Liliana of the Veil

Planeswalker — Liliana

+1: Each player discards a card.

-2: Target player sacrifices a creature.

-6: Separate all permanents target player controls into two piles. That player sacrifices all permanents in the pile of their choice.

Discussion (48)

BEDECK on Emrakul Griselbrand Suicide Shadow Resurrection

20 hours ago

Hmmmm. Are you really ok with all the life loss? If you happen to need to go Fetch Land > Blood Crypt > Faithless Looting > Lotus Petal > Reanimate you lose a ton of life...

I was thinking you could build the "traditional" BR Reanimator but with Emrakul (without Street Wraith, Bauble, Cabal Ritual and Simian Spirit Guide). The traditional version has a 60-80% consistency of a turn1/2 combo already.

If you choose to do so you would have 16 free slots. You could go with 4 Exhume, 4 Collective Brutality for some counterspell protection, 4 other creatures of choice that you like and 4 Thoughtseize.

I'm speaking from the veteran BR Reanimate player perspective that the opponent will usually have something to deal with you. Usually it is Karakas, Innocent Blood, Sudden Edict, Liliana of the Veil or a counterspell or something. Sometimes you can even lose because their creatures alone are faster than you (if you lose 16 life reanimating stuff).

So adding some other options as a "toolbox" could be good. Big beater creatures that mess up their plans are nice.

Sideboard

About the sideboard I was thinking the Wastelands may not be too effective.

If you are worried facing against troublesome Lands deck, I would recommend Magus of the Moon (since you can tutor and reanimate it). For creatures, usually a simple Pyroclasm does the trick. If you want to be fancy there is also Firestorm that may enable your combo.

For interaction you'll usually be worried about opposing Grafdigger's Cage, Leyline of the Void, Rest in Peace, etc. So to counter that you can either splash another color (white/green) or deal with it the same way Mono Black Reanimator deals with it: Ratchet Bomb and Feed the Swarm.

If you see too many counterspells it is always nice to have cheap good old Duress.

I think Engineered explosives was a nice touch. Just as By Force.

I think you can have a more effective 'change the target' effect with Ricochet Trap with all the blue in Legacy.

Blast Zone is interesting, but with so much Wasteland in the format it becomes unusable quite often.

I don't know what decks you are playing against and maybe it already works just fine in your meta/playgroup...

But I'm a BR Reanimator player of 6-8 years with it and I wanted to give some insights :V

wallisface on Obliterator devotion

4 days ago

Some thoughts:

• 20 lands seems super low when you're trying to cast 4-and-5-drop cards. I'd raise it up to 23 at a minimum, probably 24.

• Liliana Vess is just not worth it. If you can't afford the more expensive Liliana of the Veil, I personally wouldn't bother with Planeswalkers at all. You don't want to be playing any 4-or-5-drops outside of Obliterator and Gary, imo, as otherwise you'll just make your deck too clunky.

• Bone Shards seems bad because you want to be getting permanents into play. and keeping them there. There are also far, far better options than Doom Blade. I would suggest replacing both of these with the new Infernal Grasp

• 4 copies of Village Rites feels excessive. To be honest, i'm not sure running any copies is worthwhile in this shell, because you don't gain much from losing creatures. I think this would be better spent on cards that actually increase your devotion (Phyrexian Arena comes to mind, if you're after card draw).

zapyourtumor on Carth the Lion and his Aplanesing Friends

1 month ago

Oath of Nissa, Grist, the Hunger Tide, Liliana of the Veil

CoSM0 on An Immature Pun (Modern Black Devotion)

1 month ago

less than 4 obliterator in a devotion deck just feels like a mistake. it's an absurdly good card and it's only drawback is the mana cost so in a deck that makes that an upside it should be a 4 of. Dread shade just feels like a horrible magic card i'd play most black creatures over it, even here. I'd cut some of the weird creature choices and replace them with Liliana of the Veil, Inquisition of Kozilek and some actual removal spells like Sudden Edict and Bloodchief's Thirst. Mono black devotion plays best when it's a mono black midrange attrition deck that can get some extra value from it's mono-coloredness. Nykthos, Gary, and Coffers are just good cards in a mono black deck, you don't need to play bad cards to make them work.

