|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|War of the Spark: Mythic Edition (WARMED)||Mythic Rare|
|Modern Masters 2015 Edition (MM2)||Mythic Rare|
|Duel Decks: Elspeth vs. Tezzeret (DDF)||Mythic Rare|
|Shards of Alara (ALA)||Mythic Rare|
Combos Browse all
Tezzeret the Seeker
Legendary Planeswalker — Tezzeret
+1: Untap up to two target artifacts.
-X: Search your library for an artifact card with converted mana cost X or less and put it into play. Then shuffle your library.
-5: Artifacts you control become artifact creatures with base power and toughness 5/5 until end of turn.
|Have (3)||lorddarkstar , , Bluboltar|
|Want (14)||The_Cheese_Pie , LordZZX , futility_jp , Regoober , MathiasDuch , Flamadiddle , Luxtra , sinfolife , Ivannorr , metljoe , metalriders , notarobotyet , Volition85 , smabdulm|
Tezzeret the Seeker Discussion
2 days ago
here we are, recieving a ban that hurts our deck quite a lot. I see that you changed your list into a storm based combo with Aetherflux + Paradoxical Outcome. My approach was shifitng more into control (see my List).
There are some cardchoices you are running I'm quite curious about. Gonna list them here:
is Arcum's Astrolabe worth its slot?
Illusionist's Bracers seem very slow to me. While comboing with Aphetto and creating value with Azami, that card is kinda situational I think. What are your results from testing?
also no Time Spiral ?
3 days ago
Combos/notes on my take:
- One thing I didn't realize initially was that that Golos' ability still observes timing rules, so you don't want to activate him on an off turn, as you can't play the lands.
There are some notable differences between our decks, the biggest of which is I don't run Ghostly Flicker - I'm looking for more repeatable flickering via Conjurer's Closet , Tawnos's Coffin and Soulherder - I had considered putting a Gilded Drake to take people stuff and then get back with flickering, but that takes away from the primary purpose of the deck as a Maze's End build.
Added Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle , Prismatic Omen and Splendid Reclamation for that classic Scapeshift / Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle play, along with Prismatic Omen just being sweet mana fixing (along with making everything mountains for Valakut, obviously)
Added Circuitous Route , because it's a nice ramp spell for this deck.
Again, thanks for making the primer, and hopefully I can offer some ideas back to you or others on their builds.
5 days ago
So given you're not after infinite combo, the next best pairing of cards you could tutor for are Unwinding Clock and Vedalken Orrery , so you can cast a spell every single turn with Urza and a couple rocks. Tezzeret the Seeker and Fabricate can both help you assemble it much faster than the portals.
1 week ago
Hissp looking at the build it seems casting tutor mages may be too slow, other than Fabricate all other tutor options put scepter/engine into play. All the tutors other than Tezzeret the Seeker create a clue off Trail of Evidence , and tezz is too strong not to run. Finally the deck has no way to utilize the body of the mages other than blocking tymna etc. T
TLDR The mages are low tempo low synergy.
3 weeks ago
KongMing brings an interesting point that I'm not sure has been established: "Almost any fetch land (...)"
I know I am taking this out of context, but there are a ton of cards that tutor without exactly being thought of as a "tutor".
Lands are also tutors. Literally all Fetch lands, including Evolving Wilds and Terramorphic Expanse , not to mention cards that search for lands such as Expedition Map , Sylvan Scrying , Tempt with Discovery , Reap and Sow , etc.
Heck, we even have Planar Bridge which is just an all-around basic tutor engine.
Then we get into Planeswalkers such as Nahiri, the Harbinger , Samut, the Tested , Garruk, Caller of Beasts , Tezzeret the Seeker , Sarkhan, Dragonsoul , Sarkhan Unbroken , and Liliana Vess to name a decent portion of them.
So "tutors" seem to be a lot more expansive than just the basic 1 - 4 CMC black sorcerys we are use to thinking of. To ask for an "archetype" that has none of these as well as the vast swath of unmentioned cards is actually kind of backbreaking to build. You purposely have to go out of your way to not at least consider some type of card in some kind of color(s) to assist you with. At that point, you're really building more of a challenge deck to test your skill as a deck builder, such as a "one-word tribal" or "goofy hats matter" deck.
It can be done. I'm sure there are tons and tons of decks out there that don't have a single tutor in them, but at the same time those are probably going to be mono-colored decks that have some sort of serious draw potential or so much duplication in terms of cards they select that they don't really NEED to find anything because it's probably going to be right there on top. Decks like this include: Aristocrats, Burn, Ramp, & Zoo.
