|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Commander 2016 (C16)||Rare|
|Tenth Edition (10E)||Rare|
|Ninth Edition (9ED)||Rare|
|Ninth Edition Foreign Black Border (9EDFBB)||Rare|
|Deckmasters: Garfield vs. Finkel (DKM)||Rare|
|Seventh Edition (7ED)||Rare|
|Classic Sixth Edition (6ED)||Rare|
|Fifth Edition (5ED)||Rare|
|Ice Age (ICE)||Rare|
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: Add to your mana pool.
: Add or to your mana pool. Karplusan Forest deals 1 damage to you.
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Karplusan Forest Discussion
3 weeks ago
Looking at your list, I'd rather not try to make the Valakut plan work, since you always need green mana on turn 1 for an elf/sprawl. The order of good dual lands to have in Ponza normally goes as such: fetchlands, shocklands (Stomping Ground), fastlands (Copperline Gorge), Cinder Glade (this moves up a spot if you have fetchlands), then Karplusan Forest or Rootbound Crag. Utopia Sprawl needs to enchant a land with the 'forest' subtype, so having dual lands without that subtype don't help when you draw hands with sprawl as your acceleration in certain cases. Copperline Gorge gets the nod over Rootbound Crag simply because you need untapped lands in the beginning of the game and seeing an opening hand with a Cinder Glade and Rootbound Crag as your only lands means you're going to be behind. For right now, I'd drop the valakut in favor of a Kessig Wolf Run, and swap some rootbound crags for more forests and work towards getting the lands over time. The Ponza facebook page often has people looking to sell their ponza decks or pieces of their decks, so you could try there to find a deal. Otherwise just work on getting the lands as you can, starting with Wooded Foothills and Stomping Ground
As far as threats go, Inferno Titan shouldn't be out of the budget for most players since I think it still costs around $2, and you only need 2-3 copies. The threats you have now are fine, but once someone plays a 4/5 goyf against you you'll find that you'll wish you had something that goes over top of it. Titan also sweeps away tokens and small creatures which can otherwise be a problem for our non-trampling beaters, so I'd look to pick up at least 2 copies in place of your 2nd courser and a huntmaster. (courser is really good when you have Tireless Tracker and Chandra, Torch of Defiance synergies to go with it. Otherwise it's just ok.)
Other than that, I agree with everything clayperce has suggested. Blood Moon has had some recent reprints which means it's likely as cheap as its going to get for a while right now. Ponza needs a lot of things to go right in order to win its games, so you want to fight against your deck as little as possible for it to do what you want it to do, which makes building a budget version hard since it really needs the best lands and Blood Moons. Good luck though!
1 month ago
Hope you don't mind some suggestions from ya boi Owen. I've looked thoroughly through your list and have some ideas to propose to you. Totally up to you whether or not to use these cards (I won't be offended either way- at the end of the day this still looks like a solid, fun list!). But here are some suggestions:
Replace some of the counterspells: I've noticed you've put a lot of counters in here. This is good- make sure people can't achieve their wincons. But 19 might be a little too much- mono blue can work very effectively with just 10 counterspells (especially with the draw and topdeck manipulation you will be able to achieve with this deck). Here are in my opinion the top ten best budget counterspells: Arcane Denial, Swan Song, Counterspell, Mana Leak, Foil, Pact of Negation, Summary Dismissal, Disallow, Muddle the Mixture, Condescend. And of course you have access to Mana Drain which could easily replace any counter out of the ones I just listed. Even if you want to stay at 19 counters, I would highly recommend taking out Annul, Ceremonious Rejection, Essence Scatter, and Spell Shrivel to put in cards like Swan Song, Arcane Denial, and Foil.
Draw Spells: You've got good stuff in here like Pull from Tomorrow and Stroke of Genius, but sometimes paying X every time you want to draw cards can be a bit too much (especially when you are trying to cast high cost Sphinxes). I'd recommend removing Stroke of Genius, Fact or Fiction, and Fortune's Favor to put in Frantic Search, Dig Through Time, and Paradoxical Outcome. Frantic Search lets you untap lands, Dig Through Time is just too good, and Paradoxical Outcome can let you net mana off of bouncing Sol Ring while also letting you get more ETB effects off of your replayed creatures. For strong early game draw, I'd recommend removing Braingeyser to fit in Mystic Remora.
Ramp: Since your average CMC of the deck is 3.48 and blue gives very little access to land ramp like green, you'll need to back that up with a buttload of artifact ramp. You need to put in Thran Dynamo, Mind Stone, and Sapphire Medallion. They will help you a LOT. Having Dreamstone Hedron, Everflowing Chalice, and Caged Sun in here addition to the other artifact ramp will definitely give you an edge over other players in mana. Also I'd recommend putting in at least 3 more islands.
Acid Rain: This card makes me lol against mono green players. It seems entertaining but may be a useless draw when playing against decks that don't run green. Or even if they do run green it could be something like my Surrak Dragonclaw deck that only runs a few forests with most everything else being nonbasics that don't have forest type like Karplusan Forest. Due to this, if you want to put in some land hate, run Frozen AEther. People will hate you but it's not too mean and it certainly puts you ahead and gains you even more counterspell advantage.
Sphinxes: Here are some Sphinxes I've found that I think would really do you a lot of work and versatility in this deck: Guardian of Tazeem, Chancellor of the Spires, Sphinx Ambassador, and Deadeye Navigator. Yeah, I know the Navigator isn't a Sphinx but he can blink your Sphinxes to get their ETB effects as well as Unesh's trigger. Endless value for only 2 mana.
