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Nonbasic lands are Mountains.
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Blood Moon Discussion
15 hours ago
Hey was just looking this up to test something out and noticed you just put this up. Not sure if you're looking for suggestions and although I don't play this deck my buddy does and we playtest exclusively so I'm pretty sure how it runs. It seems this list very much resembles that guy on the pro tours' deck as I can see the sideboard tech he included and the nagging thoughts. I assume you know what each piece does in the deck after looking it up so i'll just address the changes my buddy and I made.
Not in any order: So the deck dies to any hand disruption because you need to keep a decent hand but once they know what you are playing they know which pieces to take out. 4X Leyline of Sanctity are very important in the sideboard for this reason and helps against burn decks that beat you before you can combo off.
The manabase only needs a few shocks. All green to play manadorks and red, white, and blue for ascendancy. So Hallowed Fountain and Steam Vents are not really needed and you would want more fetches. All the shock lands include green so my buddy uses the red green fetch. Sorry the name eludes me at this moment.
Now for the instants. My buddy plays 1 more Cerulean Wisps because he really likes that card, all the Manamorphose helps out against blood moon because you can play right through it but otherwise the card is subpar compared to other cantrips so I suggested playing 1 Manamorphose in side and 3 main in case game one you need to fetch it from the sideboard you still can. Noxious Revival has proven to be a powerhouse and is the only way to get a combo off on turn 2 because it costs 0 mana. He plays 4 just because other than getting the turn 2 combo it's just an ok card for 0 (it doesn't draw by itself). Silence is Time Walk. But the thing about this is you'll need to save a mana to be able to play it on their turn. Typically you'll want to try to find the combo pieces instead of stalling the opponent (they can still attack). it's really 12 for one and a dozen for another pick and choose with this card.
Although he doesn't run it I can see where Nagging Thoughts is good. You'll need 2 mana dorks (or a Fatestitcher to pull it off typically) but which resolving a card and drawing and discarding your creatures untap and you play another card, could be solid. Not sure but he doesn't run it.
He runs Dryad Arbor at the moment with Expedite along with View from Above just to make things go quicker. Because of this he runs more Abundant Growth to enchant his man land. As for other creatures he dropped a Fatestitcher because you don't need many, you can get him to the grave easy and bring him back fairly easy as well. He also runs a Noble Hierarch. Another 1 drop dork, 12 one a dozen another.
Rest of sideboard: I can see where Grapeshot is used but just use this card instead: Flesh / Blood. Mid combo you search for it, with a Fatestitcher you tap him and whatever other creature you have and whatever creature does 20+ damage to face. You win. Doing it this way frees up a sideboard slot. My buddy runs Meddling Mage. Just 1. It seems fun to search for and play it. There is also Fiery Justice in side. Seems good for little goblin decks or whatever. As for the rest of the sideboard we are still playing around. 1 Wear is good. It seems subpar to just kill one after searching but it still seems alright for Blood Moon or whatever else. The rest of his sideboard is being looked at so nothing else is really in there at the moment.
I think I hit on everything I can think of, hope it helped.
2 days ago
Given the large percentage of your lands being coloreless, I think you need to stay in White. Being able to hit those fog effects early is important, particularly against hyper-aggro decks, so I do not think you can afford to risk a lack of . While you could run Godless Shrine and its ilk to prevent mana screw, then you would be completely blown out of the water by Blood Moon.
Combined with how incredibly mediocre those enchantments are, the risk vastly outweighs the rewards.
Rahvin_dom on ZOa
3 days ago
It sounds like you want to:
- Slow down opponents' ability to cast spells, which forces opponents to keep cards in hand
- Force opponents to discard, limiting their options
- Use discard triggers to punish opponents
This sounds like it can work with Bolas. The risk I'd point out is with the discard punishers, specifically ones like Megrim and Liliana's Caress. They can be a little fragile - once the opponent no longer has any cards, you stop getting triggers. They're nice incidental damage and can add up, but you can't rely on them to actually close out the game. Bolas is also not ideally suited to the stax plan - he doesn't inherently break symmetry, so there are much better options for hard stax.
Wheels that discard are going to be excellent for you, getting a ton of discard triggers. Ignore wheels that shuffle and then draw without discarding.
Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur would be a pretty amazing, synergistic reanimation target. You should definitely run some reanimation effects if you plan to force opponents to discard - you can grab tasty targets from your own deck or theirs. Reanimate, Animate Dead, Necromancy, Dance of the Dead are a good start.
Back to Basics doesn;t stop you from using your own fetches (even budget slow-fetches) since you only use those once - they don;t need to untap. Blood Moon works, and it sets your nonbasics to one of your actual colors, but it also turns all your fetches into Mountains. Watch out for that.
I'd also look at Ruination. It's MLD...but it only blows up non-basic lands. It's exactly what you're doing with the enchantments, but with removal.
You already seem to know the mana rock drill from your Nekusar deck. You want to lean heavily on the mana rocks - all of the 2CMC signets/talismans/Fellwar Stone. Fellwar is going to get much less useful once you land Bloood Moon though. Star Compass is useful since you'll be loading heavily on basic lands. Coldsteel Heart is useful to plug a specific color hole. Obviously Sol Ring. You're going to be looking for color fixing more than anything, so Chromatic Lantern is worth the extra mana, and any Mox you can afford are worthwhile (except Mox Amber, that one's less useful).
You need land fetching. Grixis Panorama is normally not a recommendation, but it can find any of your three colors, not just two, and you're already basically excluding fetchable duals with the stax effects. Journeyer's Kite and Thaumatic Compass Flip, Armillary Sphere, Pilgrim's Eye, Skittering Surveyor, Solemn Simulacrum, Sword of the Animist, Wayfarer's Bauble are all at least playable. The ETB creatures are useful if you plan to abuse Nicol Bolas, the Ravager Flip's ETB effect - you can use blink effects and Panharmonicon to get extra triggers.
Blood Moon and Back to Basics are great, but they likely are not enough to consistently slow opponents enough to be wroth all of this workaround by themselves. Even Ruination doesn't add enough. Unfortunately Grixis doesn;t have any of the neat land-untap triggers like Nature's Will or Seedborn Muse - if it did, you could abuse things like Stasis and Rising Waters and Static Orb more easily. Still, you could support Winter Orb with enough mana rocks. Be sure to run good one-sided artifact removal like Vandalblast to keep opponents from using their own rocks.
And of course Omniscience can let you blow up all the artifacts and lands and still play what you want. You'll be running a ton of rocks anyway, which could ramp you into it fairly early.
The big thing, though, is how you want to win. Stax doesn;t work super well on its own - you need to be using stax to slow your opponents down so that you can pull off your own win condition. Do you have any ideas on how youd like to win, even if just generally? Combat, combos, punisher effects like Megrim, mill, etc?
3 days ago
AdvancedSteelGuard, Blood Stax probably means Blood Pod, a deck that is based around controlling the board with creatures that hate out specific decks and stop them from playing, while using Birthing Pod and other tutor s to get the right hate.
5 days ago
Sorry I should have clarified. I meant how I helped TheErebos not asking him for advice. To go with your questions.
How well do you know cEDH? You do know that unless your running a combo deck multiple pieces of cards as a win con is too slow. You said you want to make a Boros color as competitive as possible. The cards you listed are not optimal and subpar.
You mentioned that you want to build a value town/stax(prison) hybrid. You are delving into combo pieces and not part of the lines you set your self up for. The main reason I listed the partners as commanders is because in a competitive meta life is a valuable resource if your going against Ad Naus type of decks the pressure Akiri gives is great. Having all the mana rocks in addition to stax/hate pieces will boost up her power and rack up damage as well as staxing the board. You break parity by gaining additional creatures for the value and go hatebears to swing and chip away at their life slowly while Bruse helps micro manage and enables higher outputs of damage.