At least, that's my thoughts on the matter. Either way, it's a good discussion to have as it helps set the tone on how to explore other hub ideas in the future :)
3 weeks ago
@ jaymc1130 Doesn't matter what the background is really in commander as it isn't supported and you could say whatever you like or makeup even if it's true it doesn't really matter... I'm looking at it from this point of view:
(no offense taken or meant at all by the way just good discussion that trains the eye on BS or actual facts ;) )
(If by any chance you're a friend of a certain IRL guy butthurt over surrak and plays fake twisters please move on if not ALL GUCCI xxx ;) )
Competitive EDH decks are designed with a few principles in mind:
No Budget Zone - Tournament wise it is not allowed to proxy a card but don't hold yourself back and try it with friends in normal games! On this level of play having something cost 1 mana more (but does the same thing) or come one turn too late is detrimental and could have an opponent win before you could... Second place is not what a deck like this is looking for... upgrades to cards you have is a must! flexible cards that do the same but better > Narrow cards that do specific things...
The Idea - No spite plays, no-nonsense politics, proper threat assessment. An ideal competitive player wants to make the correct decision at every point in the game, and competitive players should strive to reach that ideal regardless of any emotions... (tournament wise top 3 is what you are looking for consistently but pushing for #1 at all times)
Competitive Viability - Some Decks or Strategies are better than others end of story. While it's hard to define how good a strategy must be to be, It's consistency and other traits it has to push limits of what others can't do is what defines it to be viable...
Consistency - In a Dataless world of Cedh it's hard to communicate why this or that works better. tweaking and tuning a deck therefor is key to improve on its consistency and the outcome of this can be seen regularly if one attends tournaments or Leagues that do play commander or 4 man pods on the same level that should feel threatened by your deck at stages as early as turn 2 or 3...
The "Turn 3" rule - cEDH has become a lot faster and faster with new releases. Right now, the critical turn on which you need to be able to either consistently threaten a win or an insurmountable advantage or have the means to stop others from winning, be it through interaction spells or static effects, is turn 3. If your deck isn't consistently relevant by turn 3, it's not competitive.
This all does not mean that everyone should only be playing the same proven decks or cards over and over, but choosing to hamstring yourself when clearly stronger options exist does not fall within the scope of competitive EDH.
cookie-cutter rule of law!
actual friends and pods are irrelevant even if they bring your "15K" decks to the table they still might suck and play different from what a blind tournament setting would offer :)
Unwinding Clock . #Worththeslotformaximumcompetitiveness!
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale boi the construct can die for all I care to pay for Urza the turn after... and 1 mana for the only relevant creature that we really want to keep is fine by me as opposed to people struggling with dorks... #Worththeslotformaximumcompetitiveness!
Tezzeret the Seeker #Worththeslotformaximumcompetitiveness!
Rhystic Study / Verity Circle personal preference, both equally good in either meta... Circle just requires dorks which see a lot of play anyway Rhystic doesn't need anything to do its job. #Worththeslotformaximumcompetitiveness!
I'm Liking Sai at the moment. Not going to look at Future Sight though at all!
Crystal Shard : Plays 6 creatures, borders on unnecessary and just Any generic spell under Scepter + Paradox is way more effective. not a fan of adding dead slots... Switch this to the clock and you'll perform better...
Trini and mages remain a big NONO especially mages narrowness... Trini can be played but you can NEVER effectively break parity on it. not a necessary slot at all. and will not be an addition to this version ever...
Aether Spellbomb : Borders on unnecessary I don't know what meta you are really coming from but slow down there champ... this card SUCKS I'd rather play any artifact I have now over this... passing the turn with constructs to attack with? we already have swans so Nty to more dead slots... sac for a single draw while on already compact and very powerful combo's and better artifacts, NTY! I mean just play Opt or something instead and you'll see an increase in consistency ;)
The Playgroup is irrelevant as pods of friends offer nothing but tuned builds on those specific pods.. again I'm looking at it from the Cedh point of view mentioned before and blind meta (for ex tournaments, leagues, where 100% is the standard... even tough in this dataless world of Cedh I can fairly easily say this deck could compete without problem in any of your pods ;).
Again no offense taken, but you should reconsider and research a bit more decks if you're going to suggest crystal shards xD and claim to be a pro at anything ;)... thanks for the input though and be sure to check other Urza's out there right now as they'll be pretty close to resembling this one I hope but I'm sure they do!