Target Removal: I would recommend taking out a couple counterspells in order to fit in Reality Shift, Rapid Hybridization, Pongify, AEtherspouts, or AEtherize. These cards have insane value. Everyone expects a counterspell, but nobody expects their Pathbreaker Ibex to suddenly become a 3/3 Pepe the frog at the end of main phase.
The Immortal Sun. This card would do wonders for this deck- you saw first hand how well it worked on Saturday night. Imagine James trying to play that goddamn Teferi, Temporal Archmage with Immortal Sun out. Glorious.
Terramorphic Expanse and Evolving Wilds. Think about these two for a second. They come into play, you sac them and go fetch and island and put the island into play tapped. Your deck is mono blue- so the only thing you can fetch with these is a basic island. If you just replace these with basic islands they'll come in untapped.
Anywho- those are my recommendations! Hope they help and I'm really looking forward to seeing you play this deck! Sorry I went into so much gross detail about my suggestions but I really do love looking through lists and then writing about them.
1 month ago
- I think the biggest thing you could probably do to make the deck more reliable is to smooth your mana curve a little. For a deck without Bloodbraid Elf, I usually recommend ~13 3-drops, ~8 4-drops, ~3x 5-drops, and ~2 6-drops. I get it that the deck is built around Eternal Witness and Primal Command/Plow Under, so you may not want to mess with those numbers, but with 7x Plow effects, you're almost certainly going to get some in your opening hand, and that can be kind of rough. So maybe drop to 5x total (kind of replacing the "traditional" 5- and 6-drops slots)? That'll free up some room for the Blood Moons you have coming in.
- If you're not running 6-drops, you could probably get by with just a little less ramp. A "traditional" list is 10x dorks (Sprawls, Elves, and Birds) and 21-22 Lands, so I suspect you could go from 11x to 10x dorks, even with your 20 Lands.
- I'm not honestly sure what to do to improve the mana base. Wooded Foothills are of course a little pricey, but the ability to fetch exactly what we need is just SO nice. Pain lands like Karplusan Forest are a solid budget option as well.
- Stampeding Serow can be kind of painful unless you have a Witness on board ... turning them into Courser of Kruphix (great with Chandra) or Pulse of Murasa (for lifegain and a little more recursion) might be worthwhile.
Good luck (and good skill) with the build!
2 months ago
These are exactly the suggestions I was hoping for. I work constantly and would have noticed these things eventually, but to others it may just be obvious.
Opal Palace has a place, and is probably strictly better in this deck than in most, but I'm not sure what to remove to get it in there, since most of my land fetch creatures grab basics I don't want to take too many away.
2 months ago
Thanks, very much cdkime.
So far it's pretty casual. I may get into a modern night, but that happens an hour away from where I live and I have enough people to play with here for now. Just taking a relaxed approach for now.
Good points on the land. It was the price points that kept me from even looking. I think City of Brass has great potential, especially combined with something like Karplusan Forest in this deck. If this deck evolves to act quick enough, the 1 damage shouldn't be a problem. This deck is still unfolding pretty fast, even with those one turn waits, but I do notice myself often missing one more play per turn.
The thought with Dictate of Karametra is it wouldn't generally cast until that last push, like when I'd be ready to play the Crater's Claws. It worked out in my tests where I play Dictate of Karametra, untap all land with Dramatic Reversal, then doubled my mana up for a big Crater's Claws.That was before I realized Dramatic Reversal only untapped nonland permanents.. oops... Perhaps Early Harvest or Bear Umbra instead of dramatic reversal? Or am I heading the wrong direction with this and those spots would be better suited for something else?
I believe you're probably right about 4 copies of the better low-cost cards... I haven't defined what those are yet. Any recommendations for me to trial?
I definitely have found myself wanting more Hardened Scales.
Thanks again for your time and the recommendations. I am grateful, and excited to order the cards for this when it's a little finer tuned so I can trial it live.
2 months ago
Is there a particular format you plan to play, or is this just casual? I presume the later. If you wish to play at a game store, you should consider trying to make the deck Modern legal--most game stores have a Modern night.
Upgrading your mana base will help you considerably--lands that enter tapped are less than ideal. A perfect mana base can be pretty expensive (Duel Lands, Shock Lands, Fetch Lands), but here are some budget alternatives to consider:
- Replace Frontier Bivouac with City of Brass. The 1 damage is fairly insignificant, and it provides any colour you might need.
- Replace Temple of Abandon and one Swamp with Karplusan Forest. You have the option of using this land for generic mana for free.
- You could probably stand to lose a couple copies of Llanowar Reborn (possibly all of them). I would replace them with another pain land (like Karplusan Forest) that produces Green and something else.
Dictate of Karametra helps your allies as much as it helps you, and has quite a high mana cost. I would not run it.
More copies of Hardened Scales would not hurt--the extra +1/+1 counters stack, and at one mana, it is easy enough to cast.
Signal the Clans is a terrible tutor. Probably not worth running.
Overall, I think you are off to a good start. As you test your deck more, figure out what works, and what does not. You should really be running 4 copies of your best low-costed creatures, so figure out which ones you want to make sure you always draw.
2 months ago
I think its worth it, you could also play the Saheeli Rai + Liquimetal Coating + Altar of the Brood as your win condition, because when I tested it, it seemed to run out of steam and this will help you close out the game immediately and seemingly out of nowhere. I hope you don't mind, but I made a non-budget brew of this list here:
Maybe it'll give you some ideas, if you want I can annotate a link in my description to give you credit for the decklist. If you are looking for budget lands as a replacement, I recommend Frontier Bivouac Karplusan Forest Shivan Reef and Yavimaya Coast
2 months ago
Karplusan Forest is a good budget land if you want to play it RG for the sweepers, because you can usually avoid to tap it for coloured mana, but you will have both Red and green if you need them.