How to make this deck more "sacrifice-y"

Commander Deck Help forum

Posted on Nov. 16, 2018, 3:25 p.m. by Infiniteomniscience

I know I can make this deck better through fine tuning, but i'm not really sure how to make this deck more "sacrifice-y". I'm pretty sure I have got the mana to do stuff, but what can I change to make the deck have more creatures to sacrifice?

MindAblaze says... #2

Thraximundar QIP

Commander / EDH* Infiniteomniscience


November 16, 2018 3:55 p.m.

SMASHER101 says... #3

Play cards that say "When x happens, make a token" rathar than cards that say "Make x tokens" Examples of what to play: Dragon Broodmother, Sek'Kuar, Deathkeeper, that dude that makes thrulls, and that spider that makes more when your opponents cast spells. Obviosly some of these are not in your colors but they show what I mean.

Also conduit of storms is bad and you should play more of the "Whenever a creature dies, each opponent loses 1 life and you gain 1 life."

And where is Nightscape Familiar and Altar of Dementia. Chandra's Ignition is a real game ender

November 16, 2018 5:06 p.m.

Thank you for the suggestion! I added Nesting Dragon, Skeletal Vampire, Nightscape Familiar, Grave Titan. Would these cards work? I didn't want to use Altar of Dementia as I will be mostly sacrificing tokens with 1 or 0 power, and didn't want to use Chandra's Ignition because it might kill my other important creatures, or not really do anything to opponents. If you describe to me the benefits of the latter card I will put it in the deck. Thank you!

November 16, 2018 8:11 p.m.

bushido_man96 says... #5

Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder and Krenko, Mob Boss are some good token generators. You could really do your mana curve a favor and probably go with early goblin drops to support the Krenko rout. Ghoulcaller Gisa is pretty solid, and for lots of fun, equip her with Thornbite Staff. That can make a lot of tokens you can then sacrifice for fun stuff. Kher Keep is a solid land to include. Even cards like Myr Battlesphere and Pentavus can provide you with sac outlets. Hangarback Walker is another solid option. Blue has options like Thopter Spy Network and Efficient Construction for generating tokens.

So, with your commander, what you care about is creatures getting sacrificed. Not dying, but sacrificed specifically. So, the best way to help yourself out is to not rely on your opponents to provide the sac fodder. For that, you need more sac outlets of your own. Cards like Carrion Feeder, Yahenni, Undying Partisan, Viscera Seer, Phyrexian Ghoul and Nantuko Husk are all free sac outlets that you let you start putting counters on your commander really quick. Red offers Goblin Bombardment, which could be switched out with Vicious Shadows.

Archfiend of Depravity would fit your theme well, too, along with the Eldrazi you have with the Annihiliator mechanic, but you don't need too many of them. Running three or four of them is probably sufficient.

You want to protect your commander, so add cards like Swiftfoot Boots, Lightning Greaves, and a budget option no one ever thinks about, Diplomatic Immunity.

Distended Mindbender could probably go. I fail to see how it fits what you want it to do with your Commander. Patron of the Moon doesn't look like it fits, and neither does Dreamscape Artist. I'd cut Sire of Stagnation as well. Blight Herder probably isn't great, either. Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur is a good card, and good for card draw, but if you're opponents aren't playing creatures, they can't sacrifice them, and it just might make you a big fat target. I'd ditch Lotus Bloom for something more like Worn Powerstone or even a Mind Stone.

I hope these suggestions help. Thraximundar looks like a fun commander to run. I hope these suggestions help you to focus the deck more, and make it run more smoothly. Let me know what you think.

November 16, 2018 9:23 p.m.

SMASHER101 says... #6

Infiniteomniscience I haven't played Skeletal Vampire myself but I havn't seen it do much work on the other side of the board. The other cards you are adding are good though. You sac Thraximundar to Altar of Dementia and mill someone out after killing someone else by attacking. People WILL want to kill Thraximundar and you can sac it in response and mill the removaler out, you can also say "if you try to kill Thrax, you will die" and suddenly people are much less interested in killing him. Chandras ignition really reads "Sacrifice target Thraximundar: You win." When your opponents are dead you don't care about tokens. Also if you play with people who are tempted by tempt cards, play Tempt with Vengeance. Also infect cards like Tainted Strike may be worth running.

November 17, 2018 11:30 a.m.