4 weeks ago
Hey, @jaymc1130, Thanks for the in Depth response I really appreciate it!
"there are a number of choices that are particularly awkward in terms of Cedh and prevent this list from being as competitive as it could be"
Now that would be merely a biased opinion in a dataless world were no tournament viable feedback or anything else is available except for some wonky "FUNmander" youtube channels that attempt to play "Cedh" but don't even come close to what a tournament setting and maximum competitiveness would represent...
Either way, Our commander league, Tournaments, and FNM over here don't mean anything either but the experience of some of our pods are easily on par or even way better than any player on any power/tier/whatever list or any channel/stream you can imagine (not talking about the garbage command zone, TeamTurnThree, or star-city games but most of them are irrelevant anyway as they always have the 4-5-6-7 same people in 4 man pods which does not mean anything either regarding consistency or tournament level competitive viability ;) )!
Nonetheless, I will go over your thoughts with care, but my list seems to have been outdated when you were typing: s
(Cards marked with were already cut during the time of your writing and for some reason you saw an outdated build or my deck hadn't updated yet nonetheless I left at 19:00 ish after the feature and update I did :) )
1 - Aetherflux Reservoir was already cut, the list just didn't want to update for an entire day now but this card isn't needed indeed...
1.1 - Jace, Wielder of Mysteries Though is an equally okay flex slot as for example "consul" or "tainted pact" routes as an extra backup when loopable spells no longer become an option or get used/exiled along the way... Just going for the same strategy is often not always possible and this can fight trough rule of law effects/sphere/ and heavy Stax meta pretty easy regardless of being drawn or not... while just exiling the entire deck under Urza and only having to resolve Jace and a +1 winds-of-rebuke/Labman/and also drawing you a card +1 ... you can side it out pretty easily here as well with any generic draw or interaction spell like you mentioned later on.
I' de say it's consistency would definitely not suffer from running Jace...
2 - Time Spiral : same as fluxervoir... didn't update for the longest time was taken out around 19:00 - 20:00 before featuring it as I had to go to work but yeah still working on the list, after tests and what not xD
3 - Unwinding Clock I can see where you are coming from but being able to tap out for single/multiple activations of Urza or tapping out for anything else and still untapping to be able to interact again still sounds good enough for me. Perhaps sinks could use it to create more advantages but I'm pretty sure just 1 or 2 of those won't make the difference... Yisan also loves its Seedborn Muse although here it's a bit more specific for artifacts and Urza...
4 - The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale It is Just too good in dork/tymna/frog/ or 90% of the decks that need their commander in play to actually do something Meta (najeela,sissay,yisan,gitrog,selvala,and the list goes on and on and on)... + great against Hatebears.. it is fairly expensive sure but if it's not in your budget just use any utility land you see fit or an extra island...
5 - Gilded Lotus : List didn't update...
6 - Tezzeret the Seeker : Tezzeret is a wincon -5 + more mana +1 + a tutor for everything this deck is about so definitely not the wrong deck for it...
7 - Fabricate : Mages are too narrow and don't even compare to Fabricate as it can fetch any artifact at the same CMC so why handicap yourself on specific CMC when you, for example, aren't looking for that CMC 2 card and could have won using a way more flexible tutor...
8 - Fellwar Stone : Fellwar stone 70 % of the time always taps for blue... But you're right there are better Artifacts to slot in, but since I'm on so many I'm actually going to give Sai a shot as he can also combo with some of the cards already in the deck and draw cards...
9 - Merchant Scroll , Dig Through Time , and Fact or Fiction : The cards have always worked and will always work + dig deep so they are kinda auto-includes for me and many others amongst the Cedh community.
10 - Rhystic Study : Hmm, even if they pay for it it has done its job pretty damn well... The amount of time you can come back from otherwise lost games with this card is Absurd... even if it's only one extra card per turn cycle it's worth it and on many occasions, not everyone can afford to pay up... This is a Mono-Blue deck and will have a lot of grindy games so why not grind harder than everyone else? Again if you don't forget the trigger having them pay 1 more for everything sounds like an auto-include one-sided sphere effect to me with the added bonus of drawing you and generating card advantage at any stage of the game if they don't or can't...
Onto your inclusions for this deck:
11 - Crystal Shard : Just no... pretty bad card...
12 - Voltaic Key : List didn't update...
