|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Modern Masters 2017 Edition (MM3)||Rare|
|Avacyn Restored (AVR)||Rare|
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Creature — Human Warrior
Haste When Zealous Conscripts enters the battlefield, untap target permanent and gain control of it until end of turn. It gains haste until end of turn.
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Zealous Conscripts Discussion
5 days ago
If you are running Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker why not run Zealous Conscripts? I totally understand if you are against infinite combos, but if you are not then this is a great finisher. Zealous Conscripts is good on its own since you can steal any permament including Planeswalkers! You can take them before they ult then you get to ult them instead.
3 weeks ago
Zealous Conscripts, with kiki jiki you have infinite creatures, or if you can't swing infinite damage with purphoros. Goblin Bombardment lets you fling tokens at an opponent in response to a board wipe
1 month ago
Some infinite tokens and ETB combos:
1 month ago
Thanks for the kind comment.
Here's a rough guide / thought process I use when evaluating cards / combos / synergies:
1) Assumption: One player (possibly myself), will try and Combo on Turn 3/4, and generally by 5 at least
Realization: I don't have a lot of disruption, so will rely on Commanders built to prevent others and take advantage
A Teferi's Protection might buy me another turn to try and Combo or Eliminate the issue player.
2) Assumption: I'm Tier 3 (I truly believe Kaalia of the Vast is tier 2.5 built like this), yet seem to be a threat
Realization: Use their bias against them, they think I'm just Aggro/Pub Brawl, might leave me open here and there.
Yes, I'll still Master of Cruelties a Stax or Disruption or Tier 1 Commander, but...
3) Assumption: I'm not a Stax player, I'm trying to go fast too, don't be that guy
Realization: I have some Stax type plays, but I'm not a Stax player, whenever possible go for the win, often you win
4) Assumption: Razaketh, the Foulblooded almost always wins me the game.
Realization: Don't let others (like Animar, Soul of Elements) use him against me. Resolve and Win.
5) Assumption: I'm not going to output 40 x 3 (4-player pod assumed) = 120 by Turn 5
Realization: If I can do 40 damage by turn 5 and eliminate a player, and rely on others disruption, I can Combo on Turn 6/7
6) Evaluation: Does this card help me win the game by Turn 7? If no, then I usually exclude it
Is this card good, WITHOUT the other combo pieces? Example: Stranglehold is good on it's own, prevents win-cons and can stax (no searching) a Fetch land or Tutor. Maralen of the Mornsong provides an effective and lasting Synergy (won't say Combo, No more drawing for others), BUT Maralen of the Mornsong without a Stranglehold is not good WITHOUT the other combo piece. Maralen of the Mornsong can in fact give the win to the next player in turn.
Adarkar Valkyrie Evaluation:
1) She doesn't trigger with Kaalia of the Vast, because Adarkar Valkyrie enters tapped, also doesn't have haste, and requires to use. What that means is I have to wait 1 whole turn before she can be used vs. something like a Razaketh, the Foulblooded or Rune-Scarred Demon.
3) What are the other combo cards, and do they meet the test that they are good without Adarkar Valkyrie
Took me a long time to take Aurelia, the Warleader, can get into that discussion later.
Zealous Conscripts on it's own is also pretty good, he has Haste built in, can take an opponents permanents, can untap your permanents (like Adarkar Valkyrie or Sol Ring etc). He's not an A/D/D is his only down side, so with a CMC5 am I going to play him before Turn 5? Tough to say.
I'm probably going to tutor Restoration Angel because I can 1) Free cast with Kaalia of the Vast, 2) She is Instant speed (Flash), 3) She is CMC4 vs. Zealous Conscripts. So it becomes, do i need Zealous Conscripts. If I'm running Adarkar Valkyrie as well, then yes. Honestly Zealous Conscripts has been on the cusp for a long time, he is VERY good, probably better than Reveillark (who I almost never combo with), the only benefit to Reveillark is he brings back Grand Abolisher so I can actually pull off the combo without Disruption.
I'd almost always rather tutor Buried Alive or Reanimate or a missing piece, than a Adarkar Valkyrie. He really provides the same combo structure, but slower, same with Zealous Conscripts. If I'm hoping to just have a higher probability of drawing into a Zealous Conscripts to complete my combo I'm starting with an Assumption that isn't going to make my Turn 5 window usually. I need to Tutor/Win.
Combat Celebrant, Felidar Guardian, Sparring Mummy, Thornbite Staff, Village Bell-Ringer, Zealous Conscripts, Fiend Hunter, Karmic Guide, Lightning Crafter, Restoration Angel, Reveillark, Changeling Hero, Changeling Berserker all work with Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, some need Sac, many don't.
Not sure if I answered your Zealous Conscripts question, but the best answer I can give is, I don't need him, I don't want to draw him, and he just does the job of Restoration Angel. Certainly you need alternatives, incase of Exile or Removal, I decided on Reveillark because he has other upside (downside is needs a Sac outlet), but Zealous Conscripts is quite reasonable and has utility on his own so I like him probably will make his way back in, at a higher CMC than someone like Village Bell-Ringer though who has no utility on his own, but IS turn 5 probable, but without Buried Alive probably neither works anyway, so why not just Restoration Angel and win?