bushido_man96. Yes, Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder seems nice, but I'm usually going to have high power creatures, so he would be immediately killed. If anything, I would put a card that can just bring back Thrilling Encore, since it is the same mana cost, and that will be of more use when I will sacrificing tokens. Krenko, Mob Boss is a little bit too slow for me. Ghoulcaller Gisa is an almost definitely; I'll think about it. Most of the rest of the cards in that paragraph I have considered, and rest of the cards seem pointless except for the tokens generation, or just have one aspect about them that I would rather not have to satisfy(e.g. the mana that needs to be spent for Pentavus to create tokens or the artifact requirements.) For the next paragraph, I probably add one of two of those cards. I should have clarified a bit more that I need things the get sacrificed, instead of things that sacrifice. Archfiend of Depravity most certainly going to be added.Diplomatic Immunity as well. Distended Mindbender allows me some vision into an enemies' hand, while having a lower CMC with a sacrificed creature. Patron of the Moon and Dreamscape Artist are there for a bit of ramp. The deck's average CMC is 5.5, so I would prefer to have as many lands as possible onto the battlefield. Lotus Bloom is a free source of mana that gives me an extra boost when I need it. Sire of Stagnation, Blight Herder, and Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur is what I meant by "fine tuning". I would like to have at least some card draw, all while inhibiting opponents. Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur and Sire of Stagnation would be great if they had a "may" in between the "you draw". But that what Omniscience and the ramp is for, and if the card draw gets too out of hand, I can just sacrifice them. "...if you're opponents aren't playing creatures, they can't sacrifice them". Yes, good point, but that is why I have annihilator creatures. Thank you for the suggestion, and please give me feedback on my reasoning! Thank you once again!

November 17, 2018 12:02 p.m.

bushido_man96 says... #8

Ok, lets unpack this a little bit.

You mentioned the deck's average CMC at 5.5....that's probably too high. If it were me, I'd work on having more 1 and 2 drops to smooth out the curve and make sure I can get things up and running more quickly. A card like Burnished Hart would work better for you than Patron of the Moon. Let's look at Patron real quick: nice ability on it, for sure, if you can really abuse it. But 7 CMC for to get an ability to then pay 1 for two tapped lands is NOT ramp. Fixing, maybe, but not ramp. I feel the same about Dreamscape Artist. 2 CMC to cast, which is a good early play, but then a 3-costed activated ability to sac a land and go get two lands.....its like a really bad way of playing Harrow.

Good creatures to include: Baleful Strix: draws you a card, and has deathtouch. Edict creatures, like Fleshbag Marauder, Plaguecrafter, Merciless Executioner, Ravenous Chupacabra, Nekrataal, Bone Shredder and Shriekmaw; the Maw is especially synergistic here with his evoke ability. Just one of these creatures cast could end up netting 3 to 4 sacrifices across the table. Even a card like Mulldrifter fits your theme. A few other cards that might interest you: Tortured Existence and/or Phyrexian Reclamation. They can help you get some of these cards that trigger your Commander's ability back into play or into your hand to re-cast (like Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder).

Thrilling Encore is ok, but adding one card to reuse that one card seems like a waste of two card slots. Archaeomancer and Mnemonic Wall could do it for you, though. You could consider running Deadeye Navigator as a way of blinking some of these creatures I've listed with ETB effects.

Two items left I want to hash out with you:

Item 1: Distended Mindbender. This is just not a good card, and there are plenty of sorcery speed discard spells that black runs that would do a better job, not cost 5 CMC, and will force some discard. Hell, I think Thrull Surgeon would be better, and you could recur him with some of the options I've listed.

Item 2: Lotus Bloom. Not good, in my opinion, especially when compared to other options, like Worn Powerstone, Mind Stone, or Commander's Sphere. You cast it for free essentially, but then have to wait three turns to essentially net a Dark Ritual effect. So you wait three turns for a one-off effect, then it goes to the graveyard. Worn Powerstone is repeatable after it untaps, although it is colorless. With Commander's Sphere you get ramp and fixing, and you can choose to send it to the graveyard in exchange for a card, replacing itself. Mind Stone replaces itself, too. I'd like Lotus Bloom more if you had a way to recur it, like Goblin Welder, but that isn't what your deck does, so it doesn't make sense with better options available.

I hope that helps explain my reasoning a little bit. I like to try to manage my mana curve as much as possible, so I have things going on early to set up mid and late game. Your Commander is high CMC as it is, so you've really got to build to getting him out as soon as you can; by turn 4 would be great, but probably not going to make an appearance consistently until around turns 5 or 6. Let me know what your experience with this is, though. When deck building, its easy to get wowed by big dumb creatures, but too much of it makes the deck clunky and inconsistent. Better to get the consistency that makes the deck function early, so you can play your game later on, too.

November 17, 2018 6:11 p.m.

bushido_man96. I have removed Distended Mindbender, Patron of the Moon(Though I am reconsidering that as it synergizes well with Nesting Dragon, and gives me mana regardless, whether I have to wait one turn or not. I would like you opinion on this.), Dreamscape Artist, Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur, and Sire of Stagnation, as I recall. I have added Viscera Seer, Nirkana Revenant, Burnished Hart, Archfiend of Depravity, and Ghoulcaller Gisa, as I recall. Is this fine?

November 18, 2018 11:14 p.m.

SMASHER101. I feel Soulblast is better than Chandra's Ignition, its does what that card does, and is a focused targeted game-ended, and it is also an instant; I have it in my Maybeboard. I am still hesitant about Altar of Dementia as I do not think it will do anything permanent. It still mills, but thats pretty much it, and doesn't actually kill opponents; It probably won't be a a game-ender.

November 18, 2018 11:21 p.m.

SMASHER101 says... #11

Ignition says each opponent, Soulblast does not.

November 19, 2018 1:09 p.m.

Ignition and Soulblast are both very debilitating moves. However, Ignition does not guarantee target death as much as Soulblast does. Generally, players can recover from almost dying, but not from death. I can just focus the most dangerous player. Ignition seems to me to be a cleanup, while Soulblast is a finisher regardless. Of your other point about if Thraximundar dies then the opponents would pay the price, perhaps a Bearer of the Heavens or Mindslicer would work?

November 19, 2018 2:44 p.m.

MindAblaze says... #13

Chandra's Ignition is burn and a board wipe, but you get to keep one creature. Soulblast sacrifices all your stuff to hit one thing. One you die (or last ditch effort win), the other, everyone else dies and you swing with your fatty. I don’t see the competition between the two...

I wouldn’t count on getting Soulblast when you want it. Killing creatures with Chandra's Ignition is the main goal. The burn is a nice after thought.

November 19, 2018 6:27 p.m. Edited.

MindAblaze. Ok. Thank you. The response to your question about who do I expect to play against is that I do not know. It would be gratifying to go events regularly, but I do not have the chance. This is why I am building this deck. I might have a chance to go to an event.

November 19, 2018 9:40 p.m.

bushido_man96 says... #15

Infiniteomniscience, I think those changes will help out. In regards to Patron of the Moon, I see it helping out more if you are running more of a lands-matters theme, but you are not really doing that here. Sure, there will be times when the card is incidentally good, but I don't see that happening consistently. Like with Nesting Dragon. Great if you have the two of them out, but independent of each other, how much does each one help out the rest of the deck?

The additions look good, but Nirkana Revenant jumps out at me. You are running 10 swamps in your mana base. Has Nirkana Revenant been very helpful for you?

November 20, 2018 7:38 p.m.

bushido_man96. Not particularly. Perhaps Braid of Fire as a replacement for Nirkana Revenant? Could Arbiter of the Ideal work as a replacement for Patron of the Moon?

November 20, 2018 9:16 p.m.

bushido_man96 says... #17

Braid of Fire would probably be good ramp. I fail to see Arbiter of the Ideal as being good. Just run Commander's Sphere instead of trying to use his wonky ability. Lower CMC, more consistent ability to use, especially in a three-color deck. I'm quite surprised you're not running it already.

November 20, 2018 10:13 p.m.

bushido_man96. Ok, these changes will be made. Besides the high average CMC and lack of direct non-random removal and spell defense, what other flaws do you see in the deck, and how would I solve these problems? And should I try to solve these problems? I feel If I leak into other areas, I fear I’ll lose power in the main area, that being creatures and sacrifice. I would like your opinion on this.

November 21, 2018 12:14 a.m.

bushido_man96 says... #19

I don't know if you're familiar with The Command Zone podcast, but I watch it religiously on youtube, and when I deck build, I try to follow their deck-building format as much as possible. If you're not familiar with it, they advise the following: 10 card draw, 10 mana ramp, 5 single target removal, and 5 boardwipes. If I waver on anything, at times it tends to be the boardwipes. But, I generally try to follow that format as I deck build, and once I'm done, if I don't meet all those criteria, I try to start figuring out cuts to do so.

So, let's break it down:

Card draw: you have 4 to 5ish, if you count Commander's Sphere replacing itself. Preordain is a one-off. I'd usually rather have a more permanent source of card draw. Something like Greed or Arguel's Blood Fast  Flip can fill the void here. Jace Beleren is nice, too, as you can get political with him, and he doesn't really pose too much of a threat. There are others, to be sure, where you can perhaps sac creatures to draw a card, which would synergize nicely with cards like Grave Pact. Something to think about there.

Mana ramp: I think you're good there. You've got lots of rocks to help get your colors, and you're running a little heavier on lands than I usually do, but that's not a bad thing, either. I'd say good there. You've also got several ways of creating Spawn creature tokens that you can sac for mana, which is good for your theme overall. Check this box off.

Single-target removal: Eh, you're kind of ok here, with the effects you get from your Eldrazi and Grave Pact effects. That helps a ton. You might consider cards like Imprisoned in the Moon and Chaos Warp for dealing with special cases. Many times playing Imprisoned in the Moon on a commander can be better than removing it from the board. Chaos Warp smacks any troublesome permanent that has hit the board. Also, you're playing , so any counterspell can be considered a single-target removal.

Boardwipes: Again, your Grave Pact effects help out here, so you've covered a lot of your bases. You've got some of the best colors in the pie to help with wipes: Cyclonic Rift is the granddaddy of them all, and Vandalblast can be especially good in artifact-heavy metas. Black offers some of the best creature wipes out there, from Damnation to Toxic Deluge to Decree of Pain (which offers boardwipe AND card draw; two-for-one there), and one-sided wipes like Plague Wind and In Garruk's Wake, if you can stomach their high CMCs.

Like I said, these are just guidelines to use when building, and you don't need to follow this format exactly, but what I've found is that if you stick close to it, then you get an amazing amount of consistency out of playing your deck. With your's the only thing I would really want to address is the card draw. A Skullclamp might be worth running.

Hope that helps!

November 21, 2018 9:54 p.m.

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