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Lightning Bolt Discussion
56 minutes ago
This deck feels very disjointed and slow while lacking any form of interaction as the deck is currently I can't see it being playable in modern the highest curve toppers in most modern decks only reach 5-6 cmc usually and are kept to a minimum with the few exceptions showing up in decks such as tron, nyxwave, or decks that try and cheat out large threats such as reanimator. Your deck is currently running only 6 1cmc mana accelerants, 2 2cmc accelerants, and 2 3cmc accelerants with the accelerants above 1 cmc being over cost for what they provide for the deck and your curve. In terms of creatures outside of accelerants most of them are unplayable with their high cmc unless you specifically design your deck around playing them, Atarka, World Render might be able to be played in a devoted combo deck to it but it would mostlikely be tier 3 at best never tier 1 or 2. Dragonlord Atarka does nothing for 8 cmc against most modern decks and the decks it would do something against will have already won by the time you play it. Courser of Kruphix is a nice creature for filtering in midrange decks. Dragonlord Silumgar does not really do much in modern and is almost unplayable in this deck as you only have 5 sources that produce blue mana 4 of which are creatures which easily die to removal. Hornet Queen is another high cmc creature that does not do anything in the modern format for its high cmc. Kolaghan, the Storm's Fury is another card that does not pull its weight in relation to its cost while more viable to play at its 5cmc than 7 or 8cmc creature there are other dragons that do the job better at 5cmc. Silumgar, the Drifting Death could possibly have a place in a dedicated control deck in modern but does not fit to well in your deck which once again currently only runs 5 blue sources 4 of which are creatures. Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon is a card that could see modern play in the right control shell or in a combo deck designed around in but that does not do much for a midrange deck such as this which wants to do damage to the life as skithiryx can only do damage as poison counters to the opponent which on its own is strong but does not do much with the rest of your deck and divides its resources. Utvara Hellkite is another big cmc drop that is just to slow and does not do much in modern. Thunderbreak Regent, Thundermaw Hellkite, are potent cards that can be played in modern midrange decks or in the case of thundermaw as a gae finisher in control decks at low numbers in decks the same can be said for Stormbreath Dragon which you don't have in your deck, these are the dragons that might be able to be built around in a modern midrange deck if it has the right curve and interactions. Moving on to spells beat within can be alright in mono green modern decks but as you have access to black and red cards such as Abrupt Decay, Slaughter Pact, Maelstrom Pulse, Lightning Bolt, Dismember, Anger of the Gods, etc. are strictly better. If you want to play counterspells there are also strictly better choices then Stubborn Denial, although you only have 4 cards currently in the deck that can provide blue for this spell all of which are creatures this is likely to be a dead card in your hand most game and when you play it have little impact on the game. Dragon Tempest in the right deck might work but more often then not will probably waste a turn to play unless you are very careful in your deck design and in your execution of when to play this card in a game. Crux of Fate is usually strictly worse than Damnation but in this deck it might work however it is slow and there are not many decks outside of control that need board wipes in modern. Diabolic Revelation is unplayable in every competitive format it does very little for a high cost. Domri Rade is good in creature heavy midrange decks. Finally your sideboard does very little to combat popular decks in the current modern meta or to strengthen your own weaknesses against certain matchups.
My final thoughts are if you want to continue to play jund dragons in modern I would highly recommend you take a look at recent modern jund midrange decks at mtg top8 and experiment with substituting dragons in for some of the midrange finishers.
14 hours ago
They don't go great with Lightning Bolt, et al. If I had a better way to pump them, I might do infect creatures. Right now all my creatures pump themselves.
I have always wanted to do a Tainted Strike deck with these creatures, though.
16 hours ago
CanadianShinobi in 'Grave Consqequences, Part 2, Maro writes
"I turned [tarmogoyf] in as a /. While I'm a huge fan of Lhurgoyf, I never liked the +1 toughness. I feel like it added inelegance for the sole purpose of keeping the card alive on an empty graveyard, so when I made my Lhurgoyf riff, I made it / instead. Ironically, the card got kicked out of the file to make room for a planeswalker (the card that would later become the first Garruk). When we pushed off the planeswalkers, Tarmogoyf got stuck back into the file. Mike Turian, Future Sight's lead developer, recreated the card from memory and just assumed it had /*+1 because it was copying Lhurgoyf. Mike also dropped the card from to because he felt as it was "just a beater without evasion" it didn't need to cost three mana. The rest, as they say, is history."
There's your evidence for goyf.
Now for snappy, we go to Zac Hill's article " Gonna Hate", where he writes
"I'll be real with you. We messed up with Snapcaster Mage.
I'm not going to sit here and look you in the eye and tell you that Snapcaster Mage is a fair Magic card. Nor am I going to blame any of my colleagues for the problem: I worked with Tiago Chan to design it, and by the time we realized exactly how powerful it was in concert with the abundance of one-mana cantrips in Standard, the card was already out the door. We knew it was something we were going to have to attack in order to keep Standard in check. The challenge was deciding how best to do that."
Granted, he was talking about the flashback mana leaks that plagued standard. But regardless of format, a broken card is broken. A bad design is a bad design.
I have no evidence to say that Path to Exile Lightning Bolt or Thoughtseize are mistakes, and frankly I regret calling them "mistakes" earlier. They were all more powerful than designers had originally anticipated, but that does not make them degenerate. They all serve very important roles in the modern meta. Even goyf, a card Mark Rosewater himself said was a clerical error, is not degenerate.
16 hours ago
17 hours ago
18 hours ago
I'd certainly recommend using Spell Pierce or Inquisition of Kozilek in your main board. It reduces the all-in approach and increases your chances of whiffing while trying to cycle with a Grim Haruspex, but it also stops cards like Thoughtseize or Rest in Peace that can totally shut down the deck.
