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Kiki-Chord is pretty fuckin' boss now that Eldritch Evolution has been printed. I'd recommend going that route. You get to go higher up on your curve than Collected Company, as well as more consistent "Oops? I win!" combos.
Hell, you don't even need Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker. There's a bunch of lists floating around that are pure value decks.
There's a bunch of these different variants being played that either play fewer copies of Collected Company or none at all.
August 17, 2017 5:41 p.m.
@Xica: That kind of misses the point. Tarmogoyf and Snapcaster Mage aren't included just because they're staples. They're staples because they're powerful cards, thus a deck needs a good reason to not play them when the deck is in those colors.
Tarmogoyf rewards you for just playing Magic. You fetch up a land and cast Inquisition of Kozilek. You now have a 3/4 that just grows larger the longer the game goes on. The only thing you had to do was do what you'd normally do.
Snapcaster Mage is just a Swiss Army knife. He can be Ashcoat Bear or Anarchist. He's blue. His effect is an ETB which opens up a lot of room to use bounce spells. If you're a blue deck with lots of instants and sorceries, you have to have a specific reason not to play him.
Tarmogoyf isn't something you play in Collected Company because your deck is basically creatures and lands, meaning he never grows beyond a 2/3. Nor is it something you play in Tron, because by the time you can play Tarmogoyf, you're a turn away from casting Wurmcoil Engine.
Snapcaster Mage isn't something you play in Storm because you're already playing Past in Flames or Noxious Revival. By the time you can flash something back with Snapcaster Mage, you could have just won with Past in Flames.
So despite being format staples and incredibly powerful cards, there are definitely reasons not to play either one. There's also high-tier decks that don't play either one.
The issue with Mardu is that it needs something that rewards you for just playing Magic, is versatile, or generates a bunch of value on its own. Young Pyromancer comes really close. In fact, I'd say it's on the same power level as Snapcaster Mage. The problem is Modern doesn't have all of the high-value, low casting cost instants/sorceries that Legacy has (like Hymn to Tourach or Swords to Plowshares). Nor does Modern have all the fast mana of Vintage so you can cast more expensive spells the same turn you play Young Pyromancer (such as going turn 2 Young Pyromancer -> Mox Sapphire -> Mox Pearl -> Gush -> Time Walk).
Mardu really needs something like Stoneforge Mystic that generates a ton of value immediately, but unbanning it will just mean Abzan is still the stronger deck.
I think what Mardu really needs and could actually be fine for Modern is Goblin Bombardment. Not only do you get to ping your opponent to death with Gravecrawlers and Bloodghasts, you get to do dumb things with Tidehollow Sculler and Fiend Hunter.
August 17, 2017 5:27 p.m.
It's also worth noting that some abilities don't make something strictly better or worse, just kind of different. Shroud, infect, and phasing come to mind. Each abilities have pros and cons, so whether or not something is strictly better/worse will depend on the deck they're used in or the meta.
For example, Grizzly Bears isn't strictly worse than Humble Budoka in a deck that can target its own creatures. In a deck that's 56 Forests and 4 2/2 creatures, Humble Budoka is likely going to be better.
Card subtypes and colors are another thing to keep in mind. While we joke in here about arcane, sometimes that matters. Expedition Envoy could be considered strictly better than Savannah Lions simply because it's a human ally.
This is all kind of moot, however. MtG Salvation's Wiki has a list of each card in each set that's strictly better, a reprint, or a functional reprint (the link I posted is for Avacyn Restored).
I wouldn't try to go through and list each card individually because you're bound to miss some. I think you'd have an easier time with this if you went through the wiki for each set and recorded each instance. What the wiki doesn't have is a way to sort or search for cards that are strictly better. Compiling a list where people can use ctrl + f would be most appreciated.
August 15, 2017 6:06 a.m.
It's a Korean word meaning "exceptional" or "superior" that's turned into slang from people playing online games (mainly StarCraft).
Seems like you got a good deal! I know I'm jealous lol.
August 13, 2017 7:49 p.m.
@abby315: rofl I didn't even think about flickering it to reset the ability. For some reason, I was thinking it read "When you cast Stalking Leonin..." and not an ETB.
@Marcus_Licinius_Crassus: I'm always hesitant to name 4 CMC blue cards due to Jace, the Mind Sculptor already occupying that slot in so many deck lists. You're probably right, though. Being able to flashback spells each turn on a 3/4 is solid.
It's the exact kind of card the more tempo-oriented decks (like Grixis Delver) want.
August 13, 2017 5:33 p.m.
@Profet93: How's the overall condition of it now that you have it in person? $1,000 seems like a bargain. Pretty gozu IMO.
August 13, 2017 5:25 p.m.
8-Whack is a lot of fun. It's probably still easy to get Goblin Guides for a low price, as well (considering they were pushing $40+ before the reprint).
The other expensive card in the deck is Atarka's Command. Other than that, you can get away with playing basic lands.
Other good choices would be Gruul Shamans and 5-Color All Creatures (a variant of human tribal).
August 12, 2017 5:03 p.m.
I'm actually liking some of the new cards in the upcoming Commander release. I figured we could use a thread to discuss what cards are playable in the new set and people's thoughts on them from a non-EDH perspective.
