|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Duel Decks: Elves vs. Inventors (DDU)||None|
|Masters 25 (A25)||Uncommon|
|MTG: Commander (CMD)||Common|
Combos Browse all
Creature — Elf
When Fierce Empath enters the battlefield, you may search your library for a creature card with converted mana cost 6 or more, reveal it, and put it into your hand. Then shuffle your library.
|Have (3)||orzhov_is_relatively_okay819 , , PTsmitty|
|Want (9)||samo4422 , Flamadiddle , SkylordAleksander , olivo426 , Techbuilder , manber101 , whowasfone , nosh78 , ziruelo|
Fierce Empath Discussion
6 days ago
Nice question. Before I answer, please know I have built my list to play out differently each time (so no one consistent win con) and that I wanted the deck to be unpredictable. So I don’t mind if I don’t often use Purphoros to win (the tutor part). I enjoy that some games I am presented with that card, leading to a different game plan than most other games.
I like to play Purphoros, God of the Forge the same way I play Amulet of Vigor . I never play the amulet T1. I always keep it in hand until I can get good value on the turn I play it. For example if I can combine it with something like Scapeshift , Splendid Reclamation or Mosswort Bridge . You can do the same with Purphoros (it’s not as easy to get value the same turn as it is with amulet, but you can still save it until you have a good line of play). Mina and Denn, Wildborn is almost always a better 4 drop play, so I just keep Pur in hand until I can pull of a crazy play out of nowhere. I might be able to combine it at 8 mana with Natural Order into Avenger of Zendikar or with Scapeshift with a landfall token maker out. To tolerate a dead card like that I try to run more than enough draw spells, so I can save cards like amulet and pur for the right moment: when the blow comes unexpected and opponents have little time to react accordingly.
About possible cuts for making room for meta-specific cards. For lands, I am not yet convinced about Blast Zone , so that would be one to watch for me. I recently cut Hanweir Battlements to test another land, but I’m not quite happy with that for long term. I do run less basics, so that is something you could also consider.
For spells, I would consider cutting Tunneling Geopede . I cut it some time ago as I did not think it was good enough for what I was trying to do. I consider that card weaker than Purphoros: it has a similar “this draws attention” issue, but it lacks the same power to end games. Another one to consider would be Fierce Empath . It’s useful and nice, but not necessary imo. That spot might be better served to deal with you control matchup if that is heavily played in your meta.
Hope this answers your questions :).
2 weeks ago
Also, just wanted to ask about a few cards you're not running that aren't in maybeboard:
Lightning Greaves / Swiftfoot Boots : provides protection, and even if the dude dies to a wipe, the boots stay on the field. Also, haste Animar is kinda nice to swing for infinite unblockable against any deck with white or black creatures.
Somberwald Sage : Just really strong on paper. Lots of dudes in the deck, and they often require colored mana. Seems good.
Glen Elendra Archmage : negate on a stick, AND you can use it twice. Seems weaker than siren stormcaller due to necessary counters on Animar, but worth considering imo.
Fierce Empath : 1 mana tutor to hand for Tishana/consecrated sphinx. Need I say more? Maybe.
Fabricate : ok this one seems to be the most obvious to me. Tutor ancestral statue to hand. Seems like a must go in. Also finds ball, metamorph, and spellskite notably.
Gamble : another obvious one imo. One mana tutor. Idk how often you're dumping your hand, but I like those odds.
Rattleclaw Mystic : Mana good, plus converts colors.
Wall of Blossoms : more useful elvish visionary: has health.
Skullclamp : draw cards. lots of dudes with 1 toughness. One of the stronger cards in the "weaker" section.
Den Protector : recursion on a stick. Seems good. Puts in hand instead of on top like noxious revival. Comperable to eternal witness, doesn't cost double green (ouch).
Shrieking Drake / Dream Stalker / Man-o'-War : good for combos, good for value. Most lists run them. Why not here? I think i might be missing something, although I can also agree that maybe they're not as powerful as the other 100 cards currently in.
Verdurous Gearhulk : it's at WORST a 5/8/8 trample, can be a 2/4/4 that buffs Animar 4, not to mention possible Rishkar or Generous Patron synergy. One of the weaker cards in this list imo.
Ainok Survivalist : morph is fun with Animar, 1G for a naturalize, plus free counter on Animar. I think it's worse than nature's claim or reclamation sage though.
Cloudstone Curio : I know it's not needed to combo, but seems like you could generate a lot of value, or a possible combo.