- Aven Mindcensor
- Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
- Containment Priest
- Ethersworn Canonist
- Magus of the Moon
- Imperial Recruiter
- Recruiter of the Guard
- Treasure Nabber
- Vryn Wingmare
- Eidolon of Rhetoric
- Hokori, Dust Drinker
- Hushwing Gryff
- Linvala, Keeper of Silence
- Sanctum Prelate
- Spirit of the Labyrinth
- Thalia, Heretic Cathar
- Harsh Mentor
- Cursed Totem
- Defense Grid
- Grafdigger's Cage
- Mana Web
- Null Rod
- Orb of Dreams
- Sphere of Resistance
- Static Orb
- Tangle Wire
- Thorn of Amethyst
- Torpor Orb
- Tsabo's Web
- Ward of Bones
- Winter Orb
- Blood Moon
- Blind Obedience
- Price of Glory
- Aura of Silence
- Porphyry Nodes
- Rest in Peace
- Rule of Law
- Stony Silence
1 week ago
That's what's counterintuitive about this deck. I'm tapping out for a do-nothing enchantment, but also slamming an eldrazi titan or Progenitus later that turn or on my opponent's end step. Also, enchantment hate is ridiculously rare. Assassin's Trophy and Destructive Revelry are really the only things people are running right now. Blood Moon is the strongest enchantment in modern and it's easier to play around than remove. And, even if someone does try and remove it, I just Shoal in response.
1 week ago
Aphoticate perfectly fine double posts happen to the best of us xD.
Now onto why I doubt Kess Stax will work in tier 1.
TO start, 99 card commanderless colorless stax was a Tier 3 deck meant to prove every deck is worth tier three when built competitively. I would never call it tier one as is.
Now, mass discard? I would want some examples of that. I mean, I would love to see that.
I mean, Oppression, Bottomless Pit, and Necrogen Mists aren't exactly great unless you are really a black stax deck like Nath, and nath is about it. I mean monoblack stax can use it, but Kess breaking parity on that isn't really worth it.
Also, you claim now that you aren't a cEDH guru, yet before you claimed that the reason behind Ishai's impressive showing in the competitive tier was due to her commander damage ability, and that with Vial Smasher, until I explained that outside of Yuriko/Edric/Blood Pod, a cEDH deck that deals damage through combat in general is bad, and you caved. (November 20th as archived)
Or, when you kept insisting that Wort was a tier 4 deck on this when it was listed Tier 3, and claiming that my 99 card colorless commanderless stax lsit was impossible, before again, caving under the realization you were wrong. (November 9th as archived.)
Or, when you claimed that Liliana, Heretical Healer Flip and Erebos, God of the Dead weren't worth the spot they were given, until Soren841 and I explained to you how breaking parity and mono-black stax worked. Guess who caved? Hint, you. (November 8th as archived)
Or, when you were randomly asking people on this list about decks you should make outside of cEDH, completely wasting the use of the comment system, forgetting that the forums exist. You also dissed on Sidisi and Razaketh a bit. (November 6th as archived)
Or, when you wanted to know about Nath elfball, claiming it was too janky for cEDH, and I had to explain to you how the deck worked, and that tokens were a wincon, even without Earthcraft and Squirrel Nest. After I explained, you didn't respond. (October 23 as archived.)
Or, when you claim that Anafenza, the Foremost, a powerful stax hatebear deck that can shut down tons of Tier 1-2 combo decks on her own without an answer was 'unsynergistic' and Abzan Falconer was better than Gaddock Teeg. You caved to DangoDaikazoku, ForsakenxEDHx and me (October 20th as archived)
Or, when you enthusiastically claimed that something absurd was true or something considerably powerful was trash, someone else or me explains with common, rational sense that you are wrong.
And you cave
(Always as archived)
Do you see why I think you are conceited and have no idea what you are talking about?
1 week ago
I never claimed that perception didn't make it seem worse, however perception doesn't make it worse. Players who don't play around MLD might be screwed, if they don't sandbag unnecessary lands they are asking for it though.
This idea is a very simple one that many players, especially in EDH are familiar with, "overextending into a board wipe". Heard of it?
My points never stated that players should love MLD, they shouldn't, but they can't cope with things they outright ban, and you trying to support their idealistic world of no interaction is downright disgusting. If a player loses to something, they should either
A: Not get mad, because it was a loss out of luck.
B: Not get mad, learn something from it, perhaps play around it, change their playstyle.
C: Get mad, because the loss was unwarranted, and was predicated on collusion (players teaming up outside of the game), something outside of the game outside of collusion (an example is a player conceding when you stole a permanent of theirs, therefor depriving you of a resource you fairly gained), or something inside of the game that is broken for obvious reasons, such as a combo that is particularly degenerate due to game rules that do not work in the given format (many believe Felidar Sovereign falls under this category).
