Creature — Human Rogue
: Draw two cards. Target opponent gains control of Humble Defector. Activate this ability only during your turn.
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|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Humble Defector Discussion
4 days ago
Thank you so much for your interest in my deck and this thorough suggestion list and comment. So starting off with the draw you suggested, I kinda missed War Room , I am currently making up a list of things I want to change and I'm slightly changing up the pacing and direction and will be adding more draw. So War Room will definitely be one on the list. Tome of Legends is on my list already so thank you for confirmation on a good draw, especially with Norin popping in and out every turn. I don't know why but Endless Atlas doesn't feel too good to me, maybe if it were 1 mana I'd probably throw that in too but as is I'll pass. Humble Defector my current meta isn't super into playing nice politics so I haven't considered this, also the lack of abusable ETB makes me lean against it. I'll probably talk more on my meta at the end of the comment. As for Ignite the Future and Light Up the Stage they have been kinda on a watchlist, the list I'm working on is gonna look to make big plays with a handful of x cost spells so the flashback with Ignite the Future is less spicy in that sense but still a card I'm looking into playtesting a bit.
Moving on to the Ramp suggestions Curse of Opulence seems nice and I will definitely consider it as I change Norin up to keep it feeling a bit more fresh. Dockside Extortionist I haven't picked up yet because I support my LGS as much as possible and they ones I frequent the most haven't had any in stock when I've been there, and the one time they did - money was a factor. As for the crypt and the gauntlet, I have been playing magic for 20 some years now so many of the pricey cards weren't so pricey when I got them and also have had a healthy local trading market. Yes Myriad Landscape is too slow for my liking. You are correct in your assumption that I am not running Ruby Medallion because of the high amount of artifacts I'm running. It will likely be reconsidered. Sword of the Animist seems kinda good on paper, but my meta likes to do lots of spell casting on other peoples turns so I feel bad spending 2 to equip only to have someone cast a spell and make Norin go away. Oh, and as for Gauntlet of Power and Caged Sun both are going in with my next big change so stay tuned lol.
Utility & Misc. Chandra, Torch of Defiance is good, I'll consider it but not sure where to fit it in, also she will never live to see her -7 in my meta. Dualcaster Mage wasn't considered because I'm only running 9 sorcery and 1 instant and most of them not super great to duplicate, my new list may change this so I may come back and reconsider. Sunbird's Invocation seems perfect for the new list I'm cooking up, thank you! I will definitely play test that. Blast Zone just seems meh, I don't like the XX cost, I haven't found too many enchantments I've wanted to remove and when I do I make them artifacts and destroy them or take them. Flametongue Kavu and Inferno Titan just seem too expensive for what they do, the Kavu being limited to creatures is a bummer imo. Terror of the Peaks should go on to replace Warstorm Surge I'll have to look into that. And lastly Zealous Conscripts used to be in the deck along with a Goblin Recruiter and Moggcatcher and every game was basically the same, tutor for kiki and either gamble or wheel into zealous it felt boring and I didn't enjoy playing it. Might make a return one day in the right meta.
As for your synergy suggestion, I would add it but my new list is actually going to omit Mind's Eye.
Now for my meta... well I currently find myself in limbo as just a few weeks ago my group had a bit of a falling out. Basically, one of my friends became the direct boss of others in the group and he had to let one of them go from the company during covid lockdowns and it just created a lot of bad blood. Drama aside, we had some people showing up with cEDH decks when others were playing intentionally suboptimal decks and only one other person would play nice politics with me so it was kind of difficult at times. Ridiculous amounts of removal, both targeted and mass, so I typically felt somewhat okay running a bit light on that. Also with reds artifact hate and the ability to turn things into artifacts I never really felt disadvantaged.
As I said a few times I am making some changes and I'll be adding things like Firecat Blitz and Tempt with Vengeance to dump a mass amount of creatures in at once for those warstorm/pandemonium effects. I am currently focusing primarily on a new Alesha, Who Smiles at Death deck that you may enjoy, I hope to get it up and made public in the next two or three days. And if you enjoyed this Norin deck for it's low cmc curve you may enjoy the Alesha deck because it's even lower!
Thank you again for taking interest and thanks for the upvote. All of these suggestions are appreciated. :) I hope you have a great weekend.
1 week ago
I like your deck and it's avg cmc. How do you deal with the lack of card draw red has? I see you have some wheels, but without a reliable way to tutor for them or draw into them, wouldn't it be best to add more general card draw to help ensure you don't run out of gas. Have you considered the following....
Humble Defector - Draw + Politics. I use homeward path in my build for this slight synergy and politics with confusion in the ranks. Not needed but fun. Also noteworthy is homeward path's ability to mess with opposing GY shenanigans should they attempt to reanimate ours/other creatures
Curse of Opulence - T1 Norin, T2 Curse. T3 Profit + Politics
Dockside Extortionist - Speaking of treasure, is he not included due to price? I see you have gauntlet of might and mana crypt so I'm unsure if you have budget restrictions
Myriad Landscape - Or is it too slow?
Ruby Medallion - Are you not running this due to it's inability to ramp artifacts? I find it useful nevertheless, especially when trying to dump your hand, I think its potential use outweighs the lack of artifact ramp.
Sword of the Animist - T1 Norin, T2 Sword, T3 Norin grabs the sword, swings at the enemy, runs away back to safety while grabbing a land. I like land ramp due to it being less susceptible to removal and fueling valakut.
Dualcaster Mage - Value + combo with heat shimmer or twinflame should you wish to go that route. Each of those cards fuels ETB synergies as well.