Purphoros, God of the Forge : one R for an indestructible body for ancestral combo, instead of using ball.
Hardened Scales : Double counters on animar, really good turn one.
Deadeye Navigator : forget the infinite combos associated with him, he's a great value card. Problem is paying the double blue, and then the blue to bounce. Also provides built in protection for himself and another card.
Thanks for looking through this whole message.
3 weeks ago
Feel free to check out my list for inspiration. Upvotes on my decks are appreciated. Animar, Gaea's Hemorrhoid
1 month ago
Hey, lots of good cards here, but I think you're taking the Eldrazi theme too far; so far that it's hindering the rest of your deck.
You don't need 45 creatures who are all Eldrazi. The Eldrazi plan is good with Animar since they're colorless creatures, but before you can consistently play good Eldrazi creatures you need a lot of counters on Animar. This is where mana dorks can shine because they can put a counter on Animar and also be used as ramp for Eldrazi. It's also beneficial to play a few low mana cost support creatures who are excellent when you can bounce them or because they give you repeatable value.
Ancestral Statue is an engine with Animar since it can bounce itself back to your hand and if you have four or more counters on Animar it can be a loop of casting Statue for free and putting a counter on Animar each time, that's good with Eldrazi Titans. Fierce Empath is a very good Eldrazi tutor since most of the best Eldrazi have six CMC or higher. Being able to bounce Empath to then play it again can give you a repeatable Eldrazi tutor.
When casting a lot of creatures then Beast Whisperer is good repeatable draw. Fauna Shaman can be a repeatable creature tutor; discard an Eldrazi Titan who you can't cast yet, shuffle your library and then tutor for any other creature. Eternal Witness is an not Eldrazi, but she's and upgrade for a few cards here and is very good when you can bounce her. Thespian's Stage is another source of colorless mana that can potentially be another Eldrazi Temple .
Eldrazi to consider cutting:
- Eldrazi Devastator
- Wretched Gryff
- Vile Aggregate
- Tide Drifter
- Ruination Guide
- Nettle Drone
- Kozilek's Channeler
- Eldrazi Obligator
- Deepfathom Skulker
- Brood Monitor
- Breaker of Armies
- Vexing Scuttler
- Mockery of Nature
1 month ago
CyborgAeon: Yeah, Shaper is ridiculously good and has stumped me on multiple occasions. But yeah, I've crammed a lot of time into this deck to a point where you'd think it's solved, but it never is.
There's more to it than just that. I lack actual ways to buff Viridian Joiner . Generous Patron , Great Oak Guardian , and Umbral Mantle are the only ways to manipulate its power. Marwyn, the Nurturer benefits from those and off of every elf I play. Electrickery seems like a nuisance though, so I can understand why you'd be compelled to run it, but the one extra toughness for a narrower dork is detrimental to the strategy as a whole. My bigger problem is really Fire Covenant , which doesn't really care about toughness, but at least I can respond to it with an elf.
I can see how an ill-timed Fierce Empath could you put you off of the card, but I can assure you its downsides are greatly outweighed by its upsides. This isn't to say Vivien's Arkbow won't make it into the deck, I just haven't been able to narrow down what to actually take out for it, Growing Rites of Itlimoc Flip flew on my radar because it's a 3 drop that doesn't do much early game and gives away information, but trust me, parting with this card would be a huge burden on my soul. I am currently working on the bow being a part of the deck, it just won't be replacing Fierce Empath .
Soren841: Don't be offended, bro. I wouldn't have anyone to constantly talk about this if it wasn't for you lol. You're the best and don't ever let anyone tell you otherwise. :D
1 month ago
CyborgAeon: I honestly love taking everyones' suggestions as seriously as possible. Deliberation is usually a task I take upon myself and when I'm really stumped on a decision, I consult ShaperSavant. For the most part, I spitball with Soren841 as he's followed the deck's progress up until and including its current state and is also one of the more versed players on the subject matter (seen it in action as well). He constantly challenges the build, which drives me further to keep improving it.
I believe some suggestions fall flat because they haven't put in the hours I have into playing it, so it's up to me to explain my reasoning for card choices.
As for testing, it has its lulls where cards I want to see never show up, but that's just the nature of EDH. I almost never see Sylvan Library , but we know damn sure that cards hella good and never leaving.