TypicalTimmy on Proxies, yay or nay?

1 month ago

I once played against a guy who was running Elfball and, after tutoring for something, he goes "awe shit, I forgot Birds."

He desleeved a basic Forest, took out a black sharpie and began writing the information on it.

Naturally the table just stopped and went WHAT THE FUCK?? His reply was that it was MORE THAN fair because he was losing a basic Forest from it.

This guy would also purposely place his "exile" pile ON TOP of his library, turned sideways. Then "accidentally" shuffle it together when he had the chance.

Or he would draw more than 1 card each draw step, chuckle and go "oh man, oops. I'll just put this back."

He was the reason that for many years I was strictly against them. He would pull this kind of shit all the time. His worst offenses were printing off card images on printer paper and sleeving them DURING THE GAME going "oh man I thought I had this in here?"

But, I've matured and grow to realize that this guy was just an asshole and a cheater.

I have proxies. A few. I have the $200 Cradle but I also got a $50 proxy off of Etsy with some supremely beautiful artwork and foiling. I also own two proxy playsets of Liliana of the Veil in various lingerie because weebs gonna weeb.

I do not actually own other proxies, and I own the real copy of both Cradle and Liliana. However, I have intentions to make my own proxies so I can play with my $3,000 decks while I slowly buy the cards over time.

I can not justify dropping several grand to play the game, but I also don't want to be forced into sitting it out either while I save.

So I want to play the game and drop $50 or $200 here and there as it slowly builds and comes together.

I believe that's the "right" way to use proxies. But, again, not everyone can spend $200 on a single card, meaning they will likely never own it.

And to me, being forced to sit outside while others have fun because you are not as financially blessed as others has got to be one of the biggest middle fingers WOTC can give us.

zapyourtumor on 8 rack grief

1 month ago

I've been playing a Grief 8-rack build for some time and I have some comments on your build that I hope you find helpful.

For one thing, Feign Death is strictly worse than Undying Evil, except with multiple copies on the same creature. More about the creature/flicker package: If you flicker a Kroxa with Ephemerate the rebound is wasted since it still dies either way. And you don't have a further target if you topdeck another flicker spell/undeath spell later. Also, you have to wait until t3 to get any value from the flickering. This is why I suggest running a creature like Burglar Rat or Elderfang Disciple instead. Also, you have 10 flicker cards but only 8 creature targets. While the flicker cards are dead cards by themselves, the creatures aren't, which is why I advise going down on the flicker cards and going up on the creatures.

For the discard suite, you currently have 12 targeted hand disruption spells, 4 Grief, IoK, and TS. This seems really overboard for me, since those spells tend to be bad late-game topdecks (and this deck aims to put the game into topdeck mode asap). I suggest cutting down some on those and putting in some Blackmail and/or Raven's Crime. Also Liliana of the Veil is a really powerful card in any 8rack build. I'd move them from the sideboard to the mainboard, leaving up more space for hate cards in the sideboard.

About the manabase. You also have barely any lands. Even without Smallpox, 18 lands is really low. I would recommend 20 at the bare minimum. Not sure why City of Brass is there either. And you have 4 Urborgs and no fetches. For a three color deck, CoB should not be needed and I highly recommend you go with a fetch shock manabase with Bloodstained Mire and Marsh Flats (and maybe one Savai Triome. Mishra's Factory is also generally better than Mutavault.

Using Ensnaring Bridge to defend against creature-based strategies is a complete nonbo with the deck's strategy of attacking with Grief and Kroxa. You also have no spot removal in the entire deck, which means it is really difficult to deal with creatures you want to remove that don't attack. I suggest swapping out the Bridges for some spot removal. Also you're in mardu colors which means you can run Prismatic Ending along with Lightning Bolt and Fatal Push.

