Creature — Human Rogue1, Sacrifice a creature: Target player reveals the top card of his or her library until he or she reveals a land card, then puts those cards into his or her graveyard.
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Undercity Informer Discussion
1 hour ago
I noticed you have Dimir Infiltrator and Shred Memory with a Transmute 3, though nothing in the deck costs a CMC of 3, I do not know if this is still a WIP, i would recommend running some Glimpse the Unthinkable, for a lower cost mill or if you want to rely on the 3cmc Transmute a Mind Funeral, Jace Beleren, or Memory Erosion / Undercity Informer
Again not know what your idea/concept behind this is, just a few thoughts.
4 days ago
Okay! I finally have time to respond! The last two days have been really hectic, with me trying to finish two smaller research papers.
First, responding to NuBByThuMB:
Thank you so much for your comments! I do love mill and combo, and I am doing my best to make this as effective and interactive as I can within the Dimir Theme! I'm shooting for a 50-75% build, but I'm willing to make a few concessions for vanity's sake. Also some cards like Glimpse the Unthinkable and Sensei's Divining Top are a bit outside my budget at the moment because PhD apps are costly and it's Christmas time. Ive just been making do with what I have as I learn about Commander. I've only known about the format for a couple of months now. This is my first deck!
Providing a few justifications for my card choices, which you can feel free to debunk.
Hedron Crab was included as a way to get in some early mill. The same reasoning is actually why Mind Funeral and Undercity Informer ended up in the deck. I have found that if I don't have a few options for early mill, then Lazav just sits around looking ugly until I get to a higher cost mill spell that I can drop. A small creature like Hedron can also chump block a weak creature in the early game if I need. I guess I could cut him for Archive Trap to counter fetch lands and tutors.
Undercity Informer is a nice sac outlet in emergencies, comes out early so I can get my mill on, and I can sac my stuff if it is going to get killed blocking or in a wipe anyway. I'm open to some suggestions of things to replace him. What I struggle with is choosing cards that 'impact the board', because I'm not sure how much 'impact' is required to justify being one of the 99. My solution has been to find spells or effects that I like and try and get them on a creature. The Informer was doubly good because he also fits with my Ravnica/ Dimir theme. If I can find a copy of Erebos around, then I may consider him as a potential add. I know a couple people in my meta play some lifegain shenanigans. But, I'm wary of getting rid of some of my cheaper creatures because my deck is a bit slow and reactive already, I don't want to look too vulnerable early game because I have nothing that size along my mana curve...
Nighthowler was included because early game, like Wight of Precinct Six, he can usually be a 4/4 or a 5/5 with some early mill and defend me pretty well. Late game he is a good buff for any creature that needs it, like a voltron-Lazav strategy. This guy may get traded in for a Fate Unraveler that I have in my trade binder because of the synergy that you mentioned with my wheels
Phantasmal Image has had me on the fence for a while now because of how vulnerable he is. I may follow another suggestion and replace him with Dimir Infiltrator, who can also tutor for some combo pieces. Phyrexian Metamorph is one of my more versatile clones. I'm not sure what I could replace him with that would benefit me as well as he does. I'm sure you have some ideas.
Instants and sorceries
I noticed you said that you were looking into adding some more removal or counters into your deck. Perhaps some of my justifications can convince you of the utility of a few of these options. Or, they are feeble reasons and I should pack something much different.
The spot removal like GftT, Grisly Spectacle and Induce Paranoia are expensive. I could see cuts for at least Induce, because it rarely mills for too much (unless someone plays a Genesis Wave for 30, which is what convinced me to add it. If I take out Induce, it will be for the cheaper Psychic Strike. Grisly Spectacle has just been too reliable at milling for 30+ in the mid to late game because that's when people start swinging with crazy +1/+1'ed beaters. I took a guy out once by killing his own Consuming Aberration. Go for the Throat is included as an early game removal spell when something is threatening me like an early game commander, or when my deck is acting sluggish. Memory Plunder turns any instant or sorcery that I've milled into gold. I've stolen precious removal at desperate times, a kicked Rite of Replication or a Tooth and Nail. And those sorceries are able to be played at instant speed! The benefit of milling is that I can take advantage of the resources that they flip reluctantly into their yard. Cards like Plunder and Animate Dead help me capitalize on those things. Although I do agree that I need more tuck abilities. I just don't have a copy of any of the tuck counters to use for the time being.