Now, to address your suggestions:
Viridian Joiner : this is strictly worse than Marwyn, the Nurturer , as they cost the same and have the same base power, whereas Marwyn has a way of buffing her self. It's easy to buff with minor bounce effects like Wirewood Symbiote and unfortunately Viridian Joiner is stuck unless you play Umbral Mantle or Great Oak Guardian . Umbral Mantle being the reason to consider it makes it a very narrow pairing that's unlikely to happen as much as you'd want it since it's reliant on drawing into it. Only other card that works with it is Great Oak Guardian and only makes it worth it while looping. Last but not least, it's feasibly possible to make Marwyn, the Nurturer storm off at instant speed or go infinite with Staff of Domination .
Vitalize : This was a preference thing, since Yeva needs card advantage from everywhere it could possibly get it. Feel free to swap if your meta benefits from draught. Lately my internal struggle has actually been my want for Emerald Charm as it can even untap Gaea's Cradle and destroy problem enchantments at one mana, but I digress, Vitalize works as well as you'd expect it to with its lower cost and asymmetrical effect.
Fierce Empath : This card is unbelievably integral to the deck to date, I can't stress this enough. It's a pseudo outlet that's ridiculously flexible and it being a creature can easily start tutor chains. Ex: Woodland Bellower , Fierce Empath , Regal Force , or Great Oak Guardian . You can also lead with Fierce Empath into Woodland Bellower into any three drop you could possibly need to keep the ball rolling. Tutors on a body in this context are ridiculously strong and not to be disregarded. Also an elf
Vivien's Arkbow : Now, despite making Fierce Empath a non-option as a swap for the bow, that's not to say I'm currently wracking my brain on what to remove for it (looking like Growing Rites of Itlimoc Flip, though not definite). Both Shaper and Soren have told me to consider it as well and in my opinion, it's a hell of a card, especially since it doesn't reveal and my curve is so low. I will be posting a HUGE update soon, with a new kill line and improvements with deep implications to the deck, however, testing is everything and I vowed to never post some update with arbitrary changes unless it changes the deck fundamentally for the better. Expect the bow in the deck eventually.
Ravenous Slime : Is only run against known flash hulk decks, if I'm blindsided, I insert it after since it's so narrow in every other situation.
Thank you so much for contributing to this discussion, as alway your feedback is appreciated.
2 months ago
Hey, looks good, but one of the best interactions with Animar are cards that can bounce themselves or other creatures you control. This lets you get more counters on Animar faster.
Statue can bounce itself unlimited number of times since its colorless, each time you bounce it you put a counter a on Animar and it reduces the casting cost of Statue.
Low mana cost creatures who give you value when they ETB are good when you can bounce creatures.
- Elvish Visionary : draw.
- Cloud of Faeries : untap lands.
- Pollenbright Druid : new from WAR, +1/+1 counter or proliferate.
- Fierce Empath : tutor for big creatures.
- Eternal Witness : recur any card from graveyard.
- Reclamation Sage : destroy any one artifact or enchantment.
- Farhaven Elf or Solemn Simulacrum : basic land ramp.
When playing a lot of creatures as well as bounce then Beast Whisperer is good repeatable draw. Forgotten Ancient and Managorger Hydra are two good cards for the +1/+1 counters strategy because each gets counters when any player plays a spell. This includes your opponents and in multiplayer Commander these creatures can get very big. They're also good with the strategy of bounce because you're casting creatures after you bounce them back to your hand. Ancient can be a counters engine since at your upkeep you can move counters from him onto any other creatures you control any way you like including onto Animar. If you like some of these suggestions I offer help to make cuts.
For the manabase really consider more lands. 30 total lands is low for your deck to function without being consistently land screwed. Getting land screwed is not fun; it's better to have more lands than not enough. There's some budget ($1-$5 or less each) lands to consider adding:
- Exotic Orchard
- Frontier Bivouac
- Opal Palace
- Yavimaya Coast
- Game Trail
- Shivan Reef
- Karplusan Forest
- Novijen, Heart of Progress
- Rootbound Crag
Good luck with your deck.
2 months ago
Thx for the suggestions FrantaFire. I will definitely add Fierce Empath . I don’t know about Eldritch Evolution , because I am trying to keep a lot of cards under 2 bucks. (Btw I didn’t buy this deck, yet.. I just came here for suggestions before buying it)Also I may not update this deck with new suggestions for a while cause I am busy. But I will add it eventually. Thx for suggetions.
Fierce Empath occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.05%