, but I don't really know what ramp I would cut. Maybe Karametra, God of Harvests? The only problem I'm seeing with this is that it is mana not , and the overwhelming majority of stuff I want to do is in white.
I would love more draw, but there isn't a lot of good draw sources in Selesnya that I can find. Have you found any that you would recommend? The main reason I have a low CMC is because all of the things I have to draw with cost mana, Like investigating, Mentor of the Meek, Duskwatch Recruiter Flip, etc. So the hope is to be able to funnel the extra mana into those draw sources. I have not really addressed the lands as of yet, but if from playtesting Reliquary Tower is needed, I'll slot it in, but I think Thought Vessel is a waste unless you are drawing an exponential amount of cast from things like Rhystic Study.
I have some cards that I'm interested in getting your opinion on, and some potential swaps that I'd also like you opinion on. I'll redo the Testing category and the maybeboard, then ask you to reconvene later if that's okay?
4 days ago
4 days ago
Extractor Demon - Has never really shined
Thought Vessel - Sometimes it's good to discard
1 week ago
You have a good deck so far. Doubling Season isn't even worth it until it get truly reprinted. Anyhow, here are some suggestions:
- Gyre Sage
- Walking Ballista
- Managorger Hydra
- Rishkar, Peema Renegade
- Champion of Lambholt
- Herald of Secret Streams
- Spike Weaver
- Deepglow Skate
- Acidic Slime
- Kalonian Hydra
Hope this helps :)
1 week ago
1 week ago
Mostly I don't use those because I don't need unlimited hand size. Sure, they might be useful in some situations. But more often than not I am using my Control cards in between my turns and I have enough room to draw back up without worrying about discarding.
It does happen sometimes that I discard, but just as often as it is something important, it is something along the lines of an extra land or an Eldrazi Titan. Nothing to fuss over.
For the tower itself, I try to avoid as many non-blue lands as I can, because the deck obviously needs its islands. If I were to run either, it would clearly be the Mana rock because I can cast a great number of them in one turn. Only one land per turn though.
However, I tend to have much stronger Mana Rocks than the Vessel, so it hardly seems necessary. In fact, I daresay that if only for the no maximum hand size clause, Spellbook would be just as sufficient because it is a free cast. Or Venser's Journal for a better effect at a bit of a cost increase.
Is that a sufficient reason as to why not those?
Again, I'd love to hear more as to why you might disagree. Anything to improve my Azami deck! Thanks!
1 week ago
Hey, great deck, Azami is very fun.
It's obliviously very high end here I'm wondering why you choose not to play the three powerful Farie Wizards: Glen Elendra Archmage, Vendilion Clique and Sower of Temptation? Reliquary Tower and Thought Vessel are also missing? Ways to have no maximum hand size are broken with Azami's draw.
My only criticism is the Avg CMC is pretty high which is not good with a Control deck. Do you really need all the high CMC cards like the two Eldrazi Titans, Enter the Infinite, Omniscience, Time Stretch, Arcanis the Omnipotent, Deadeye Navigator and Great Whale? These cards can be powerful, but most of them you want to cheat into play not hard cast them. I don't think they're helping enough with control and the strategy of drawing cards with Wizards and Azami.
1 week ago
It's great! This was one commander that Todd wanted to make, haha. I showed him Colossus of Akros and Worldspine Wurm. I like all the X-cost spells and untap effects too. This deck should never have mana issues lol! Imo, Thought Vessel seems redundant since your commander is indestructible. If you're running From Beyond, you gotta have some Eldrazi to go find, lol! Good cheap ($) ones are: Artisan of Kozilek, Desolation Twin, Pathrazer of Ulamog, It That Betrays. Annihilator is a bitch. Also, Nezahal, Primal Tide seems like it fits in here since you draw with him when opponents play Magic, and you can easily return him from the grave to the battlefield. Keep working on it, but it's a great start!