13 - Trophy Mage : Mages are too narrow...
14 - Tangle Wire is okay to run but does die off rather quickly and should see more play in Stax heavier Urza decks... But Trinisphere As mentioned in the primer can only effectively be shut off during the end step of the opponents turn before your turn... it untaps in your turn and you can not break parity like you can with the orbs... Because using it for mana during your turn shuts it off for the others... So a no go for any Urza deck compared to the orb effects... even playing null rod is better than playing trinipshere here...
15 - Aether Spellbomb : Casting Urza and recasting Urza is a bad and slow plan I'm not committing this deck to and requires more dead slots... I'm fairly happy with the artifact suite right now + The Monolith package as it works and wins if it resolves paired with their respective pieces... I've been on Oona long enough and yea having more pieces to the puzzle that do the same and work together is pretty nice...
16 - Pongify and Rapid Hybridization : Are In the maybeboard, they are flex slots if your meta has more creature win conditions but here it's too mixed to have full effect from these (also loopable spell slots if you don't want a bird army but an ape army for example... the same goes for Reality Shift under a second scepter (copy artifact) it still requires a target for it to work though, but can be a wincon when looped)
17 - Mishra's Workshop : Sounds pretty good, to be honest!
4 weeks ago
Interesting build, but there are a number of choices that are particularly awkward in terms of cEDH and prevent this list from being as competitive as it could be.
First and foremost: Aetherflux Reservoir and Jace, Wielder of Mysteries . At 4 mana these cards are on the slower side for cEDH, and what's worse is both are only good in the situation where you are actively in the process of comboing off. 99% of the time you draw these they will be dead cards. You will lose more games per 100 played against top tier decks just running these cards than if you ran any 2 other random cards. Much too card slot inefficient for cEDH, I personally would never run either of them in any cEDH deck and expect to win consistently.
Time Spiral : If you already own and are running Timetwister then including this card seems very odd. It can't loop your Timetwister and is very difficult to cast. It's not a terrible inclusion for the purpose it serves, it's just that running it makes the deck less consistent in terms of opening hands and early plays as it will also be a dead card outside of actually comboing off. Another card that is too inefficient card slot wise to make the cut for cEDH.
Unwinding Clock : Cute, but it doesn't really have much synergy with the rest of the list. I'm looking for mana sinks that can repeatedly make use of the extra mana available, but Sai is in your maybe cards, there is no Kefnet or similar effect, not even so much as a Compulsion to generate value from the Clock triggers. Ultimately this Unwinding Clock is a card that is already fringe viable for cEDH and while I think there might be an Urza build that could make good use of it your current list seems rather lacking in it's ability to leverage that extra mana for maximum value.
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale : I'll be honest, I immediately included this card in my original lists as well. And then I play tested with it and found out that it was often proving more of an impediment to me than my opponents. Urza + Construct makes for a hefty upkeep tax without considering any other creatures that might come into play on your side or that you might wind up with multiple huge constructs out that are a serious threat you don't want to sacrifice but also can't afford to keep if you want to be able to interact with an opponent. I made the choice to cut this card and keep it as a side board option for specific creature heavy meta's where I'd run a less creature intense list myself and this decision wasn't all that difficult. It's also an extremely expensive card so many people who are not as lucky as I am to own a copy will find it difficult to accommodate.
Gilded Lotus : While this card is a staple for CVT decks, it's not a relevant card the majority of the time for an Urza deck. Urza is already turning all artifacts into mana rocks, it costs 5 mana, and since Urza makes blue mana the colored mana is also not relevant. Fine card, wrong deck for it though.
Tezzeret the Seeker : Similar to Gilded Lotus, this card is a staple for CVT, but out of place in Urza decks. Too mana intensive, a bit on the slow side, and running Paradox Engine as a primary means of untapping basically turns him into a 5 mana artifact tutor that can't fetch Paradox Engine itself. Fine card, probably the wrong deck.
Fabricate : I've been back and forth on including this and ultimately have opted not to run it. I think it's an acceptable card to run, even if it's a bit on the edge of what's truly cEDH viable, but Urza builds focused on low cost artifacts can probably get more value from the tutor mages (Trophy, Trinket, Tribute). Particularly when combined with an Urza must run card I will get to later, the mages out perform Fabricate for their ability to be reused and as blockers that can trade for Tmnya (a very important consideration in cEDH).
