|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Tempest Remastered (TPR)||Rare|
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City of Traitors
When you play another land, sacrifice City of Traitors.
: Add to your mana pool.
|Have (4)||Joblaska , mziter501 , ahobrien , voidruby|
|Want (15)||BringerOfStorms , DeadeyeDesperado , Korevana , doonmeister , Dawnbreaker7727 , sycdan , vakuso , Cheshire000 , DragynFyre , Fralaylah , 0ur0b0r05 , Arrownight , AzureOctive , Turtlelover73 , powertrot|
City of Traitors Discussion
6 days ago
While on paper Deserted Temple seemed like a good addition for mana fixing, the only real synergy it has in the deck is untapping a Cabal Coffers with Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth . Deserted Temple generally works a lot better when paired alongside lands like City of Traitors or Scorched Ruins but since this deck doesn't play either of those options it is a prime candidate for cutting. The most likely replacement is another basic Forest . Vesuva covers the same angle, but with far more flexibility.
Worm Harvest is another candidate for replacement. In a grand total of one game I have cast this spell, and the advantage is that it can be reused from the graveyard but unfortunately it is slow strategy (even for this deck) and is an inefficient way of getting land into the graveyard even if that becomes the main reason for using it in the first place.
More and more I find myself falling out of love with Wayward Swordtooth . Early game it provides some slight ramp, but ultimately a 5/5 that doesn't block effectively for Lord Windgrace until we get city's blessing is underwhelming. Especially in that critical 3-drop where we would otherwise want to cast an Azusa, Lost but Seeking for even more land drop potential (especially with Crucible of Worlds ) or Harrow for mana fixing.
I've also had a change of heart of Journey to Eternity Flip. This has mainly become tech against sacrifice-based strategies such as Sheoldred, the Whispering One or any deck playing Grave Pact / Dictate of Erebos .
Another few additions to the maybe-board that I've seen played across a few other Lord Windgrace decks are:
The primary issue with Chandra, Torch of Defiance is that her uptick for quasi-card advantage can exile an essential land with no chance to bring it back, but she does represent another win condition with her ultimate (even if it is slow). If you are only using Chandra for her mana uptick, I think that it's a waste as a 4-mana ramp spell. Whereas Nissa, Vastwood Seer Flip provices something the deck really likes doing: ramping or drawing cards. The downside of this Nissa is that her downtick is not fantastic, but I guess it provides a blocker to help protect her or Lord Windgrace . Further her ultimate (turning 6 lands into 6/6s) leaves lands vulnerable, but also represents a potential game-winning swing *(note that this does not give the lands haste so this has absolutely no synergy with anything that brings land back from the graveyard to the battlefield or making extra land drops as they would be subject to summoning sickness and would not even be able to tap for mana if you were planning of using it for Exsanguinate or Torment of Hailfire ).
1 week ago
1 week ago
Hey ShreddedByCrows. Wow, thats a lot of input here! Thanks for your suggestions.
I really like the effort you put in here, but i think you are overengineering a bit. First of all youre absolutely right: There are some cards in here that don't make any sense or are slow. This deck was never ment to be super-competitive, it's just build with some cards i had laying around to make a fun to pilot deck that kills some deck strategies, mostly Vannifars. I know it could be build a more competitive way, but in multiplayer it should not totally ruin the fun for everyone and make me archenemy. And i liked the idea of putting some cards in here that never see play even if they are cool.
For Extraplanar Lens youre right. I wanted to put in snow covered lands and i own enough of them. I simply did not find any since all my cards below 1 Euro are in boxes with 4000 cards each and it takes a lot of time to search. With a job and building a house i had my priorities not on that.
As far as the mana-rocks go you're right again. But all my crypts, vaults and my single monolith are in some of my more serious decks and i dont want to remove them there or buy extra copies for a fun-deck like this.
Eiganjo Castle is a card i didn't think of and it perfectly fits, need to find and add one. For wasteland and strip mine same problem as before. All of them used in other decks and i hate switching cards around. Not sure if i would add crucible just for this, but playing 2 LD lands is always a good thing. City of Traitors is a card i sadly don't own and it's a bit expensive for a deck like this.
Humility is a great card, played it in my creatureless superfriends EDH some years ago but it slows down the game too much and kills the fun on the table.
For your card suggestions: I dont want to go into all of those but for the staxx package i dont want to lock the board down totally. Played Vintage Staxx years ago before Trinisphere got restricted and some really nasty Daretti Staxx EDH. That really evolves fast to a point where nobody wants to play with you if you play that deck. After all Commander is still a fun-format. For a competetive list sure, those a must haves.
