|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Signature Spellbook: Jace (SS1)||Mythic Rare|
|2011 Core Set (M11)||Mythic Rare|
|2010 Core Set (M10)||Mythic Rare|
|Duel Decks: Jace vs. Chandra (DD2)||Mythic Rare|
|Promo Set (000)||Mythic Rare|
|Promo set for Gatherer (PSG)||Mythic Rare|
Combos Browse all
Planeswalker — Jace
+2: Each player draws a card.
-1: Target player draws a card.
-10: Target player puts the top twenty cards of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
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Jace Beleren Discussion
6 days ago
3 weeks ago
I don't know if you're familiar with The Command Zone podcast, but I watch it religiously on youtube, and when I deck build, I try to follow their deck-building format as much as possible. If you're not familiar with it, they advise the following: 10 card draw, 10 mana ramp, 5 single target removal, and 5 boardwipes. If I waver on anything, at times it tends to be the boardwipes. But, I generally try to follow that format as I deck build, and once I'm done, if I don't meet all those criteria, I try to start figuring out cuts to do so.
So, let's break it down:
Card draw: you have 4 to 5ish, if you count Commander's Sphere replacing itself. Preordain is a one-off. I'd usually rather have a more permanent source of card draw. Something like Greed or Arguel's Blood Fast Flip can fill the void here. Jace Beleren is nice, too, as you can get political with him, and he doesn't really pose too much of a threat. There are others, to be sure, where you can perhaps sac creatures to draw a card, which would synergize nicely with cards like Grave Pact. Something to think about there.
Mana ramp: I think you're good there. You've got lots of rocks to help get your colors, and you're running a little heavier on lands than I usually do, but that's not a bad thing, either. I'd say good there. You've also got several ways of creating Spawn creature tokens that you can sac for mana, which is good for your theme overall. Check this box off.
Single-target removal: Eh, you're kind of ok here, with the effects you get from your Eldrazi and Grave Pact effects. That helps a ton. You might consider cards like Imprisoned in the Moon and Chaos Warp for dealing with special cases. Many times playing Imprisoned in the Moon on a commander can be better than removing it from the board. Chaos Warp smacks any troublesome permanent that has hit the board. Also, you're playing , so any counterspell can be considered a single-target removal.
Boardwipes: Again, your Grave Pact effects help out here, so you've covered a lot of your bases. You've got some of the best colors in the pie to help with wipes: Cyclonic Rift is the granddaddy of them all, and Vandalblast can be especially good in artifact-heavy metas. Black offers some of the best creature wipes out there, from Damnation to Toxic Deluge to Decree of Pain (which offers boardwipe AND card draw; two-for-one there), and one-sided wipes like Plague Wind and In Garruk's Wake, if you can stomach their high CMCs.
Like I said, these are just guidelines to use when building, and you don't need to follow this format exactly, but what I've found is that if you stick close to it, then you get an amazing amount of consistency out of playing your deck. With your's the only thing I would really want to address is the card draw. A Skullclamp might be worth running.
Hope that helps!
1 month ago
1 month ago
Now Barrage would probably be better if it was, say, 2 damage. But why I say Tooth/Claw takes it is trading up. You can eat a Sun Titan with 2 carnivores. You're getting... let's say, 2 or 3 carnivores every turn. So you keep those up on the defense, they just sit there, a giant rattlesnake. Who wants to attack into 3 3/1s that you are 100% certain the defending player is willing to sacrifice? No one in their right mind.
If you want card advantage, you have two big plays.
1) Dark-Dweller Oracle. Just. Just Dark-Dweller Oracle.
2) convince a buddy to play group hug. Yeah, we're into mind games now. Jace Beleren, Edric, Spymaster of Trest, Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis, Humble Defector, and that's just scratching the surface. I have played a lot of group hug, but I have never played a game where everyone on board wasn't drawing 2 or more cards every turn.
1 month ago
I forgot to mention earlier that a political card can also be cards that give a backhanded gift (ie Nin, the Pain Artist). Also, not listing every curse in Magic's history.
2 months ago
Very well. Here goes;
First and foremost, mana is very important. Your calculation is spot on. However, the & need a little bit of tuning. The base could go down slightly, while elevating your sources due to necessity. So, for example - Hinterland Harbor could become Blooming Marsh. Also, for your off color fetchlands (I know that they serve their purpose), if possible, try to make trades for Polluted Delta. It would seriously make all the difference. On another note; man lands are extremely useful in midrange/control shells. I know that Creeping Tar Pit is slightly expensive, but Lumbering Falls is a decent replacement, along with Treetop Village. The choice is yours regarding those two.
Now, as for actual meat & bones, I would start with the creature selection. I know that Snapcaster Mage is expensive, but Jace, Vryn's Prodigy Flip is a great substitute. the only drawbackis that Jace does not have Flash, however, Jace has reoccurring card selection and may or may not grant better draws.
Also, Scavenging Ooze is a very nice inclusion and gets larger with time, while helping out against weaker matchups, i.e. burn, dredge.
So for creature changes, in my humble opinion - I would do something like this:
4x Grim Flayer
Now, onto non-creature spells. Personally, removing Seasons Past, Disdainful Stroke, Disallow, and other clunkier spells would intensify this decks pressure aspect. I would also work on finding a way to trade or save up for some allotment of Assassin's Trophy. The card does what Abrupt Decay cannot when necessary. Allow me to make a suggestion;
-2x Spell Pierce
-1x Seasons Past
-3x Serum Visions
+1x Cast Down Hits Tron creatures and big bodies that Push cannot.
these two Jaces just do not apply enough pressure/concern for their mana investment.
for any of these as you see fit
+(x) Ob Nixilis Reignited
+(x) Jace Beleren
I hope that this assists you in your journey to build . feel free to pick my brain and pardon me for the late reply friend.
2 months ago
There are a few pieces you might be missing here.
First off, the one oath that you're missing: Oath of Jace
And finally, the planeswalkers you may have missed. Sorin, Lord of Innistrad creates tokens with the + and the ultimate is devastating. For the creatures that you have, Ajani, Mentor of Heroes is insane. Ajani, