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|Commander / EDH||Legal|
|Commander: Rule 0||Legal|
Force of Vigor
If it's not your turn, you may exile a green card from your hand rather than pay this spell's mana cost.
Destroy up to two target artifacts and/or enchantments.
2 months ago
So to flesh out the mana base, in essence I would recommend: - increasing the number of dual lands over basic lands and the quality of the dual lands, i.e. Verdant Catacombs, Woodland Cemetery and Nurturing Peatland. (Having perfect fixing often is the difference between winning and losing.) - and just bumping up the number of lands to something like 21, I know it would feel weird in a deck with so many mana dorks, but in the outlandish event you face a deck playing Fury or Fire / Ice, I think you'll be happy to have land-drop number four over mana dork number four.
Secondly, since you fancy playing Devoted Druid in the main deck, maybe you could take advantage of her combo potential or at least her synergies with cards like Tyvar, Jubilant Brawler especially in place of Tyvar Kell who I don't seeing being a very impactful four-drop. Or alternatively, you could just cut a few mana-dorks for a playset of Waste Nots who would help get you some advantage off of the opponent's discard. And while on the topic, I would suggest playing more just strict "target opponent discards a card" like Funeral Charm over the hand-hate like Inquisition of Kozilek and Dread Fugue since a.) you don't really care about hating on the opponents pieces as much as just making them discard, b.) instant speed discard is always better than sorcery speed and c.) it scales better into the late game.
As well, side note, Harmonize over Beast Whisperer just seems a little too low-impact for the modern format, sure it's a guaranteed one-for-three, but at four-mana it doesn't touch the board and beast whisperer is probably a better investment with all your small creatures that ramp you into more small creatures ramp imo.
Lastly, you asked for some sideboard suggestions, I might play one or two Crippling Fear as one-sided board wipes. As well, pioneer sideboard all-star Go Blank might be good in this shell with some more main-deck discard synergies. Also, just general good green and black sideboard cards are like Veil of Summer, Force of Vigor and Fatal Push
Thats all that I have for how I might build this list, and I hope this was even mildly helpful! Overall, this is an interesting list! A solid idea that I find very similar to The Rack strategies in modern!
4 months ago
i really enjoyed the enforce that u had describing the deck and the mechanics.
i'm playing Lathiel for a long long time and i'm updating him a lot since then.
all the cards that u described i alredy test it, some of then still in the deck but mostly i had cut from the deck in order to be fastier and be more "Go for the troat" (my playgroup dont play easy haha).
firstly i wanna say the awesome cards that i wouldn't dare to touch that u metion before: Aetherflux Reservoir Authority of the Consuls Mangara, the Diplomat True Conviction Worldly Tutor Teferi's Protection Ozolith, the Shattered Spire Branching Evolution Light of Promise Well of Lost Dreams Scholar of New Horizons Tribute to the World Tree Esper Sentinel
it took me a long time to get this deck better and i still getting some frustations but if you like to consider, here some tips of cards to be implemented in order to have a better experience with it: ( mostly of this cards i proxed it because i dont wanna spend a lot of money and because i dont have a headache changing they every 2 months when wizards bring some new things )
starting with the nasty combos :
God Mode ( infinity mana + infinity draw :D ) : Argothian Elder or Priest of Titania + Quirion Ranger+ Ashaya, Soul of the Wild + Beast Whisperer with Eternal Witness in the deck u can even cast your grave again
ramp : Marwyn, the Nurturer : counters will get him a good ramp Mirari's Wake : awesome ramp Land Tax: can save you in early game Burgeoning : get ahead Priest of Titania : every elf in the battlefield Exploration : get ahead again Arbor Elf : very good with Selesnya Sanctuary or some mana that u need Mana Reflection: awesome ramp Circle of Dreams Druid : gaeas crandle in creature Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx : why not ? proxy <3 Crop Rotation: get those good lands in battlefield Carpet of Flowers: very good against 2 or more people Smothering Tithe : just perfect
draw : Generous Patron: our green budget risky study, perfect in lathiel Guardian Project : good in general The Great Henge : we have big creatures so probably will cost onle 2 green mana Toski, Bearer of Secrets : unstapable, can't be countered and draw Archivist of Oghma: meh... sometimes good sometimes not, but its 2 mana
tutors: Finale of Devastation : go for the troat Enlightened Tutor: very good tutor in our deck Eladamri's Call : get those pieces that u need Fauna Shaman : get those pieces that u need Defense of the Heart: this is funny, but moste of times works haha Yisan, the Wanderer Bard : good in general Natural Order : to the battlefield! Primal Command : say goodbye to ur grave zombie players
utility: Akroma's Will: defense or end game Alhammarret's Archive : it's 5 mana, but double life gain and double draw Eternal Witness : u have awesome cretures that people wanna destroy so... also good piece of combo God Mode Elesh Norn, Mother of Machines : Hushbringer + Hardened Scales, but better Serra Ascendant: sooooo goood in this deck ... first piece to be tutored by yisan, the wanderer bard Angel of Destiny: go for the troat Ashaya, Soul of the Wild: combo, but also a big creature Overwhelming Stampede : go for the troat Walking Ballista: good in general andd combo Cleric Class: combo but also grave Spike Feeder : Snowball effect, one of the best synergy of lathiel, 'each turn' change counters for life/
4 months ago
bingo. this is exactly what I was talking about, just a couple of things:
Sigarda, Font of Blessings
ugghh the problem is thinking what to drop as the list seems solid as is.