I feel a bit like i wasted your time but i will for sure take your suggestions here if i build a mean version of this deck. I thank you a lot for your time and suggestions.
+1 for your staxx deck for this if i find it
1 week ago
Nice brew, neat idea to counter those clunky and annoying Vannifars!
As smne who played Mono-W Stax for a while, with the amazing Hokori, Dust Drinker at the helm, I'll share with you what thoughts inspire me your sweet Linvala decklist.
(Even if it has already been pointed out before, I wanna say that I also love the Urborg combo. It's unexpectable and freakin' gud!)
Let's start by the beginning: mana fixation. Extraplanar Lens is insane in every monocolored archetype, so it's a quite logic inclusion you made here. Nonetheless, I suggest you to go for Snow-covered lands to synergize better with it - that way you won't give a lift to your opponents playing white.
Pearl Medallion and Sol Ring are basics, nothing really worth to say about it. Thran Dynamo and Worn Powerstone are more debatable. I don't know what is your budget issue, but if you want a competitve list, Mana Crypt , Mana Vault , Grim Monolith , Mind Stone , Everflowing Chalice etc. are all better options. Dynamo and Powerstone aren't bad cards, but they just come after those ones if you really do need a solid ''ramp'' package.
Opal Palace feels badly slow and ineffective in a monocolored stax deck. You won't win the game by taking up the board with your creatures armed of a little +1/+1 counter.
You have notable exclusions in your lands for a mono-white. Eiganjo Castle is the first card that comes through mind. Buried Ruin also is a recursive tool you should consider, even over Inventors' Fair . If you manage to find one, Ancient Tomb has its place there replacing Temple of the False God .
At its final shape, my Hokori decklist was running a powerful Crucible of Worlds package including Wasteland , Strip Mine , Dust Bowl , Flagstones of Trokair , Lotus Vale and City of Traitors . I was up to 39 lands, not counting Maze of Ith .
Now let's jump straight into your gameplan!
So... you're planning to focus your eyes on ruining Vannifar's day. To help with this strategy of being the nasty ''combo killer'' guy, I think you should put in some additional pieces of disruption.
That said, I don't know which Vannifar's version(s) your playgroup perform with. If it's a Thornbite Staff / Intruder Alarm one, things would be easier to calm down and you won't need such a heavy stax package - you'll need more single-target/multi-target removals though. And if it's the other one, certainly the most popular now (and also the most powerful/absurd), based on many shenanigans around the creatures Vannifar brings to the table, you'll need more stax support.
One of the very best cards you could add to stop all those creature-centered combos is Humility . This card is broken, this card is stupid. It even disables etb abilities. The only way your opponent has to go through is to destroy it with a creatureless source / or with a ''casting'' effect (like Ulamog has).
Single-handly, Humility tears apart most of the competitive Vannifar lists. However, based on the fact that it is still fragile to enchantments/permanents removals, you'll have to build a defensive shield for your stuff. Vannifar lists often keep a strong package of cheap permanents' removals in their pocket (like Beast Within for example), so you'll need to play carefully.
There's a lot of different ways you can head in order to reinforce your permanents' presence on the battlefield. A pretty simple and most of the time effective, despite of its ccm, you already included is Avacyn, Angel of Hope . I think you still lack a way to cheat her casting cost out to make her a stable and destructive power house.
Stax ''enchantment'' strategy is imo one of the most viable and solid strategy. With Academy Rector (amazing alongside your High Market ), you'll be able to search the exact piece you need to lock the game in your favor.
Notable stax exclusions :
Static Orb > staple
Storage Matrix > staple
Arena of the Ancients > staple
Thalia, Heretic Cathar > staple
Lodestone Golem > Considering all the artifacts you're playing, ~ seems like a consistent pick for your draft.
Ethersworn Canonist > personal preference there. I always loved ~ in my stax deck. Synergizes well with Teshar.
Phyrexian Revoker > another personal preference. Always found ~ useful.
Pithing Needle > destroys Vannifar for 1 mana.
Orb of Dreams > more of an Hokori all stars card, but could also be good here.
Sphere of Resistance > staple, should be played carefully to slow down your opponents combos and not threw away as soon as possible like I see many people casting it
Mana Tithe > unexpected white counterspell - another Hokori all stars... I don't know if it would be any good there
Other cards to consider :
Platinum Angel > slow down combos, create a premium target for every combo player removals.