Fellwar Stone : In a mono blue deck where all your artifacts are regularly turned into blue moxen this card seriously under performs when compared to Thought Vessel or Mind Stone which offer some utility outside of being pure mana rocks. It seems like a very odd inclusion if the goal is to be cEDH level competitive. Card slot efficiency is key and the other options mentioned bring more to the table.
Merchant Scroll , Dig Through Time , and Fact or Fiction : I've elected not to run any of these for the time being, let me know how they work for you. I'd be really interested to hear how consistently they create the right kind of value as these are options I have on my radar but feel there are better inclusions.
Rhystic Study : Is a card I've cut from every single cEDH deck I have. The meta has become to grindy with games taking quite a long time and tons of mana available to every player for this card to generate any value at all in my games. Everyone pays for it every time, it's just too slow to get it out, and the mana spent to deny draws seems to very rarely impact opponent's abilities to interact appropriately. I consider this card at the moment to be extreme fringe viable for cEDH at best.
On to some noticeable exceptions from your list.
Crystal Shard : This card is an absolute must run win con for Paradox Engine Urza lists for cEDH. It's hands down proven to be the single most reliable and effective method of winning games in my testing so far and should be run even by budget lists as the card is very affordable to acquire. Generating an infinite army of infinitely large creatures that generate exponential mana ramp all at one time is more than enough to win games. It's never a dead card as it can generate value outside of winning the game where cards like Jace and Aetherflux cannot and is easier to cast than either. A must run for cEDH Paradox Urza lists.
Voltaic Key : Another must run combo enabler and value generator card for any Paradox deck of any color that also runs Top and mana rocks. Just assembling Key, Top, Engine, and mana rocks totaling at least 2 mana production means infinite draw and untap triggers, infinite storm count, and eventually infinite mana as you draw into more rocks. Absolute must run for cEDH viability. At worst it's a 1 cmc mana rock, at best it wins you the game.
Trophy Mage : A quality value body that can find a number of pieces that buy Urza the time needed to go off or the all important Crystal Shard (often the first target, so you can reuse the mage repeatedly for the other targets).
Tangle Wire and Trinisphere : Already running Static Orb, so Tangle Wire should be a no brainer to completely lock down opposing board states and create an opportunity to combo off. Trinisphere, likewise, can be better leveraged by Urza than any other commander and can seriously complicate opponent's abilities to interact, advance board state, etc. Easy to tutor for with Trophy Mage. Turn into mana rocks that allow you to deactivate their effects at will. The best time buying options available to cEDH Urza lists.
Aether Spellbomb : Already running Academy Ruins and Candelabra, so this should be an auto include. Worst case scenario, it's a one cmc mana rock. Situational use scenario, it can interact with the board when needed. Best case scenario, it wins the game through allowing repeated castings of Urza, or infinite draw triggers to draw itself (using Ruins to put it on top of library before it's draw trigger resolves) which generate infinite spell casts for infinite Paradox untap triggers for infinite mana to do basically anything you would like. Must run if already running Candelabra and Ruins.
Rings of Brighthearth and Basalt Monolith : I run these as a flex combo for extra resiliency and more consistent access to infinite mana generation. Between Paradox Engine, Dramatic Scepter, and these its going to be very difficult for opponents to shut down all our infinite mana generation options with a lucky Ashiok, Dream Render activation or similar effect. These two also happen to be easy to tutor for as Trophy mage can target them both. Brighthearth also combos with SDT for multiple draw triggers allowing the drawing of the whole deck and infinite spell casts into infinite untaps with Paradox Engine out for 1 more mana than Key+Top. Redundancy like this where multiple pieces all provide the same net effect makes the deck's performance more consistent against other top tier decks that will all be running tons of interaction and disruption elements that can often stifle your first, second, or even third attempts to position for a win.
Pongify and Rapid Hybridization : Cheap effective creature interaction in a color that often lacks good ways to deal with creatures. I'm not running Gilded Drake at the moment, but that has more to do with my meta not including good targets for it (like Gitrog Monster). These 3 cards are going to be the primary means of dealing with a troublesome creature for cEDH Urza lists, and you must be able to run enough interaction to interact often enough in the longer, grindier meta of cEDH at the moment.
Mishra's Workshop : Doesn't feel like a must run to me, but I have rather enjoyed it's performance in my games thus far. Particularly potent on turn 1 when you have multiple mana rocks in hand and can enable extremely early Paradox Engine drops.
I've got my list here if you'd like to take a look: Looper
Tezzeret the Seeker occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.05%