|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Commander 2019 (C19)||Uncommon|
|Premium Deck Series: Graveborn (GRV)||Uncommon|
|2012 Core Set (M12)||Uncommon|
Combos Browse all
Discard two cards: Create a 2/2 black Zombie creature token.
Zombie Infestation Discussion
2 weeks ago
Dude! I think you're selling yourself short with this one! You could put wayyy more tokens into this and break it... get those Blood Artist triggers.
Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder , Infernal Genesis , Awaken the Erstwhile , Plague of Vermin , Worm Harvest , Izoni, Thousand-Eyed , Spider Spawning , Tombstone Stairwell ... Tendershoot Dryad ... I can go on :)
Stinkweed Imp ... more dredge!
Hogaak was so good they had to ban him in Modern lol.
1 month ago
Alright, lets look at Loyal Retainers in another way.
You're running 7 legendary creatures outside of your commanders (which we will assume you WONT send to GY), so there are only 7 creatures that Loyal Retainers can return. Assuming a 99 card deck, 7 in starting hand, and 2 specific cards to see (retainers + legend), you've got a 7% chance to get Retainers, and a 41% chance to have one of your legends in your opener. After 5 draws, you're only at a 60% chance to hit a legend.
Now lets compare to Life . Same chance to see the card, 7%, but it works with 29 creatures instead of 7. Geometric calculator is telling me 91% chance to see a creature in your opener that works with Life . After 5 draws, 98.8% that you'll have a critter.
Obviously Retainers does have some benefit. It can be used to make an infinite etb/ltb loop for winning. How valuable is that to your deck though? Loyal Retainers can only be used BEFORE combat on your turn, and Tymna gives you cards AFTER combat. Your main source of card advantage is going to cause you to have to wait a rotation after finding all the pieces to your combo. This is a massive downside. You can already assemble infinite loops with Saffi + Titan, or Saffi + Karmic.
Lets imagine another scenario. You have the Saffi on the board with Retainers, but you have Sun Titan/Karmic Guide in the graveyard. Loyal Retainers can't grab that half of your combo back for you.
- Sacrifice Saffi Eriksdotter targeting Karmic Guide
- Sacrifice Karmic Guide . It returns to battlefield, we put ETB trigger on stack targeting Reveillark
- After Reveillark returns to battlefield, we sacrifice Karmic guide. We now have both Saffi + Guide in GY
- Reveillark is sacrificed, we will return both Saffi AND Karmic.
- We now pull creature 1 we want from GY with Karmic
- Sacrifice Saffi, targeting Karmic. Sacrifice Karmic, it returns from Saffi effect, giving us Reveillark again. Sac Karmic so its in GY, then sac Reveillark to give us Karmic + Saffi. Karmic entering gives us creature 2 from our GY. Rinse and repeat until you pull entire GY and combo finish.
You're running Kiki and splinter twin but you don't have any creature payloads to win. If you want to value reuse/copy creatures with an ETB, there are more cost efficient ways of doing it. I recommend you either cut these or put in Village Bell-Ringer or Combat Celebrant to have a Kiki payload. Overall though, I would just cut this combo.
You're running Yisan and Birthing Pod but you aren't running the cards to make them go. You need effects that untap them based off creature ETBs or actives, which are slot intensive. Yisan is dope, but if you aren't running the cards to support it you're running a slow tutor. Once again, I'd cut these if you aren't going to build around.
You are trying to fit too many combos in. Pick 1 or two that overlap in card usage and cut the others. Its better to do two things extremely well than it is to do 5 things mediocre. You should run reanimation loops + protean hulk + sac outlets, OR you should run kiki combo + pod/yisan lines. The hulk/animation loops both require sac outlets to be present on your field, while kiki/pod lines require untap effects. This will let you reuse your combo cards in multiple spots which will help reduce dead draws. Nothing feels worse than when you're holding 3 different pieces to three different combos that have very little utility outside combo lines. This is also why you're struggling to find space for more stax and ramp pieces.
You are also running a pretty high amount of beater cards. You should pare them down and run only the most efficient beater cards with high utility. Cathars' Crusade is a nice card but it does nothing on its own and buckles from Wrath effects. Compare to Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite which gives a buff but can also beat even if its your only creature. It also hurts your enemies board presence greatly. Bitterblossom is a fantastic card but you aren't getting as much value out of it because you aren't running enough pieces to slow down the game. Keep it but consider that a 1/1 flyer doesn't do much if your opponent is able to drop their giant dragon commander, you have to slow the game! Champion of Lambholt will provide you with free swings, but if you just lock the game out instead you don't need the evasion and this card doesn't beat that well. Custodi Soulcaller is a meme card, it requires either haste or an untap step (so its slow), you have to swing to use it, and its limited in what it can grab, and it gets worse the fewer players there are.
Price of Glory is a wonderful hate card, but unfortunately far less effective than you think. Compare to Grand Abolisher . Abolisher can beat down, which is your game plan. Abolisher 100% protects your combo window. Price of Glory doesn't stop the counterspell that stops your combo, it just exacts a massive price for your opponent casting it. However, when faced with the option of losing the game or losing two lands, every single opponent is going to choose the two lands. Strong card but you don't need to run it.
Zombie Infestation is a nice discard outlet, and great when you're ahead and have locked the board. Just like Bitterblossom though, you have to slow the game or this card will be outclassed by the casual stompy 6 drops that are allowed to hit the table. Stax up or cut out.
Cryptolith Rite is strong when you have a mana sink or tons of critters. Tymna will keep you stocked up on cards to dump with, while Tana gives you the critters. If you can afford it, Carpet of Flowers will outperform this card though. Keep it around if you don't have access to the Carpet.