If I take out Mind Funeral, It will probably be for my copy of Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver, since he is possible able to mill more over his stint on the board. Though I don't know if I will be able to defend him well without many creatures.
Sol Ring will likely become a copy of Strionic Resonator, since you made a good argument for why I don't need it and I ordered a couple copies not long ago.
I don't think I'll get enough permanents hitting the board short of an infinite loop to make Altar of the Brood viable.
I know that areas which I lack are graveyard hate (considering Shred Memory for that) and general mill effectiveness. I try to mitigate this by making good use of the little I am able to mill. I also feel that not going in whole-hog on the mill makes the game more fun for the others in my meta. In that case mill is more of a support strategy (I'd still like for it to be a more feasible wincon in a 4-player game though). One other area that I am less confident is my curve and overall synergy. I would like to be the "win out of nowhere" guy to better simulate the sneakiness of the Dimir. This means I need to have many lines of play available to me, and many of these will be taken from among my opponents' own graves and libraries!
@PayOneLife Thanks for the suggestion of Archive Trap and Psychic Strike! I will be sure to get those when I have the chance! I'm also using your Dimir Infiltrator suggestion in place of another cut suggested above. He was in the deck but was cut for something else.
5 days ago
Ajani's Pridemate is a must in a lifegain deck, and Nyx-Fleece Ram not only synergizes with him, but also provides a nice wall in the early game. Also, Vampire Nighthawk is a fantastic card that pretty much replaces Kingpin's Pet.
As for cards you should just straight up remove (in my opinion), Undercity Informer and Basilica Guards have got to go. The Basillica Guards' value is incredibly low in terms of raw stats, and even worse considering their abilities. As for Undercity Informer, he's more of a Dimir mill card, and doesn't really make a huge impact in this deck that doesn't focus on milling out your opponents.
Hope this helps!
6 days ago
Hey there! Thanks for taking the time to stop by Lazav Plays With Your Mind (UPDATED 100% FOIL) and have a look! I'm doing my best to make it the top contender for best mill deck on the site! So here's to you and helping me make that happen! +1!
So I'm glad you asked for my help. I've got quite a heavy grip on the idea you've got going here and I'd love to help. This build consists of a combination of two of my favorite play-styles. Mill and Combo. and they both happen to be decks I've built in whole focus. There are a lot of overlapping themes between the two and it takes a lot of diligence to be able to find the fine lines and tune them each accordingly. But have no fear, I definitely see some places where adjustments can be made and the sought after consistency obtained. If you don't mind, I'm going to say my piece about each card type and what I see that could be changed. So without further ado:
Creatures: Of your creatures, there are three that standout as a little shaky to me for reasons that other cards mentioned later will as well.Undercity Informer - requires that you sacrifice a creature, something that you don't want to be doing often. Mirko Vosk, Mind Drinker does this guy's job a lot better and what you've done with this card space is trade consistency for utility. This space could better be served as Erebos, God of the Dead. I see you've included the other two Gods in your colors and Erebos shouldn't be any less eligible here. Being able to snuff life gain can be vital when you're strategy shifts from mill to kill either from necessity or for plan. Not to mention, Erebos adds an additional draw engine to your build. The fact that he can become a creature to block everything on the ground and survive is just gravy, and having this option available to you is a clear and concise way to make sure that no white deck gets away with Felidar Sovereign.Hedron Crab - targets a single player and is reliant on landfall. for the same reason, we don't play cards like Jace's Erasure unless we're 100% dedicated to drawing as many cards as possible. This guy is great when you can get him in multiples or abuse him with fetch lands and Crucible of Worlds, a card i would recommend if you were planning on adding more utility to your lands. But as he sits currently, the crab is a little underwhelming. Have you considered Jace's Mindseeker? Oboro, Palace in the Clouds does make this guy better, however. Nighthowler - is reliant upon a specific card type in the graveyard. this means he builds up much slower against decks that play very few creatures like Narset, Bruna, and Uril. The better option here would be to look for cards that synergize better. I see you're running Jace's Archivist and Forced Fruition. have you considered Fate Unraveler, Underworld Dreams, Liliana's Caress, and Megrim? These are just a handful of ways for punishing your opponents for drawing too many cards and they only get better when you force that upon them. To get an eye full of what this strategy can do, have a look at Nekusar Group Slugs. This deck typically cleans house by turn seven if I'm at the Wheel. (All puns intended...)