Some of my thoughts so far:
This seems solid in Ad Nauseam, but I'm not experienced with the deck to know whether this is better than any of the other Angel's Grace cards. The nice thing is you can respond to a Doomsday or Ad Nauseam as usual, but you're not stuck at 1 life. You can also use it defensively to phase out your permanents to protect yourself from Wasteland.
You can also use the protection on yourself so you can dodge cards like Hymn to Tourach.
I might play around with this in Goblins. Getting Lotus Petals each turn seems strong in conjunction with Aether Vial. Might also try some kind of weird R/x Prison deck with Mishra's Factory beatdowns.
The mana costs on this are lower than Mirage Mirror. An activation cost of seems solid when you want to create multiple Goblin Piledrivers, hatebears, or Priest of Titania. The downside is that it can only be used on tribal cards and you need to have a creature in play worth copying.
Not sure if this will find a home in any Legacy decks, moreso that it's kind of a cute beatstick. I was thinking Maverick may have a slot for it, since there's some synergy with Qasali Pridemage. You could also make some weird Illness in the Ranks deck. Hunted Troll , Hunted Phantasm , and Forbidden Orchid would be the other cards, but this doesn't seem like a viable strategy in Legacy to me.
Another piece of removal for Hatebear strategies. I like this guy, especially since it gets rid of the creature permanently and you don't have to do weird Flickerwisp + Fiend Hunter things. The only downside is you can't deal with a creature before it attacks, specifically Emrakul, the Aeons Torn in the Show and Tell matchup. Still, I'm 99% positive this guy finds itself taking over slots in D&T.
Any other cards people are thinking about playing in their Eternal non-EDH decks? As far as I know, the full card spoiler hasn't been released anywhere, so there will likely be other new playables or staples coming out. I don't think we're going to see anything on the level as True-Name Nemesis, but some of these come close.
August 10, 2017 9:57 p.m.
You'll see The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale in more than just lands. It finds a way into a lot of sideboards to punish aggro.
Basically, any deck that doesn't rely on creatures can jam The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale into their sideboards with little issues, on top of Lands being a good deck. It's a safe investment, even if they did ban things out of Lands.
Hell, even if they banned The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale in Legacy, it'd still be worth a fuck ton. Getting one for under $1k is a bargain, IMO.
August 10, 2017 9:22 p.m.
I've played Esper Hatebears in Modern before and honestly it's just kind of "meh."
You basically mess with your opponent a bunch, they topdeck a large creature or win condition, and then you can't race them with your 2/2s. The issue I had was there really wasn't a way to pump your team up consistently. Little Kid decks have Gavony Township and Wilt-Leaf Liege. D&T has Honor of the Pure affect every creature you play.
It's not like you have Wasteland and Rishadan Port, either, to really make the most out of Aether Vial. You get your mana freed up so you can attack with Creeping Tar Pit and Shambling Vent more easily, but often those slow you down when you want to play Thalia, Guardian of Thraben or Geist of Saint Traft on-curve.
Then there's the whole not having Collected Company thing. You're also not a deck that plays blue or black's strongest cards in Modern. You get Fatal Push and Meddling Mage, which is nice, but Dark Confidant is too slow in the deck, Liliana of the Veil does almost nothing,Snapcaster Mage has too few targets, and Serum Visions isn't what you want at all. There are a plethora of useful planeswalkers for the deck, but at that point you'll just be wondering "Why am I not playing tokens?"
Go with Spirits, Bant/Abzan CoCo, Maverick, Little Kid Abzan, W/B D&T, or really any deck that isn't Esper Hatebears. The deck just doesn't have enough "oomph!" in it to close out games once you've locked your opponent down the way other hatebear decks can. You also can't outrace decks like Naya Burn or Zooicide, but at the same time, don't have enough hate to deal with so many different threats (like, you'll name Lightning Bolt with Meddling Mage and they'll just kill you with Lava Spikes anyway).
August 7, 2017 10:31 p.m.
As far as winning with curses goes, I think the others are right. You're gonna need to switch colors around, at the very least. R/W with Curse of Exhaustion, Curse of the Pierced Heart, Possibility Storm, and Porphyry Nodes + whatever gods (Heliod, God of the Sun is amazing here) seems like your best bet. Combined with your Ghostly Prisons and removal, you shouldn't have too many problems stalling the game until you lock your opponent out with Possibility Storm.
Alternatively, there's some good U/W Enchantment Control decks floating around online. Here is one recently posted on MtG Goldfish. Here's a mono-white version posted on Star City Games that can easily be altered to include what you want to play.
August 6, 2017 4:50 p.m.
For those that haven't seen it:
August 5, 2017 4:19 p.m.
The others are right...this is just a Modern deck with Necropotence and Strip Mine, both of which are restricted in Vintage (yet you're playing multiple copies of both). This deck isn't even using any of the powerful R/B cards for Vintage or Null Rod.
Demonic Consultation, Demonic Tutor, Wasteland, Sol Ring, Dark Ritual, etc. aren't in here, but they should be. How else are you going to deal with the format's established archetypes, like Mentor, Dredge, or MUD? There isn't enough artifact hate (like Ingot Chewer) or ways to deal with your opponent casting a bunch of spells. Sudden Shock is missing in your sideboard to deal with Monastery Mentor.
I guess you can stroke your ego by beating up on some Standard decks?
August 1, 2017 6:45 p.m.
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