Which does land destruction fall under? No one has been able to convince me that C is the appropriate response, and a deck built around it is most likely much more consistent than A would have me believe.
This implies that B is the proper response.
If you think we should frown upon learning experiences, you know, like any interaction, win, or play in any game of magic, then you might as well not play, or is there something so integrally broken about the removal of lands that it in particular is the focus of contempt?
"MLD leaves many players bitter in a way that no other strategy does."
Leovold shutting off hands, GAAIV stax type decks, stax decks of nearly any kind, decks that use Blood Moon, Contamination, Back to Basics, Static Orb, Hall of Gemstone, Winter Orb, Stasis, Tangle Wire, and other cards of that vein, decks that abuse discard like Nath and any deck with Sadistic Hypnotist for that matter, any deck that takes advantage of infinite turns or particularly long turns that imply storm or another slow to watch, difficult to interact with once it is going off style deck.
Yes, many of these are frowned upon, yet Land Destruction is the target of much more hate. Why? Can you explain that to me?
Above was my argument to anyone like Shrazik who reads your BS, , I honestly didn't dislike you until the last paragraph.
Nope, not one bit, but at that point I was considering going off on you, however thought that anyone who read this would think I didn't have a rebuttal to your first 5 paragraphs. Those are above.
Here is a quote, sentence #2, paragraph #6, comment #26. Don't hand me BS like this anecdote again, as anyone with half-working eyes and a quarter-working brain can see that it won't work:
"Recently, a fairly competitive pod of 4 I was playing in lost to a Lord Windgrace deck that cast Silence + Armageddon + Splendid Reclamation on turn 6 - it was a brilliant play and the game was over in less than 10 minutes from that play."
Nice, a jund (Lord Windgrace's color identity of , , and ) deck that can run Armageddon and Silence. Also, nice that a combo that a third grader could see from miles away is considered "brilliant" in a moderately competitive table. BTW that combo takes 9 mana and seems like hot trash for even moderate cEDH IMO, specifically Splendid Reclamation, as Windgrace can do that effect himself.
Also, try not to claim that Ruination and Autumn's Veil are the cards at hand, or that he cycled Decree of Annihilation, or that Impending Disaster was the real effect, as all of those are extremely different and memorably so.
I almost could respect you.
Shrazik I hope your eyes glanced over the end, so you didn't see 's BS in the last paragraph that you quoted, however I will attempt to answer your questions anyway.
"Going a little off topic here but do you think that delves deeper into a more community based issue? One where players would ignore how wrong or right a strategy/playstyle might be in favor of their own perception of what should or shouldn't be played within their playgroup?"
This is the reason that I personally don't play casual EDH, it is competitive EDH, but less compassionate to new strategies, and is so toxic I just can't handle it.
The vast majority of formats, cEDH, Standard, Modern, Pauper, Legacy, Vintage, etc. are all more accepting than casual EDH, so I have just had to stop playing it. Almost every other MTG community is cool with land destruction, Ponza lists in modern are fun midrange strategies that blow up lands and want to go turn one Arbor Elf, turn two Utopia Sprawl and get 4 mana for some sick plays early on. It is a nice and hilarious deck.
Other times it has occurred in modern like in some newer Ramunap Excavator/Azusa, Lost but Seeking/Ghost Quarter lists with Collected Company in modern the decks have been cool but not oppressive, and though they can be rough matchups for some decks, they aren't ever called out to be banned or anything, and even in Vintage when Shops, a deck with some land destruction (Strip Mine, etc.) was a problem the issue was the turn one Lodestone Golem, not land destruction, and no one really minded or thought Wasteland should be restricted, but the Golem should.
As you can see, toxicity of casual EDH isn't much further, but is a problem for a lot of less toxic players who play EDH casually and want to bring a fun, janky Hokori, Dust Drinker to the table, but are banned from playgroups (anecdotal, and an example, not anyone I know, but I have heard of this situation).
Outside of land destruction, I think combo is pretty fair game as long as it doesn't do something unable to be interacted with. Like Flash Hulk turn two is cool, but Spell Pierce exists, so does Spell Snare, Swan Song, Containment Priest, Rest in Peace, Grafdigger's Cage, Leyline of the Void, Force of Will, etc.