I'm noticing your clone package and it seems great though you might consider dropping Phyrexian Metamorph and Phantasmal Image to include some better options in spells like Cackling Counterpart which gives the added bonus of flashback for another trigger on that freshly copied Consuming Aberration.
The suggestions above apply to my suggestions for enchantments as well. Animate Dead is just too far left field to be considerable for this strategy and Rhystic Study doesn't draw you as many cards as you'd really like it to. Thiere are many paths on the golden road to card advantage, young grasshopper, the question is, which will you take?
Card advantage is the real value you get from upgrading Undercity Informer into Erebos, God of the Dead. Or Rhystic Study into Sensei's Divining Top. There's a lot of upgrading you can do that, of course, would cost a pretty penny. But that's okay. I'm going to give you a bit of a stream lined look at cards you can play to help further synergize your core strategy and gain the card advantage you're after from the cheapest of spells to the more powerful end game ones that will typically cost you a buck or two.
Sensei's Divining Topis pretty much an auto include for any deck that wants to dig seriously. To be honest, i don't know of a deck that doesn't.
Time Spiral is the cream of the crop wheel spell, and in some cases like Dimir Aqueduct can actually net you extra mana. Even more bang for your buck when you're punishing your opponents for drawing cards. Similarly, cards like Time Reversal and Windfall can be played next Whispering Madness.
Your instant package feels very lackluster as most problems your trying to account for can be done with better cards at sorcery speed. The only cards I would consider keeping are Cyclonic Rift, Psychic Spiral and maybe Crypt Incursion. I might also recommend Hinder and Spell Crumple to be at the core of your counter package as it's easy to wipe someone out after you tuck their general with Hinder and then come out of nowhere like a badass ninja with Tunnel Vision Junktroller serves as an additional combo piece here as well.
"Oh, I'm sorry, did you want your Commander? Here, you can have him back, but it's gonna cost ya. That's right... all the cards."
To round out your instants you should be thinking about effective and cheap ways to keep you winning. Muddle the Mixture counters or searches up something vital like Duskmantle Guildmage and Mindcrank . Other countermagic like Traumatic Visions doubles as mana fixing.
Of your sorcery speed spells, I am pleased. There's a few here that don't quite fit but the rest look great. Firstly, Mind Funeral only targets a single player and copying it is lackluster when you are already playing Mind Grind. If you really require a single target spell, I would much rather play Glimpse the Unthinkable here as it has been clutch to making Lazav some of the scariest creatures in the game. I can't tell you how many games I've rode on the back of Lazav as a copy of Avacyn, Angel of Hope. In my personal experience, Glimpse hits for more cards regularly than Mind Funeral. Mirko Vosk does a better mind funeral and you can copy his trigger with Strionic Resonator. You can copy Sword of Body and Mind with the resonator too.
If I were to make any personal inclusions to your sorcery spells i would say try to fit in at least Increasing Ambition, Diabolic Tutor and Demonic Tutor.Artifacts i would recommend dropping might be Sol Ring and Armillary Sphere for Altar of the Brood and Sensei's Divining Top. Lazav doesn't need Generic mana to cast, so Sol Ring is just kinda dead weight before turn five.Top is just better than Sphere.
Your land is the last bit I wanted to mention. Not because it's not important, but just the opposite. I see that you've got a lot of very good inclusions in cards like Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and Thespian's Stage. Have you considered Cabal Coffers? Crypt Ghast? Magus of the Coffers? These are easy ways to direct your opponents away from your main strategy and pay close attention o everything on board. These cards are powerhouses because when combined with each other, they make A LOT of mana. Synergy like this MUST be dealt with and it's a cheap expense when you consider that it only takes a card or two extra included to really go over the top and force your opponents' hands prematurely. The best part is when they can't handle this combination and you just run away with all the mana.This is perhaps my favorite part about playing black in the mill strategy as it affords you great mana coverage as well as a great deterrent.
I see that you are running a lot of basic lands. Here's a list of non basics for you to consider:
Each of these lands serves as utility in some way. Adding Expedition Map ensures that you get the ever important Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth when you need to turn all of your colorless lands into color. The more lands you play that can add both your colors, the easier time you'll have casting your spells and making sure you can back yourself up.