Taurean Mauler: though I see why it would be good
Shadowspear: good, but you it is better in more classic control decks
Force of Vigor: you probably have enough removal for this
Chaos Warp: Probably would be fine without
^^^ Most of the above suggestions are to help improve the control matchups^^^
5 months ago
- Fae Offering
++ Introduces a fun little minigame. ++ Exciting with Academy Manufactor
-- Unable to trigger on opponents' turns without flash creatures, but that's minor
++ Pet reanimation spell, fantastic with with tokens
- Invasion of Ikoria
Flip (+ maybe Vampire Hexmage)
-- Can't fetch amazing humans (Yawgmoth, Thran Physician, Species Specialist, Eternal Witness, Pitiless Plunderer, Jaheira, Friend of the Forest)
++ Less salt-inducing wincon than Natural Order->Craterhoof Behemoth or a giant Finale of Devastation
++ Battles are a fun minigame when not fetching Hexmage
-- Hexmage is lackluster on its own
-- Not as guaranteed of a win condition as a big Finale
-- The Invasion being a permanent opens it up to removal before it flips
- Llanowar Elves et al
++ Get Chatterfang out on turn 2 to start going ham sooner
- Nested Shambler back in
++ BB to double your squirrel count still seems good
- Force of Vigor
++ Creature spot removal is shored up by Chatterfang and all other removal spells hit creatures, so might be reasonable to have this not
++ Probably better in-slot than Binding the Old Gods
- Craterhoof Behemoth
== If Invasion of Ikoria Flip goes in
++ Cutting makes Natural Order worse, but also no longer as groan-inducing
- Finale of Devastation
== If Invasion of Ikoria Flip goes in
- Witch's Oven
++ Cheap sac outlet that works with Academy Manufactor and Gilded Goose -- Slow and food otherwise sucks.
-- The bonus only really happens if Chitterspitter has gone up several times
++ Is fetchable with Urza's Saga, but it's the worst option of the current three. Always fetch Skullclamp over this.
- Tireless Tracker
-- Second-worst token maker behind Witch's Oven
-- Only eight fetchlands + Binding the Old Gods and Growing Rites of Itlimoc Flip to double-trigger
++ Does qualify as a (slow) draw engine
++ Works with Academy Manufactor
- Binding the Old Gods
-- Worst ramp and worst removal
++ Removal count is still moderately low, though. Can't rely on Chatterfang's ability for everything.
-- Probably worse in slot than Force of Vigor
- Saw in Half
++ Does function as bad protection against spot removal -- Not a lot of nonlegendary creatures worth copying that don't already win the game, so often dead
Deep Forest Hermit
-- Even when there is a target, often win-more
6 months ago
Allright, so here's the "how the fk does it work?" part.
The deck is a prett slow one that takes some time before it really activates, so several cards both in the main deck and side board are there to mitigate the pressure that we might suffer from early plays. Lightning Bolt, Fire / Ice and Arboreal Grazer fills these slots in the main deck.
What the deck wants to do is generally to discard lands with Seismic Assault to deal damage to the enemy, then use cards such as Wrenn and Six, Life from the Loam and Slogurk, the Overslime to recur those lands to your hand again.