About the sideboard: Feed the Swarm is played in most monoblack lists because it is the only enchantment removal in monoblack. You're mardu, not mono-B, which means you have better options like Fragmentize, Fracture, Rip Apart, and Prismatic Ending. Grafdigger's Cage completely shuts down all of your Kroxa, Feign Death, Malakir Rebirth antics which makes it a terrible choice for graveyard hate. One sided hate like Soul-Guide Lantern and Leyline of the Void would be much better choices here.

zAzen7977 on Merchant, Marauder, Murderer

1 month ago

Hey StoryArcher, I have a lot of experience with black devotion - I’d like to share my thoughts with you (I am making suggestions regardless of budget considerations, since I don’t see the budget tag):

I concur with the other users above - you need to seriously consider mainboarding more cheap removal. Rider is good, but it’s expensive at 3 mana and also costs 2 life. It’s ok to run 1-2, but there’s a reason why Fatal Push is a mainstay in black decks. Especially if you run a few fetch lands to thin the deck and trigger revolt. Another good option is Dismember, which kills the germ created by Kaldra Compleat and other pesky indestructible creatures for as low as 1 mana. The new Infernal Grasp looks good too.

You are running too many Gray Merchant of Asphodel - 2 is enough. You don’t want them to clog up your hand, and your land count is lean at 22 lands.

Additional lifegain is also important. Consider a couple Collective Brutality to gain life and as backup removal/discard. Cling to Dust on the sideboard is very useful for lifegain and card drawing.

Sign in Blood is a weak card because it doesn’t further your board state. Phyrexian Arena is slower, but it draws you a card every turn and adds to devotion. Also Liliana, the Last Hope helps fish for creatures from your deck/graveyard. She is complimented well by Liliana of the Veil, which discards your own cards but her ultimate is game-ending. Geralf's Messenger is good but slow. I would cut them in favor of the Lilianas.

I don’t see the usefulness of Knight of the Ebon Legion. You aren’t running a tribal vampire deck, and it seems out of place. Consider Dauthi Voidwalker to add to your devotion and for built-in graveyard hate. There are more graveyard based decks than ever in today’s meta.

Other good choices are Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet for lifegain and zombie generation, and Tourach, Dread Cantor for discard and protection from white.

I concur with wallisface - splashing a little white for better removal on the sideboard is a big help in today’s meta. Lingering Souls is very useful to generate pressure in the early game and can be discarded by Liliana and Collective Brutality. Also Silent Clearing is a great way to draw additional cards. If you run 1-2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, you can turn your fetches and Silent Clearings into swamps and save life.

Here is a link to my list, for your reference:

TWIN LILIANA CONTROL - Black Devotion [Primer MH2]

Hope this helps! :)

Kazierts on Monoblack Infect [Competitive/Primer]

1 month ago

The Book of Vile Darkness is terrible for this deck. One creature each turn I lost at least 2 life is too slow, and considering it's legendary I would need to have more than one to make finding it more consistent, even though it doesn't synergizes with the strategy at all. Which brings me to the other point, it's not enough to be an alternate wincondition. The deck already has so much discord and I'm considering adding even more. Decks with a ton of removal won't be a problem (also Sword of Light and Shadow is recursion).

Hand of Vecna is a worse Lashwrithe. The only situation where the Hand is good, in this deck, is the early game. However,one thing this deck wants is to empty its hand so as to not have to discard to Liliana of the Veil's effect or Smallpox, which I'm thinking about adding. If the hand is too full, then Collective Brutality has more fuel, which in turn also weakens the Hand. By the late game, it's probably just gonna give +1/+1. Also, important to mention it's not a pump spell since it only pumps at the start of combat, giving opportunities for the creature to be removed. The card I'm considering putting in place of Runechanter's Pike is Bonesplitter as it allows to me empty my hand fastet.

Now, Eye of Vecna I actually thought about. Sadly, it runs into the worst problem of this deck, life loss. Thoughtseize, Castle Locthwain and the new additions Polluted Delta, Godless Shrine and Silent Clearing make me lose so much life. In the end, it's not very different from Sign in Blood or Night's Whisper, the difference being it provides long term card advantage instead of the two draws or the free scry of Mazemind Tome. Had Strixhaven given more useful lessons for black, I could see myself using Poet's Quill for its lifelink and maybe, in this case, I'd run the eye (which also suffers from being legendary).