Combos Browse all Suggest
- Cryptic Command + Snapcaster Mage
- Cryptic Command + Eternal Witness
- Cryptic Command + Mystic Sanctuary
|Commander / EDH||Legal|
|Commander: Rule 0||Legal|
- Cryptic Command Modes
- What's the effect of casting a counterspell with pyromancer ascension?
- Spellskite and Cryptic Command?
- What is the correct way to communicate that you are skipping to a phase/end of turn without declaring each phase/step?
- why is it that when you cast a modal spell izzet charm you have to name what mode you're choosing before the spell resolves?
Choose two —
- Counter target spell.
- Return target permanent to its owner's hand.
- Tap all creatures your opponents control.
- Draw a card.
Dead_Blue_ on Murky Waters
2 months ago
I read your whole comment and appreciate the time you took for the write up. I really don’t want this to be a Dimir deck but I am planning to replace a few graves with Misty Rainforests
You’re not wrong in your assessments, having played Control as a secondary deck for years now I’m very familiar with almost all the cards you mentioned.
The thing you said about top decks, is why I used to have Think Twice in this deck over Consider… this deck pretty much never wants to go to top deck mode
Anyway instead of breaking down the pros and cons of the many viable cards you listed here’s where my head is at. I know Cryptic Command is too slow, I have barely ever cast it in any match up. I’ve been using it as a middle ground between the 4th copies of Dismember and Archmage's Charm I’m just not sure which I need the 4th copy of more since both have been all stars, what is your opinion?
Next on the table is Snapcaster Mage, it’s such a legacy card that it feels bad to want to cut it but I’ve seriously been thinking of dropping it in favor of 2x more Consider. What are your thoughts? Only thing that concerns me is cutting snap makes Unlicensed Hearse worst.
I think Unmoored Ego does need a sideboard slot, probably in place of Iymrith, Desert Doom which is only there for testing & flavor right now …do you think Surgical Extraction might be a better choice?
zapyourtumor on Murky Waters
2 months ago
Card Suggestions Show
I think the main decision you have to make with this deck is whether you want it to be a true control deck or a tempo deck. A true control deck would try to trade one for one and build card advantage before dropping a threat like Murktide or Jace or simply winning with Snappy beatdown. A tempo deck on the other hand would try to turbo out a quick Murktide and then protect that threat.
Mixing control and tempo is nothing new, and it sometimes works quite well. But because a lot of the cards from each type of deck don't necessarily go well together, you can sometimes end up in an awkward situation.
Here, you definitely have a mix of both types (which, I'd like to emphasize, is not necessarily bad). Archmage's Charm, Counterspell, Cryptic Command, Snapcaster Mage, Devastation Tide and Jace, the Mind Sculptor are all heavily control-flavored cards in your deck. They all either break even or generate card advantage, or massively stall out the game.
On the other hand, Force of Negation, Otherworldly Gaze, Thought Scour, Spell Pierce, and Subtlety are all tempo-flavored cards.
The problem with this combination in this deck is that half of your cards aim to turbo out a Murktide Regent as fast as possible with Otherworldly Gaze and Thought Scour and then protect it in the short term with cheap spells like Dismember, Force of Negation, Subtlety, and Spell Pierce. The main problems with these cards is that they are pretty terrible topdecks late game. Scour isn't too bad because it cantrips, but topdecking a Gaze when you really needed a counterspell or card advantage engine or a Murktide would probably feel terrible. And all the control-type cards aim to reach that stage of the game.
One example of a problem that arises when you try and combine these two archetypes is in the manabase. Tempo decks typically don't need many lands; depending on the deck's mana curve, we are generally looking at 19-20 lands, and occasionally even 18 or less. On the other hand, control decks almost always want at least 22-23 lands, sometimes up to 24-26 lands in order to reliably play their more expensive spells on curve like Archmage's Charm, Cryptic Command and Snapcaster Mage, and to also always have mana held up during their opponents turn for a reactive spell.
Of course, many cards fit very flexibly into both tempo and control decks, for example Counterspell is just so strong it works in both, while Consider being a cheap cantrip also fits into both types. So in my opinion one of the most important decisions you should make, if you want to make the deck more cohesive and just function smoother as a whole, is whether you want to lean more towards tempo or control.
Quick disclaimer: I think it is definitely possible to make the deck more competitive while keeping both tempo and control aspects; however you should probably then trim both the very slow control-leaning cards (Cryptic Command, Devastation Tide, Jace, the Mind Sculptor), and the cheap tempo-leaning cards (Otherworldly Gaze, Thought Scour, Force of Negation) and replace them with cards more towards the middle ground. The rest of the cards, like Archmage's Charm, Subtlety, Force of Negation, Spell Pierce, Dismember, and of course Murktide Regent are all flexible enough that they can slot into both types of decks.
The second important decision to make is what secondary color, if any, you want for your deck in order to complement the primary color (blue). The main issue with mono blue control is that you have very few ways to deal with resolved permanents, which is why most players typically splash white or black (or occasionally red). Blue only has access to bounce spells, which are decent in tempo decks but generally bad in control decks because they are card disadvantage (and also terrible late).