Sunbird's Invocation - Expensive to cast but THE VALUE if it sticks. Hit or miss with many players, but has won me too many games to count. Perhaps my meta might be a bit more relaxed than yours though
Blast Zone - See no way for you to interact with enchantments. This might help should you wish. Nice with crucible
Flametongue Kavu - Removes most creatures, although it kills itself if its the only targettable creature on board
Inferno Titan - Burn, baby burn!
Terror of the Peaks - Burn baby burn part 2!
Zealous Conscripts - ETB value + Combo with Kiki-Jiki
A synergy to put in your description is Honor Shaku + Norin + Mind's eye = Draw during each opponent's draw step by tapping norin to fuel honor and honor to fuel mind's eye
Looking forward to your response to each suggestion. +1, nice deck. Would love to know more about your meta as well.
2 weeks ago
wegnerdevin As I see it, Deception or Social Manipulation are part of the game around the table, not in the cards. Bongus mentions cards like Humble Defector and Secret Rendezvous that may help gain allies, but I would consider those under Group Hug. If you're only supporting one person, that's not a viable long-term strategy that I've seen, nor is it a deck archetype.
Let me ask this of the people who want a Politics hub or similar: How would you define it clearly and concisely in at most two short sentences, without simply defining multiplayer games and social interaction?
1 month ago
There are gonna be a lot of suggestions, feel free to choose what you think works best. First a question, what is the purpose of braid of fire, what are you spending the mana on during your upkeep? Be sure to let me know what you think of each suggestion, I am curious to hear your thoughts.
Outpost Siege - Draw, works nice with top so you can guarantee you can cast it
Ignite the Future / Light Up the Stage - Similar to the above, but more immediate. Flashback has won me 3 games in my meta, although my avg CMC is 3.58 so its a bit higher. Light up the stage might be a better fit due to cmc .
Wheel of Fortune - Draw + Nice card you tutored for, I hope you have recursion
Feldon of the Third Path - Useful in an ETB build
Etali, Primal Storm - Not a synergistic suggestion, but a fun, somewhat chaos based one. It's nice to cast a rishkar's expertise for 6 and then drop a memory jar after topdecking Etali and giving it haste with hanweir battlements
Flametongue Kavu - Removal, do note if there are no other creatures it kills itself. Nice with ETB doublers
Imperial Recruiter - Tutor in red? Sign me up! Nice to search for kiki-jiki
Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker + Zealous Conscripts = Both good on their own, infinite together. I know the CMC is a bit high, but I think it's worth it. After all, what's the point of all that ramp if you don't have much to ramp into IMO
Inventors' Fair - Tutor 1/4th your deck, lifegain has helped me a few times.
Nevinyrral's Disk - Enchantment removal/wipe
Skullclamp - Genesis chamber tokens, hell, I've clamped norin sometimes making him cost 7.
Mind's Eye / Memory Jar - I run both, but you might prefer memory jar. I like mind's eye personally because with Honor worn shaku + norin, you can tap norin during each opponent's draw step to draw a card.
Sword of the Animist - Quick Norin, the enemies are coming, grab a sword, now swing.... Norin....where did you go and why is there a land? It's cool when norin swings with the sword and ramps you. Very stable ramp, although the 2 equip cost is a slight pain, the ramp eventually more than makes up for it. I understand looking at your list you prefer artifact ramp, but I think ramping lands is quite helpful given all of the artifact destruction in EDH. Moreover, it's nice with valakut. I've burned people to deal with valakut + sword. Also, Feldon + Burnished heart was a fun little trick, albeit expensive mana wise. Anywise, I digress...
Wayfarer's Bauble - Similar to the above, kind of. Not needed, I like it. Thought it was worth mentioning.
Endless Atlas - Continuous draw is nice to have
Lastly.....not an entirely serious suggestion but Ugin, the Ineffable + Top + Experimental Frenzy / Mystic Forge = Draw your entire deck. With all 3 on field, tap top to draw, then place top on the deck. Mystic forge allows you to cast it and ugin makes the cast free. Rinse and repeat. Forge is obviously a better fit in the deck, Ugin ineffable provides enchantment removal and card draw, both needed. Thought it was cute when I discovered it, thought it was worth mentioning.
I'm looking forward to your detailed response :)
1 month ago
Profet93 Alright, allow me to address all of these lovelies.
Endless Atlas costs two mana, thence I backed away from it. It is in consideration, but likely to remain off.
Hedron Archive is just four mana, and this deck does not actually use that much.
Ignite the Future is a lot of mana, and then a lot more mana. No thank you.
Humble Defector involves giving my opponents things, and I am morally against that.
Light Up the Stage is fine, but this deck cannot reliably deal damage to reduce its stark cost.
Skullclamp is obscenely broken, but I only have fourteen creatures in this list, none of which yearning to die. Good, yet not here.
Ancient Tomb is always great, yet is tristfully fifty dollars at its cheapest. Lovely at the price of taxes.
Thank you very much for the suggestions! Rings shall definitely find a home.
1 month ago
Here are some ideas for card draw....
Rings of Brighthearth - Activate commander twice, top twice, etc.... lots of value
2 months ago
I did some more thinking and I can imagine trying out something like this:
- Honor-Worn Shaku -> Jeska's Will
- Loyal Apprentice -> Humble Defector
- Magus of the Wheel -> Ignite the Future
- Mountain -> Homeward Path
And then in the future probably:
2 months ago
Looks fun. You might like these: Jalira, Master Polymorphist , Perilous Forays , Humble Defector , Dominus of Fealty , Polymorph , Nephalia Smuggler , Feed the Pack , Teferi's Veil , Birthing Pod , Goblin Bombardment , Blood Aspirant , Dark-Dweller Oracle , Life's Legacy , Momentous Fall , Ooze Garden , Blade of the Bloodchief