Also Spell Pierce is superior in my option since it shores up our Affinity, Infect, Burn, and control matchups. Spell Pierce hits threats that are too fast for you, like stopping a Groundswell or Lightning Bolt. It might not seem like much, but that one extra turn can be enough to find a win. People will also play around it a little after you show them game 1 that it is in your deck. Sometimes I'll bluff people by just always leaving up a single blue mana, just to have them play slower until we can combo off.
Also Quail, I've been looking into using Sidisi, Undead Vizier as a sideboard card. It's a tutor to find our hate cards or Heartless Summoning, kills itself or a Myr for value, and can also profitably block just about every creature (including Siege Rhino) if necessary. Thoughts?
19 hours ago
The biggest part about beating infect is knowing how to play against infect. You have to kill their creatures on your turn or on their end step. If you bolt while in combat you will quickly come to regret it.
20 hours ago
@MentorOfTheMeek: I originally had four Abrupt Decay in the main, but eventually moved them to the side. Game one, I'm pretty much going to be as un-interactive as possible. Because of that, Abrupt Decay ends up in the yard without me having cast it. I found I only needed them to deal with Blood Moon, Rest in Peace, etc. where I may just be doing a conventional game of drawing only one card a turn from the top of my library. The same was true for Lightning Bolt.
Golgari Grave-Troll is never cast in this deck. It's purely there to give dredge triggers. Turn one, it's either Faithless Looting or land into play tapped. Turn two, it's Life from the Loam, Smallpox, or Tormenting Voice. From turn three forward, the deck is purely going to dredge cards until it finds Life from the Loam.
Eventually, the game gets drawn out long enough to where you're able to strip away the opponent's hand with Raven's Crime, casting Creeping Renaissance to get Seismic Assault going, or making 7+ tokens each turn with Worm Harvest.
|Avg. draft pick||2.92|
|Avg. cube pick||3.9|
|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Modern Masters 2015 Edition||Uncommon|
|Premium Deck Series: Fire and Lightning||Common|
|2011 Core Set||Common|
|2010 Core Set||Common|
|Masters Edition||magic online on|
|Beatdown Box Set||Common|
|International Collector's Edition||Common|
|Limited Edition Beta||Common|
|Limited Edition Alpha||Common|
|Promo set for Gatherer||Common|
- Lightning Bolt + Repercussion
- Lightning Bolt + Pyromancer Ascension
- Lightning Bolt + Tarmogoyf
- Mountain + Assault Strobe + Lightning Bolt
- Bump in the Night + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Lightning Helix + Path to Exile
- Lightning Bolt + Twincast
- Fork + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Spark Jolt
- Lightning Bolt + Lightning Strike + Vexing Devil
- Electrolyze + Lightning Bolt + Lightning Helix
- Electrolyze + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Reiterate + Reset
- Lightning Bolt + Stormblood Berserker
- Lightning Bolt + Sygg, River Cutthroat
- Increasing Vengeance + Lightning Bolt + Snapcaster Mage
- Galvanic Blast + Lightning Bolt
- Isochron Scepter + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Snapcaster Mage
- Lightning Bolt + Searing Blood + Young Pyromancer
- Lightning Bolt + Mortal's Ardor
- Kiln Fiend + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Mountain
- Lightning Bolt + Victim of Night
- Elite Arcanist + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Helix + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Satyr Firedancer
- Guttersnipe + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Lightning Strike
- Lightning Strike + Magma Jet + Lightning Bolt
- Fugue + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Rift Bolt + Tragic Slip
- Lightning Bolt + Terminate
- Beast Within + Lightning Bolt
- Djinn Illuminatus + Fire Servant + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Nature's Claim
- Boros Reckoner + Flame Javelin + Lightning Bolt
- Howl of the Horde + Lightning Bolt + Monastery Swiftspear
- Lightning Bolt + Pain Magnification
- Guul Draz Vampire + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Lightning Bolt + Snapcaster Mage
- Mountain + Lightning Bolt
- Curse of Bloodletting + Lightning Bolt
- Badlands + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Reset
- Lightning Bolt + Lightning Bolt + Mountain
- Island + Lightning Bolt + Reach Through Mists
- Lightning Bolt + Swans of Bryn Argoll
- Lightning Bolt + Searing Wind
- Lightning Bolt + Lightning Helix + Wear / Tear
- Lightning Bolt + Lightning Helix
- Fireball + Lightning Bolt
- Akroan Hoplite + Lightning Bolt
- Balefire Liege + Gisela, Blade of Goldnight + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Soulfire Grand Master
- Djinn Illuminatus + Lightning Bolt + Seething Song
- Lightning Bolt + Magma Spray + Shock
- Howl of the Horde + Lightning Bolt
- Flame Slash + Lightning Bolt + Searing Blood
- Lightning Bolt + Path to Exile
- Lightning Bolt + Monastery Swiftspear + Mountain
- Lightning Bolt + Rift Bolt
- Boros Charm + Lightning Bolt
- Disfigure + Lightning Bolt + Path to Exile
- Bloodghast + Geralf's Messenger + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Trostani's Judgment
- Forked Bolt + Lightning Bolt
- Snapcaster Mage + Lightning Bolt
- Hornet Nest + Lightning Bolt
- Lava Spike + Lightning Bolt
- Anax and Cymede + Hero's Blade + Lightning Bolt
- Goblin Grenade + Lightning Bolt
- Lightning Bolt + Tamanoa
- Chandra, the Firebrand + Lightning Bolt + Rings of Brighthearth
- Lightning Bolt + Magma Spray
- Gut Shot + Lightning Bolt
- Eye of the Storm + Lightning Bolt + Remand