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|Commander / EDH||Legal|
|Commander: Rule 0||Legal|
Whenever a permanent deals damage to you, return it to its owner's hand.
2 months ago
In this example where both of the effects are from triggered abilities (abilities that start with one of the words "when", "whenever" or "at"), the answer depends on who controls them and whose turn it is.
If No Mercy and Dissipation Field are controlled by the same player, that player gets to choose. If multiple triggered abilities controlled by the same player are trying to go onto the stack at the same time, that player puts them onto the stack in the order of their choice. Whichever one ends up on top of the stack will resolve first and then the rest will follow in order. In your example the second trigger to resolve won't do anything since the creature it would have affected has already changed zones, causing the effect to lose track of it.
If No Mercy and Dissipation Field are controlled by different players, then the active player (the player whose turn it is) will put their trigger onto the stack first and the non-active player will put their trigger onto the stack on top of the other one. This means the non-active player's trigger will resolve first.
2 months ago
if a card is supposed to be sent to both the graveyard and your hand simultaneously, where does it go?
3 months ago
Elder Brain: slow, but could be funny
Sword of War and Peace: could help punish the card draw
you may want to up the number of counterspells to deal with the fact you're helping your opponents dig, combo decks will ruin your day.
I might trade out some of the 3 drop rocks for signets or talismans
It may not be a bad idea to have some other cheap combo line to pull off when playing against combo decks as well since you're digging so much with the draw (Consecrated Sphinx could help here too)
the big worry is needing to speed the deck up which involves somewhat expensive mana rocks:
5 months ago
Licecolony Thank you for the comprehensive message! I appreciate the input, especially on adding the smaller, more evasive creatures into the mix and removing some counterspells. Any time I build I have a knee-jerk reaction to slot in some counters, even when they're not really necessary in the overall scheme of the deck.
Mirko Vosk, Mind Drinker, Gisa, Glorious Resurrector and, sadly, Taniwha are getting chopped. I share your love for the 'ol phasing sea serpent, but I agree that it's far too slow in games where it's seen play to warrant an inclusion. My thought process behind adding Mirko was to shift aggro onto an opponent's board. His ability certainly has bite, but I find he often becomes a pain in the neck for me in the late game. Puns intended. Gisa's just sorta not great.
I'm not so sure about cutting Tergrid. She acts as a foil to Jon: when my donations cause opponents to sac their good creatures, they become my defensive line against the hot garbage I've gifted them. I'll have to do some trial runs with and without to see if I can cut her out of the 99.
Plague Reaver is, tentatively, on the chopping block. Reaver's value and ability is just grand, but it does suck having to lose Jon for a turn. Assault Suit was a means of mitigating that issue, by keeping Jon off the board I could cast both cards while not having to face the backlash, then toss it around to all my opponents at their upkeeps. Suit is probably going to stay in the 99, because it still has great synergy with other creatures, especially those that sac at the player's upkeep.
Good calls on Dissipation Field, No Mercy, and Grave Betrayal. Diplomatic Immunity doesn't really work as intended anyway, and I very much prefer your replacements for AEtherize, so consider those cut. Dark Ritual I think will stay, always good to get a discount on higher cost spells. I'm leaving in Countersquall for now. I tend to shy away from cards that gift treasures to opponents, unless I've got a Dockside slotted into the 99. Redirect is, hands down, one of my favorite cards ever, and while Reversal is good, I think Redirect will stay.
I'm also going to take your suggestions on the sac-based removals as well.
5 months ago
I really like your manifest take on Jon. Consider Dulcet Sirens. It's a clever way to mitigate risk of having those horrible creatures for yourself. I'll definitely be adding Crawlspace and Endless Whispers to my list.
Suggested removals from deck Plague Reaver. While it's a nice card to give away, the turn you play it you'll have to sacrifice Jon Irenicus to Plague Reaver's trigger regardless of which order you put the abilities onto the stack. You'd rather not lose Jon.
Gisa, Glorious Resurrector. It's something you can't give away, which means it's good when you're ahead, but not great when you're behind,. Your mileage may vary, but I think getting something more immediately impactful on the board tends to be best.
Mirko Vosk, Mind Drinker. You're not running a mill strategy, you'll only be filling the graveyard of dedicate graveyard decks.
Taniwha. I love this creature and totally understand running it for the memes, but phasing triggers before your upkeep, which means that when you give it away, it'll be phased out for the first turn under your opponent, so they'll keep their lands and you won't draw a card from Jon's ability. The turn cycle has to make two full rounds before Taniwha does anything.
Tergrid, God of Fright Flip. Unlike Sheoldred, Tergrid doesn't make the opponent do either of its effects. It's another creature you don't want to give away, and Jon makes cards unsacrificeable. It just won't trigger much unless you're against a sacrifice deck.
Ensnaring Bridge. The creatures you donate will often be quite big. Ensnaring bridge will prevent them from attacking your opponents and deny you card draw.
Assault Suit doesn't goad the creatures itself. Often they'll swing at you if possible.
No Mercy Jon just has better options for this slot. If you can replace a non-creature with a creature in this deck, you usually want to.