Greater Auramancy > protection for your enchantments
Sensei's Divining Top > not the best card draw you could find, but provides something White struggles to accomplish
Barl's Cage > strong mana sink against Vannifar and creature-heavy decks
Condemn > more removals
Abolish > more removals
Dispatch > more removals
Catastrophe > clears everything except enchantments/artifacts
Approach of the Second Sun > win con
Idyllic Tutor > searching for Humility
A bunch of meta depending stax tools :
Cards I'd cut from your list :
Martyr's Bond > Slow and unreliable on this brew. As you're not sacrificing any kind of permanent on your own, you'll struggle to get any value out of it outside of a lost political blast deflagrating when the game should already be over. Unless you add in some cards like World Queller , it defenitly doesn't deserve a slot imo.
Bishop of Rebirth > a lot of people seems to give love to this card recently. However, I personally think it is just a bad inclusion. You spend 5 mana on a understated body and you have to wait a whole turn before getting value out of it IF you are in the researched scenario. There will be times where you have Boots or Greaves on board and this will be an insane mini-Sun Titan, but the situation is too rare to justify its presence.
Sublime Archangel > No real interest here. Good creature but doesn't provide anything for the stax strategy.
Gift of Immortality / True Conviction > weird ''win con'' heavily situational cards based on creatures. There is some logic behind Gift, but it's just too much of a unreliable idea. True Conviction has nothing to do here... it's 6 mana spend to lose the control on the game. If you're searching for card advantage and a bit of healing, go for the brand new Dawn of Hope (also is a good mana sink).
Blackblade Reforged > intersting alternative win con. Feels slow nonetheless.
Emeria Shepherd > too slow for my liking.
Whispersilk Cloak > can't understand what this does in a deck full of flyiers and tapping effects.
Finally, as you want to challenge Vannifar, which is a blue deck, you'll need something to deal with the classical Cyclonic Rift . Teferi's Protection is a good solution (and it could also protects you form a lot of various situations / removals / etc.), but I'm sure you can find a lot of other response.
I hope you'll find useful ideas in this comment. Thanks a lot for sharing this, it reminds me good times. Keep up the good work, keep up brewing!
3 weeks ago
SamsWrath thanks for your deck advice! Mox Opal is going in as soon as I have enough spare cash. At the moment it doesn’t benefit to remove Gauntlet of Power and Extraplanar Lens , but once I’ve included the artifact lands (for metalcraft) and some of the quick mana you have suggested, the benefits of those cards will be eroded sufficiently.
I will be keeping the ramp spells you suggest in mind. I am currently testing extra turn cards Last Chance and Final Fortune , and once I have decided if to keep them I will move on to those. What’s your thoughts on Treasonous Ogre to pay life for ramp?
I couldn’t warrant City of Traitors but Dwarven Ruins and Sandstone Needle are going in for sure. Crystal Vein I am going to pass on as I have never been left wanting more colourless as the deck has numerous ways of producing it.
Torch Courier doesn’t give this deck enough benefit to earn a slot. I would typically play the haste card when I am all set to win. As this is targeted haste, the goblin army can’t swing out, requiring more pieces to win. Also, it doesn’t synergise with sacking Krenko back to the command zone and recasting with infinite mana.
Some great suggestions dude, thank you!
3 weeks ago
I know they're pet cards but, Extraplanar Lens and Gauntlet of Power are actually not very fast but rather, kind of clunky. I'd toss in Mox Opal and potentially more red ramp spells such as Lotus Petal , Simian Spirit Guide , Rite of Flame , Desperate Ritual , Pyretic Ritual and Seething Song .
Torch Courier is another good way to give Krenko haste and doubles as a body for Krenko if he doesn't need the haste.
For all-around spell reduction Helm of Awakening is an excellent option!
If you add in more ramp I think you can reduce your total land count to 30-31 without issue.
3 weeks ago
Out of curiosity, I did a quick search of MTG top 8 to see what reserve list cards were being played. In the top 50 cards, the following reserve list cards appear: Volcanic Island , Underground Sea , City of Traitors , Bayou , Tundra , Mox Diamond , and Badlands . If you limit this search to non-land cards, Mox Diamond and Lion's Eye Diamond are the only two reserve list cards to make the top 50.
Those are all great cards, but their representation does not seem high enough to say "the reserve list is killing legacy." It may play a small role by increasing the cost of some cards, but it is far from the format's biggest problem.
I think competition from Modern (both in terms of players and in terms of demand for cards being used in both formats driving up price), Wizards not providing support for Legacy, and the rarity with which new cards that shake up Legacy are printed, are all bigger threats to the format than the Reserve List.
1 month ago
Like the list. Saw this on the PlayEDH discord and it's most certainly not high, but rather tier 2 or 1. (Comeptitve of max power respectively.) With the fetches added this becomes tier 1 without Gaea's Cradle, City of Traitors, or Bazaar of Baghdad due to the insane draw capability. Looks skid though.
City of Traitors occurrence in decks from the last year
All decks: 0.63%
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.01%