: Add to your mana pool. Spend this mana only to play artifact spells.
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Mishra's Workshop Discussion
1 day ago
2 weeks ago
Definitely get The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, Mishra's Workshop, Timetwister...then probably some arabian nights stuff like Bazaar of Baghdad, Diamond Valley and so on. That's something not everyone plays, it's different from just buying more expensive versions of cards everyone uses, such as duals.
3 weeks ago
If you want to show him what proxies without limit are capable of, play stax with The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale and Mishra's Workshop. My favourite commander is Grand Arbiter Augustin IV and he does a good job at showing the "pub stomper" decks who is boss.
Everything else would just secure a quick win, but with stax you can punish other players for quite a while until they give up themselves or you decide to go for the win by searching for the combo in your deck
3 weeks ago
If you want to go colourless I'd rather take Karn, Silver Golem. You also have to consider that playing colourless without Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors, Mishra's Workshop and Vesuva or stuff like Metalworker, Memory Jar, Mycosynth Lattice is not cool and if you still need to buy these you probably opt out of playing an artifact build.
3 weeks ago
I don't get what you mean with the lack of green, because speed is definitely not the problem in an artifact deck like Stax. Being able to use mostly colorless mana means having access to Mishra's Workshop, Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors and Crystal Vein and the accelerating mana rocks get better as well. It's not quite as reliable as in Vintage with 4 Workshops in only 60 cards, but it's still a lot faster than having to use mostly colored mana.
As for Propaganda, I have cut and added that card numerous times, always thought I don't need it for the same reasons you stated. Can't protect planeswalkers, people will find a way to pay or destroy it...that's all correct and it works without it, until there's a need to slow down aggro, for example stuff like Kaalia of the Vast, which ignores the Moat and mostly also Ensnaring Bridge or when elves are on the table. I always felt it was unnecessary to make someone pay 2 for attacking but it brings aggro to a full stop after Armageddon and with The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale or Pendrell Mists it's the same, because it's easy to pay the upkeep alone, but not upkeep and attacking. It feels weak but it has always worked, both with White Stax in legacy and in commander. The classic Stax builds in vintage and legacy always had a better matchup against Combo and control (Trinisphere, Chalice of the Void, Sphere of Resistance, Thorn of Amethyst, and Lodestone Golem are a threat to storm on their own for example) while having to protect extremely well against aggro. Having 40 life available is a good reason for not needing 3 or 4 Ghostly Prison like in Legacy, but it should still be at least possible to stop creatures with a land wipe imo.
I will try Spell Snare, Mental Misstep and Swords to Plowshares tomorrow. I'm not so sure about Karn Liberated because his removal ability is a minus, so he's not the late game saviour I might need. restarting the game is interesting, when you can hold for like 2 or 3 more turns but see that the system will be going down then. It's too situational and a 1 mana counter is probably better in his slot. However, Ugin, the Spirit Dragon can take out single targets with plus and clear the board with minus, while leaving most stax pieces intact and he's colorless, which means it's rather easy to cast him early.
Is there a reason why you don't play the cheap or free counterspells in your deck, although you have blue available? You probably have too little blue for Force of Will but Daze, Spell Snare, Flusterstorm, Swan Song or Mental Misstep would be fine I guess.
1 month ago
Thank you VitalisStacs!
I think I have explained somewhere in the comments why I removed winter orb. Keeping permanents tapped is worse than completely removing them, for example with mass land destruction and constant sacrificing effects and it also can't compete with the effect of Land Equilibrium, which prevents multiple lands from even entering the battlefield. Same with static orb, it isn't strong enough to be worth the two-sided effect. Both cards are very weak in the early game and that is where I want to establish control.
I don't play mass removal for creatures because it's a one time hit and doesn't prevent further creatures from being played. Also, it's often just the commander or another recurring creature, probably a combo piece, that is really a problem. I think it's more efficient to disable what creatures are supposed to do than repeatedly clearing the table.
Clever impersonator is a bad Phyrexian Metamorph here, simply because of double blue and not being an artifact (everything that can't be cast with Mishra's Workshop has to be A LOT better than an artifact alternative imo). Grasp of fate is also a problem because of double white. Copy enchantment has too few targets in the deck and defense grid is too situational imo.