Trade Routes is used for 3 reasons. The first is pretty straight forwards, use your land cards in hand to generate new cards. Second use is to be able to play your channel lands early in the game to give mana while being able to pick them up later in the game to use their channel effect. And the third one is to make Slogurk, the Overslime to grow rapidly. If you discard a land and opt to dredge a Life from the Loam, Slogurk, the Overslime can grow anywhere between +1 to +4 +1/+1 counters for a single mana, ontop of digging for utility lands that you can return later.
Sadly I have not had a lot of time playtesting it, and I think that the sideboard needs a lot of work. First and foremost I feel like I have doubled down a bit too hard on artifact hate, albeit with a lot of cards with multi purpose.
Anyways, the rundown of why I included the cards are as follows: Damping Sphere was included to stop decks such as tron and titan, and it also works well versus decks such as breach or storm or other more jank combos such as neobrand.
Brotherhood's End was included to deal with asmo decks, affinity, prison tron, goblins, merfolk and other similar decks to these.
Otawara, Soaring City is just so that you are more likely to draw them, especially in matchups where they run pithing needle to stop Boseiju, Who Endures, but is also really good for returning combo pieces to hand, or just big beaters like murktide. Its also really good vs tokens.
Boseiju, Who Endures just a really solid card, deals with most problems the deck faces, such as graveyard hate and blood moon effects.
Cards that I would like to experiment with: Expressive Iteration is a card that I am gonna experiment with in place of Fire / Ice. I think that Fire / Ice is much better at stalling out the game, but expressive is such a valuable card to have in the mid game.
Orvar, the All-Form versus decks that enjoy discarding your hand, so generally versus decks that runs archong or liliana.
I hope you enjoyed the read, give me some thoughts in the comments if you have any =)
9 months ago
Combo players, in semi-competitive, do not care about this card. It will never be a road block to their combo decks. It will die right away or be countered. Boom and that's all they wrote. Counterspell cards would be more effective against combo players.
Again, I do not care about the Yarok, the Desecrated part of the card. That really doesn't matter too much.
The problem which I have with Elesh Norn, Mother of Machines is the very large amount of judge rulings, player errors, and misrepresentation which will occur.
It is inevitable these will occur.
How many times have you seen someone in your play group do any of the following actions:
- Use a fetch land or Rampant Growth while Stranglehold is in play
- Use a "Pact" card, such as Pact of Negation, and forget to pay the cost on the next upkeep
- Use Force of Vigor on their turn by exiling a green card
- Resolve a spell of X CMC into Chalice of the Void
- Forget about taking damage from City of Brass
- Forget to about cumulative upkeep abilities on Mystic Remora or Elephant Grass
- Forget to draw two cards after their spell got an Arcane Denial or add the X mana from Mana Drain
- Equip Lightning Greaves while Damping Matrix is in play
- Forget the "Ward" cost to target
- Play Swords to Plowshares for one mana into Trinisphere
- Draw before using Wild Evocation
In a casual meta takebacks are generally acceptable. Assuming not too much time or actions have past.
Elesh Norn, Mother of Machines is a engine for these kind of effects. Unless you're a very sticker for the rules, half the time you'll have to deal with so many takebacks. It's a headache.
I'd probably just scoop to this card if I don't have an out in-hand.
At least Winter Orb isn't going to cause massive takebacks.
10 months ago
Hey, thank you! ive spent alot of time working on it for a while now. ive thought about Out of the Tombs but i find it very easy to disrupt and with an empty library id rather be going for the win than to add to the board. im also trying to find a spot for Shadowspear , Force of Vigor , and Rings of Brighthearth i see the Perpetual Timepiece in your sideboard, i used to run it but found it too slow for my playgroup. now i like the interaction with life from the loam with Teferi, Master of Time instead.
11 months ago
I noticed that there isn't a sideboard detailed, and I did notice how your mana based is arranged, so I'll take it you prefer Bant () colored spells. I'd recommend:
- Vines of Vastwood
- Blossoming Calm
- Dovin's Veto
- Vapor Snag
- Aether Gust
- Luminarch Aspirant
- Veil of Summer
- Broken Bond
- Blacksmith's Skill
- Built to Last
- Ancient Stirrings (can't remember if this is on the ban list or not..)
I noted that you said you haven't constructed this yet so I keep that in mind with my recommendations; afterall, Broken Bond may do what you need it to better than Force of Vigor but honestly go off, either way, I see the great potential you have to make this an unorthodox at your local tourney. It would certainly raise eyebrows, and I think it could be fun. Best of luck with your building!