What Goes In
So after cutting down all the shenanigans, heres what you want to add
DORKS: You get cards for hitting with creatures. Dorks are creatures that give mana and come out very fast. The maximum density of turn 1 dorks means Tymna turn 2, means free cards turn 3. This will improve the consistency of your deck more than anything else you can put in. You're currently missing Llanowar Elves Fyndhorn Elves Boreal Druid Deathrite Shaman Arbor Elf Elvish Mystic . These have the bonuses of working well with Priest of Titania and Elvish Archdruid , which will help you if you decide to run mana denial cards like Winter Orb or Armageddon (which I recommend both). Deathrite hates on GY and will ramp consistently with fetchlands which are prevalent in the format, extremely value. Arbor Elf can ramp more than 1 in tandem with Utopia Sprawl and Wild Growth . These dorks will help guarantee strong starts and consistent power to your deck I can't stress this enough.
ROCKS: Adding in the signets/talismans is going to ramp you, color fix you, and work in tandem with shutting off your opponents mana. Really really recommend these especially if your playtesting leaves you unhappy with mana availability.
STAX: This deck only works when you slow the game, I also want to stress this. Yeah you have some neat combos for winning discretely, but you are primarily a beater stax deck. Your commander gives you cards PER TURN, your other commander gives you CREATURES PER SWING. You want to games to go longer so you get more turns for more cards and more free creatures. It really isn't that hard dude. Cards that slow down the game will help you far more than they help your opponent, even symmetrical ones. This is why the deck runs Blood Moon despite being a four color deck. If you let your opponents start tutoring and dropping their big creatures, they will do better in combat than you and you will have a real bad day. If you hit their mana, stop their tutors and draw, and destroy their engines, you will pull ahead from the massive value you generate in the command zone. Please look at Root Maze Winter Orb Armageddon Rule of Law Deafening Silence Eidolon of Rhetoric Stranglehold Collector Ouphe Kataki, War's Wage
If you want to run a stax deck, you have to run the slow down pieces. If you want to build a cool reanimation combo deck, I recommend switching commanders or lists, take a peek at Karador Boonweaver
This list is certainly looking a lot better with the first round of revisions! With some more cuts and shaving off some combos, you will improve its efficiency a lot!
P.S. I couldn't open the choice guidelines tab you made sorry bud.
1 month ago
Depending on how competitive you want to be there are a few options, and a few powerful directions. Cabal Therapist is notable in being powerful hand disruption- other aristocrats cover various options, from the venerable flying brick Falkenrath Aristocrat to my pet pick Spawning Pit . Indulgent Aristocrat and vampire/human dual tribal is a fairly strong choice.
For a more aggressive gameplan hand disruption, even the humble Duress will offer a lot- dodging board wipes is valuable. Plan your sideboard too- it will help a lot to know that you have a plan for burn or artifacts, almost no matter what it is. Just keep an eye on your curve and remember the number of modern games being decided in turns 1-4 by aggro and combo lists.
2 months ago
2 months ago
sigh I long to find an interesting Windgrace deck, that isn't like all the rest. That being said, I do like some of the non-conforming choices for the deck like Akoum Firebird and Fork in the Road because those cards are really good but nobody ever plays them because: "Oh just play craterhoof and some degenerate land stuff" if you couldn't tell I'm a bit worn out on Windgrace but this deck was a nice breath of fresh air.
Here's a little advice, it's okay to not have the most powerful deck, not everything has to be optimized. They might laugh because of some card choices but don't let that get to you, prove why they rock and have fun.
2 months ago
I was thinking of old krenko, from back when I was still mucking about with goblin lists.
Run some tests with spike jester and see if you like it there- I've played it in the past and its fine. Not amazing, just fine. Jund Hackblade is similar, but more conditional, and Goblin Deathraiders is bad. Thats the multicolour goblins covered- its quite unexciting. Mad Auntie is a lord that doesn't offer evasion, and is therefore better as any of the red lords, but might be worth it in a hyper-budget list.
Auntie's Snitch and Squee, Goblin Nabob are an interesting card advantage engine (which is hated out by the same cards as dredge), but can make for a fun Zombie Infestation list. Stinkdrinker Bandit would be good if enough good goblin rogues existed. Warren Weirding is an interesting hybrid removal/token spell, but still sub-par.
With the meta up in the air as far as competitive modern goes, I don't feel too confident getting more specific than 'playtest'.
Stoneforge means plans for a t3 Batterskull are a must, as well as a plan for Ensnaring Bridge (hence me looking at Angrath's Rampage or Rakdos Charm ), but past that just playtest and see what you like. See if any rakdos burn lists show up on a metagame site for you to pinch the sideboard/spells from.
2 months ago
Incorporer Lingering Souls pour chump block/présence/gratter en vol ?
3 months ago
Glad to help!
In terms of power level, I would rate this deck as an 8.5/10, which is on the competitive side. I haven't actually done that much testing of this deck in a four player setting, but it definitely wins games.
I feel like if you wanted to make a budget Hogaak deck, you could still keep many of the elements I'm already using. You could use the cards I mention in my description that get you Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis out on turn 3.
And you could still win the main way this deck wins, which is by going for the Greater Good + Zombie Infestation + Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis combo drawing you into the Korozda Guildmage + Phyrexian Altar + Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis combo (even though unfortunately, the Phyrexian Altar is pretty expensive).
Here's a budget list that is loosely connected to my origional deck.
I know budget is all relative, but this was the easiest list I could come up with within the span of 10 minutes.
If you want more in terms of edh, I really recommend the site EDHREC. It's a database of all the decks of all the commanders people have posted online, and it has some useful tools as well. Unfortunately, in Hogaak's page everyone seems to be playing the same cards.
Zombie Infestation occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.0%