Here, I see you kind of "splashed" black, but your only maindeck spell with black pips uses phyrexian mana anyways, while the only black spell in your sideboard can be casted with only blue mana. In my opinion, since you already have black lands, I would commit fully to a UB manabase by including a few more fetches (U fetches since that's your main color) because it gives you access to a lot of strong options:
Drown in the Loch is a really good spell doubling as both removal and countermagic at only 2 cmc, and only gets stronger as the game goes on. Fatal Push is another great removal spell which is generally stronger than Dismember, although it needs at least around 7 fetches to show its full potential. You can also run discard like Inquisition of Kozilek, although that is more tempo/midrange-esque so it may not be a great fit for this deck. Black also gives you an actual boardwipe in the form of Damnation, which is definitely a lot stronger than something like Devastation Tide since it gets rid of the creatures permanently and indirectly generates CA by trading with multiple enemy creature cards. It also doesn't hit Jace. If you don't think you need it in the mainboard, it can be a great sideboard inclusion. Lastly you have access to some sideboard options like Unmoored Ego.
If all of the blue pip spells like Counterspell and Archmage's Charm have you worried about mana fixing issues, you can run the filter land Sunken Ruins which is great in these types of decks to ensure you can cast both BB and UUU spells.
Those two main points aside, I have a few other card suggestions I think could work well here, some of which lean more control and some which lean more tempo.
Ledger Shredder is a great card which leans a bit more towards tempo but unlike Gaze/Thought Scour it helps turbo out a Murktide while also growing into a significant threat itself.
Aether Gust and Mystical Dispute are decent color-specific sideboard cards.
Remand is a tempo-leaning card that is generally not great in pure control lists, but could be good here if you decide to stick to the turbo murktide strategy.
Spreading Seas is probably the best sideboard option mono-blue has against Urza's Saga.
Memory Deluge has a bit of antisynergy with Murktide, but a very good digging spell if you decide to go towards control.
Orvar, the All-Form is another great sideboard card which instantly turns the tables on any Creativity player thinking they auto won the game after cheating out an early Archon of Cruelty.
If you made it this far, thanks for reading all of my comments. I like the deck and I'm excited to see where you can take it in the future. Happy brewing!
SpammyV on In defense of Veil of …
3 months ago
I think that given the power of former staple Cryptic Command and current staples like Force of Negation, Aether Gust, and Grief; that Veil is just a necessary evil in Modern so that there is some counter to these cards. Like Teferi, Time Raveler in that it's too much for the smaller Pioneer cardpool but needed in the larger one unless they want to ban whole swaths of cards.
Icbrgr on FNM/Thursday Night Modern Report
4 months ago
@IndepenentMeta I no longer have the decklist on here but it was a Blue moon homebrew... dusted off an old deck and brought it to locals which in essence looked like this:
intended to attack the opponents mana base... then bounce/burn/countermagic
my decklist didnt really have a solid Win Condition.... it had a single copy of Emrakul, the Aeons Torn and tamiyo ult with burn.... i was able to be a nuisance at times but could never really capitalize on turning to corner... best games were basically just taking a longer time to lose lol.... its no worries though!
SufferFromEDHD on Hurkyl, Tempo Master Wizard
4 months ago
Portent wow. Own it. Completely overlooked it. The slow cantrip is some neat tech for this list.
Artificer's Assistant you are right. I threw it in for the cheap scrying but Proteus Staff is spicy.
Cryptic Command for obvious reasons I'm avoiding counter magic but this is a powerful swiss army knife. Good eye!
Archmage Ascension seen this in a few of your lists. Your pet card. Hard to argue with instead of drawing a card Demonic Tutor it's just without a proliferate strategy to add counters it's a big requirement to meet.
Ward of Bones this is one of my pet card. Works best in planeswalker/instant/sorcery heavy strategies.
Dispersing Orb You are determined to not play with creatures haha I'm going to seriously consider this if I end up cutting Hullbreaker Horror and Tidespout Tyrant but the cantrip removal they grant is too powerful. Show and Tell fodder in absence of Blightsteel Colossus. Awesome suggestion.
hootsnag on Hurkyl, Tempo Master Wizard
4 months ago
Portent, Crawlspace, Web of Inertia, Dream Tides, War Tax, Glacial Chasm, Monastery Siege, Cryptic Command, Extract, Portcullis, Dissipation Field, Overburden, Archmage Ascension, Frozen Aether, Reins of Power, Rapid Hybridization, Siren's Call, Cyclonic Rift, Mission Briefing, Reality Shift, and Resculpt are just a few you could potentially use. You can very easily go creatureless if you want to. You just have to lean on different win conditions and use cards like Ward of Bones /etc.
Joker4242 on Day's Recasting
4 months ago
Well, I already got Snapcaster Mage.
You know, I thought about the Hermit. I like that he can be played from the graveyard, even after being milled or killed. I don't think I'd play Draining Whelk or Voracious Greatshark because of their mana cost. One of the reasons I took out Cryptic Command. Great card, but slow.
I do think adding another creature to the deck would do it some good however.
thesilentpyro on "Casual" Anti-Rez Flash
4 months ago
- 2x Daze for surprise shenanigans and Mystic Sanctuary plays
- 2x Cryptic Command because value
- 2x Brazen Borrower because need more tempo
- 1x Mystic Sanctuary because value
- 1x Nightpack Ambusher because the deck wants as much interaction as possible and 4mv finishers are hard in a tempo deck
- 2x Mana Leak to make room for 2x Daze
- 2x Mystic Snake to make room for 2x Cryptic Command and because it kinda sucks
- 1x Snow-Covered Forest to make room for the third Mystic Sanctuary and we're dropping some green requirements
- 1x Hullbreacher to make room for Brazen Borrower
|Have (3)||metalmagic , Azdranax , gildan_bladeborn|
|Want (7)||Amaterasu312 , Meo , koendijkstra , SaveTheDolphins , lewj , Arrzarrina , gravismute|