Grave Betrayal. That's 7 mana for a card that could ruin your game by forcing you to revive bad cards you do not want.
Dark Ritual. I'm uncertain what you're trying to ramp into so quickly that you would need this. Maybe I'm wrong.
AEtherize risks bouncing creatures attacking other opponents such as those you've goaded but want them to keep. Try replacing this with a more versatile effect like Reins of Power or a more aggressive effect in Illusionist's Gambit.
Damnation. Jon prefers sacrifice board wipes so that your opponents keep their shit creatures.
Overall I think you could run less counter-magic in favor of more proactive effects.
Cards to Consider Creatures Generally I want to focus on adding creatures that you can give away and then steal back later to win the game.
With Jon, you often want cheap evasive creatures to give out for early card draw with his ability. Right now you have 1 two-drop creature. Throwing in a Changeling Outcast or a Slither Blade can mean you can give a creature away for cheap and still hold up mana for other things. Slither blade wouldn't die to Heartless Summoning too.
In the two-drop slot, you can run creatures that are more defensive like Baleful Strix, or give you card draw like Sygg, River Cutthroat or just more powerful creatures like Flesh Reaver which is a goaded 6/6 that can deal 12 damage a turn or Wretched Anurid. Heck, you can even add a versatile two-drop in Dimir Infiltrator which can be given away in the early game or used as a tutor in the late-game.
In the three drop slot, I think your idea of adding Steel Golem is a great one to make sure the only creatures your opponent has are the ones you're giving them. It's a brutal card. Rotting Regisaur is a card you don't mind giving away early, and can take back later to win. Phyrexian Soulgorger can be donated to an opponent as a goaded 10/10. They won't have to pay the upkeep, but that's a great body to give someone as a political tool. Cephalid Facetaker is also worth consideration though I personally don't run it.
In the four-drop slot, like you mentioned, Grid Monitor is a proactive creature counter. Abyssal Persecutor can save you from death. Archfiend of the Dross is risky but fun (it comes back to your control after the opponent dies).
In the 5-drop slot, both of the evil-eye cards are absolute ALL STARS. They work so well every game I've drawn them. They can also replace some of your weaker defenses like No Mercy and Dissipation Field
As a sidenote, I also like Deep-Sea Kraken as an unblockable 8/8 that can win you the game with homeward path.
Removal I recommend running more sacrifice-based removal since it'll mean your opponents keep the crap you give them. Things like Tergrid's Shadow or Vona's Hunger or All is Dust (one of my favorites) or Killing Wave. I also prefer Toxic Deluge to some of your other removal since it goes through hexproof. Curse of the Swine is also an exile effect that can be selective and works really well. You can also run single-target removal like Reality Shift or Pongify if you'd rather instant speed interaction. Feed the Swarm is quality. If you really don't care about cruelty, you can run Torment of Hailfire, but that card is honestly always too boring for me to want in my decks.
Card Draw Jon has access to some great card draw that most decks can't take advantage of. Fateful Handoff is a card draw spell that also donates (though does not goad). Sygg, River Cutthroat works well with evasive threats you give away (though should not be donated). Verity Circle works great with Jon's ability since it donates the creature first, and then taps it down. Teferi's Ageless Insight allows you to double your draw triggers from Jon.
Equipment Remember that you can donate creatures while they're equipped and you still control the equipment so they can't re-equip it. Pact Weapon makes the attacking creature bigger, while ensuring you can't die, and will draw you another card whenever the donated creature attacks. Dowsing Dagger Flip works effectively on evasive creature to get you ramped. Vorpal Sword is a win condition on your unblockable evasive creatures.
Misc Graveyard removal is king. Throw in a Scavenger Grounds. My favorite card to run is Reality Shift. Make an Avenger of Zendikar spawn a dozen Wretched Anurids. It's not GREAT, but it is always funny. Cultural Exchange is a fun time too with all your manifest and shitty creatures.
That is all. Hope it was helpful.
10 months ago
Portent, Crawlspace, Web of Inertia, Dream Tides, War Tax, Glacial Chasm, Monastery Siege, Cryptic Command, Extract, Portcullis, Dissipation Field, Overburden, Archmage Ascension, Frozen Aether, Reins of Power, Rapid Hybridization, Siren's Call, Cyclonic Rift, Mission Briefing, Reality Shift, and Resculpt are just a few you could potentially use. You can very easily go creatureless if you want to. You just have to lean on different win conditions and use cards like Ward of Bones /etc.
1 year ago
hey try out Reliquary Tower, Sign in Blood, Barren Moor, Fabled Passage, Mortuary Mire, Evolving Wilds, Overburden, Arcane Laboratory, Curse of Verbosity, Forced Fruition,Orbs of Warding,Collective Restraint, Rhystic Study, War Tax, Dissipation Field, Halimar Depths, Skyline Cascade, Ipnu Rivulet, Leechridden Swamp, Blighted Fen, Fetid Pools, Blighted Cataract, Mystifying Maze, Maze of Ith,Glacial Chasm, Jwari Disruption Flip. Sea Gate Restoration Flip, Blackbloom Rogue Flip , Ponder