As for spot removals...I play a few targetable removals, for example Engineered Explosives, Umezawa's Jitte and Karn Liberated. World Queller can also get rid of certain card types, especially when I don't have one of that type in play at the moment. The good aspect of these cards is that they are all reusable. Playing a spot removal as instant or sorcery in a game of 3 or 4 players means giving card advadvantage to all players who are not losing a spell or permanent. In this deck I never want to trade 1:1 because I wouldn't be able to control the whole table if I did so.
1 month ago
I understand your points on the mentioned cards and I agree on most - I don't like to play these "don't untap" mechanisms either because they are easily removed and they don't always hinder the opponents enough. Stuff that messes with permanents while leaving them in play is often not good enough...I see this every time I play my storm deck. As long as the spells don't cost more destroying or disabling the permanents doesn't really disrupt my play then.
However, the power of a turn one trinisphere or Lodestone Golem with the help of Mishra's Workshop shouldn't be underestimated. I don't know how your deck plays exactly but I am usually able to cast cast Augustin in turn 2, sometimes turn 1 and at worst in turn 3. I've had several games with that build in which 2 or 3 other players weren't able to do anything useful at all because the costs of spells increased each turn or every second turn in the early game. My main opponents here are Arcum Dagsson, Hermit Druid, Teferi/Venser (both control/combo), infect and Elves aggro/combo. If you want you can have a look at my list Augustin's $t4ks (4000$ Solution/Stax) and compare it to yours
1 month ago
It's hard to rebuild a whole deck in order to change the strategy. It's much easier to list what you absolutely want in every Stax list - at least I could list a basic package of cards that I always use in Stax builds, no matter what the rest is supposed to do. When building a new Stax deck I consider these slots fixed, so the numner of free slots in the deck is reduced by ~33 for lands and the number of cards used for the basic speed and disruption package. The rest depends on what colours I want to use and how exactly I want to play with the deck.
A lot depends on your budget though, because Stax is the most expensive way to go (except for 5 colour with all the duals maybe, but only if there's a lot of other expensive stuff there too). I was lucky enough to get my hands on a playset of Mishra's Workshop around 2008 or 2009, when the playset was below the price you have to pay for ONE copy today and I also got an italian The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale for 70 euro, wich is a tenth of today's price. You don't have to play these crds, but they make stax a whole lot better and they justify playing cards like Crop Rotation and Tolaria West, which you might not want to include otherwise.
As for the basic Stax package I mentioned, for me this consists of the following cards:
- Sol Ring
- Mana Crypt
- Mana Vault
- Grim Monolith
- Mox Diamond
- Chrome Mox
- Mox Opal
- Lotus Petal
- Voltaic Key
- Coalition Relic
- Ancient Tomb
- City of Traitors
- Mishra's Workshop
- Sphere of Resistance
- Thorn of Amethyst
- Lodestone Golem
- Tangle Wire
- The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale (unless I play aggro stax with many creatures)
- Land Equilibrium
- Crucible of Worlds
- Strip Mine
- Ravages of War
- Ensnaring Bridge (not in aggro stax)
- Moat (not in aggro stax)
Humility (not in aggro stax)
- Scroll Rack
- Jace, the Mind Sculptor
- Tezzeret the Seeker
- Transmute Artifact
You see, there are a lot of slots that I consider fixed when I play stax and the rest of the deck should define the specific strategy. I have also listed some blue cards in my basic package, but without blue these could be easily replaced with other must plays, for example Goblin Welder in red. The tutors also depend on the colours you want to use, but with black and blue you have quite a few to choose from. White is good for some of the most perverted masss removals and lockdown pieces.
To complete your deck you have to double-check every card for its power, if it has a direct impact on the game or if it does next to nothing without other cards in the deck (in that case it should be a lock or combo). You also have to check if there is anything similar but better and then make changes accordingly. Also avoid multiple copies of effects that are not cummulative, unless it's an effect you absolutely want to see in every game and which is most likely a top target for removal.