So that's pretty well what i got this time around. I'm sure I'll have another look at what I've written here and go "I forgot to mention this:" and you'll have another message. :P Let me know what your thoughts are and where you'd like to go with what information i've given. i'd be happy to dig a little deeper into a topic you aren't quite sure about!
1 month ago
How do you use Undercity Informer's ability if you can't sac a creature.
1 month ago
Altar's Reap for draw
+ + should create tons of zombies and mill them epically. Which means Wight of Precinct Six will be a beast. Equip a Dragon Throne of Tarkir into him and your walking army will trample over the enemy straight to victory.
1 month ago
Oh boy... Where's the mill?
What happens to your mill if I kill your Undead Alchemist?
Your average cmc is off the charts with nowhere near enough mana to pay for it. Which means aggro decks will obliterate you and control decks won't fear you.
Let's fix this crazy shit up!! First take out Waterveil Cavern and those Salt Marsh. You'll find Drowned Catacomb and Polluted Delta far superior. But we still need to get rid of all these high priced cards and focus on the milling.
Festering Goblin is pretty annoying and Gravecrawler is not only a great chump blocker, but an excellent sacrifice target for good mill cards like Undercity Informer. Phyrexian Crusader, because fuck them. And Tymaret, the Murder King is just amazing, should you move toward red.
As far as I can tell, you intend to produce an absurd number of zombies.. Which is why I recommend switching to four copies of Altar of the Brood. Between it, Undead Alchemist, and Undercity Informer. You should be milling quite nicely. Which means Undead Alchemist will be making more and more zombies, and that means Wight of Precinct Six will be huge. If you can't mill them to death there's always damage. An army of zombies powered up and given trample via a Dragon Throne of Tarkir equipped Wight of Precinct Six will crush some serious souls.
Just a little something to think about.
But all the cool strategies in the world won't matter if you can't protect your assets. Put in a few control spells. Far / Away Mana Leak Murder.. There's plenty out there. Keep your costs low and put some in here so you can live for a bit longer. A good Crypt Incursion should give you all the life you'll ever need.
Lastly, every deck needs draw power. Otherwise by turn five you've got almost no cards in hand, and that limits your strategic options. Thought Scour Visions of Beyond Howling Mine Font of Mythos there are plenty of those in blue as well. But for your deck in particular I'm thinking Altar's Reap.
I see great potential for this deck. Mill is sort of my thing so please check out my stuff and feel free to give me some advice
1 month ago
this is my belcher list for modern designed to end up with no land left in the deck, something similar is possibly viable for you. http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/belcher-28-11-13-1/
if you take out the Goblin Charbelcher, Fabricate, Blood Moon, possibly even the Simian Spirit Guide, that leaves you with 11 slots for 4xUndercity Informer, 1xPhantasmagorian, 1xUnburial Rites, 1xAngel of Glory's Rise, 1xAzami, Lady of Scrolls, 1xLaboratory Maniac and 2xBalustrade Spy. if you focus on Undercity Informer you can cast it one turn and activate the next, meaning you only have to get to 5 mana, instead of 8, also with all the mana dorks running around you don't have to have pulled all your lands out, you can use him multiple times.
some tweaking of the manabase would be necessary, but switching the two shocklands for the other two is probably all that is required. maybe the fourth Birds of Paradise over an Arbor Elf or something. Utopia Sprawl is you're friend here though, so maybe not.
|Power / Toughness||2/3|
|Avg. draft pick||8.03|
|Avg. cube pick||1.95|
|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
- Undead Alchemist + Undercity Informer
- Laboratory Maniac + Trench Gorger + Undercity Informer
- Mortus Strider + Undercity Informer
- Ogre Slumlord + Reassembling Skeleton + Undercity Informer
- Oona, Queen of the Fae + Undercity Informer
- Undercity Informer + Act of Treason
- Ogre Slumlord + Undercity Informer
- Duskmantle Guildmage + Undercity Informer
- Bloodghast + Lumberknot + Undercity Informer
- Gravedigger + Undercity Informer
- Sidisi, Brood Tyrant + Undercity Informer
- Altar of the Brood + Undead Alchemist + Undercity Informer
- Phyrexian Altar + Undercity Informer