The truth is any of them are viable options, it's about the supporting cards, the "wheel of support" you put around each of them, if there's multiple synergies then it's always good to have. Remember though, you only need to Combo once to win, the reality is, if your Disrupted, someone else will likely combo before you get a second chance anyway in cEDH. In standard EDH, you may have the time to draw cards into a Zealous Conscripts or hard cast a Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker but probably not in cEDH.
Adarkar Valkyrie was in, she didn't work with Kaalia of the Vast and I never tutored Adarkar Valkyrie, and it needed Haste (Lightning Greaves/Dragon Tempest) and in most cases needed a Sac Outlet, so it ended up getting cut when Aurelia, the Warleader left. Adarkar Valkyrie I just found too difficult to manage, and 1 turn too slow.
I will say, if you are running Adarkar Valkyrie and Zealous Conscripts, definitely run Faithless Looting, maybe even Gamble. This differs than something like a Reanimator, If i could have more Reanimate (also use Animate Dead, Yawgmoth's Will which I view as CMC2 because I usually have a Fetch land to recur) then I LIKE drawing into those. When I draw a Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker in my opening hand, I always Mulligan, and when I draw him in play I really really really regret having Faithless Looting out of the deck because I can't tutor it, and now I'm hoping to tutor a Goblin Bombardment and Reanimate a Buried Alive | Karmic Guide + Reveillark. In this situation a Zealous Conscripts isn't helping you anyway. On occasion I draw Restoration Angel but then I Buried Alive : Grand Abolisher and then Reanimate Karmic Guide then Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker then Grand Abolisher then Flash cast Restoration Angel and have the Grand Abolisher pretty much guaranteeing me the win. It's definetely higher CMC to hard was him, but still less than Zealous Conscripts.
My deck is still a work in progress though, I wish I had more time to play and really advance it with playtesting, but In theory, MOST of the time I would prefer a Tutor to another instance of a card I can tutor that is worse. Like Anguished Unmaking and Utter End are the same but CMC1 more, but I don't run Utter End because instead I draw a tutor, and search for Anguished Unmaking if that's what I really need, otherwise I tutor Reanimate or Buried Alive and go for the win.
I'm always testing the new guys too, sometimes they roar, sometimes they fail. Razaketh, the Foulblooded for sure, is the best (sometimes Iona, Shield of Emeria) in a while, If I could have all Razaketh, the Foulblooded that would be very cool.
Another thing I've learned, I built Kaalia of the Vast because I liked Gisela, Blade of Goldnight and Griselbrand (I really miss him, pretty angry about that one), but try not to be attached to certain cards, even if you like it, make sure it properly synergies. Stranglehold + Maralen of the Mornsong was my favorite for so long, I would always Tutor a Baneslayer Angel first to counter the damage (Lyra Dawnbringer would probably be the target now), but had to let it go because Maralen of the Mornsong couldn't keep up. Same with Liliana Vess. Even Aurelia, the Warleader, I won a draft event with him, so valued him highly, but I just didn't have the right supporting cards in there for him.
The next A/D/D I'm going to try is Archfiend of Despair, I just don't know how to take advantage of his second ability properly, I mean him and a Gisela, Blade of Goldnight obviously, he does double my damage, meaning 120 damage is now 60 damage so makes that a potential strategy, but still not sure how to do 60 by turn 5/6 to 3 different targets, but perhaps, have to test him. I feel Archfiend of Despair has more upside than Sower of Discord because of his Lifegain prevention, but together the 2 are ok, I'm just not sure, he reduces 120 to 80 where Archfiend of Despair reduces it to 60. I will note, if you build other Loss of Life into the deck, like Liliana's Caress and Dragon Mage and Wheel of Fortune type abilities, both Sower of Discord and Archfiend of Despair, but even then Sower of Discord is "Damage", remember, "Damage" causes "Loss of Life" but doesn't work the other way, "Loss of Life" isn't "Damage". Hmm probably will not even test Sower of Discord, CMC6 for 6/6, no Flample, and no immediate threat/ETB off Kaalia of the Vast other than potentially 8 damage (Sower of Discord 6 + Kaalia of the Vast 2) is outside my current strategy too much.
I can win on Turn 1: Swamp + Mana Crypt + Buried Alive and a Chrome Mox (and a card to Imprint) + Reanimate, is an example, but it rarely happens. There are some other Janky ways with Sol Ring and Ancient Tomb and stuff too, but not consistently. Always looking for ways to improve here. (CMC1 Reanimate or High Mana Conversion Stones)
Turn 2, there's quite a few different ways to get there, including Kaalia of the Vast attacking, usually needs a Razaketh, the Foulblooded in hand to pull the combo pieces, mana rocks, and Goblin Bombardment because usually Combo AFTER the combat phase, so the Infinite Haste Angels don't really help me out that much.
Turn 3/4 is really where I want to combo, and am looking to build further consistency, like Gamble or Beseech the Queen (maybe but it only tutors Reanimate usually for , so where does the for Reanimate come from). Does Zealous Conscripts or Adarkar Valkyrie check this box? Not really, which is probably why they are out. But honestly, I still have a bunch of junk, like Reveillark, Gisela, the Broken Blade maybe, Lord of the Void, Teferi's Protection it's really dumb this card doesn't have Split Second, Boros Charm too situational, see lots of stuff that could be Zealous Conscripts.
What I really wish for, 1) A good A/D/D that has Goblin Bombardment built-into it, like a Murderous Redcap of A/D/D, 2) More CMC1 Reanimate, 3) More CMC1 or CMC2 Tutors, I'll checkout your deck but if you don't have Tainted Pact it is CRITICAL to finding solutions, although means your lands are $1,000,000 but luckily no so HEY still cheaper than a Volcanic Island. 4) More effective mana rocks. I've looked at Mox Diamond a million times, can't decide if it helps/hurts in the average case (not just the Turn 1 case), like as a before Turn 5.
Rakdos the Defiler has been my friend, when I'm not doing well he often helps me out lol. Dance of the Dead is a possiblity, because it doesn't matter that Karmic Guide is tapped, but Karmic Guide is pro black so the interaction sucks even more (already sucks with Animate Dead but the triggers work).
I'll check out your deck a little later, and provide any feedback I can.
Hopefully, somewhere in this rambling I answered your questions.
PS: I hate that Kess, Dissident Mage (and some others) can win on Turn 0, win before it's even their turn, that sucks!
1 month ago
The helm is a stretch goal of the deck with stuff like Magnetic Theft and Zealous Conscripts. I'm working on getting repeated effects or effects that better synergize with the deck as a whole alongside temporarily stealing one creature to equip. It will be glorious to have multiple copies of her out. Helm works well with Etali, Primal Storm. It's tantalizing enough to me to force it. I'm hesitant to all but the most utilitarian of auras as they seem so vulnerable as I don't want to dedicate slots to recur them. nuggnugg I like the idea of cursing the player with sac outlets, golgari, abzan, and the like. I will definitely copy your deck idea to play in table top sim for a test run. Sounds super fun and strategic.
1 month ago
I use the above combo (minus the phyrexian altar, a creature sac outlet is what I use) as well as Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker + Zealous Conscripts, you can easily do this with Doomsday and Grenzo's ability. This gives you infinite combat damage. You need something like Goblin Sledder to make Grenzo a 3/3 but you can also cast these from hand.
2 months ago
I see you have Derevi, Empyrial Tactician in your maybe board. You should definitely move him to the main board. His value is ridiculously strong.
Other cards I would recommend that won't necessarily break the bank: Bear Umbra, Kindred Discovery , Reconnaissance, Shared Animosity, Path to Exile, Cyclonic Rift, Yasova Dragonclaw, Eternal Witness, Vandalblast, Shattering Spree, and By Force.
Reconnaissance is truly an all star. It allows you to swing with everything, then remove them from combat AFTER their damage goes through but BEFORE your opponents damage goes through. It's like vigilance, only 10x better. Plus allows you to tap them for mana to things like Cryptolith Rite.
One sided board wipes, clears, or artifact removal, or even just spot removal is always a good thing. Though it might more depend on the meta you play in, the need for those cards.
Eternal Witness can get you your cards back. 'Nuff said? Yasova Dragonclaw can steal some fun things. Shared Animosity can get ridiculous, real quick. It's like a cheaper Coat of Arms (but slightly worse, but only goes for your things...so...you know). Kindred Discovery is a great card draw engine.
Obviously, to increase the consistency of your deck, tutors. And a more expensive landbase. But you said your budget is $150. So most tutors are already out. However, if you decide you want to sink way too much money into it, Tutors are easy, no brainer, inclusions
Now the hard part. What do you cut to put things in that maybe help you combo, or make your stuff bigger, all of a sudden, or just to provide value?
My recommendations for that, mostly based on high CMC or not providing as much value as something else: Zealous Conscripts, Surrak Dragonclaw, Stonehoof Chieftain, Lovisa Coldeyes, Jazal Goldmane, Blood-Chin Fanatic, Blaring Recruiter, and Blaring Captain.
Of course, all of these are just suggestions. If you like the way a card interacts with the deck, or you think it's just fun to play, keep it! It's just a game, designed for people to have fun with. And all that matters is that you have fun with playing your deck. Best of luck to you in all your future games, I love Najeela. She's a lot of fun, and almost no one like to see her across the table from them.
2 months ago
I'm sure you've been asked this before, but is there a reason you're not running Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker? With Zealous Conscripts he's an easy win, and he works well with other cards like Protean Hulk, Reclamation Sage, or Tireless Tracker.
Otherwise, great looking deck dude. Really excited to build it for myself soon.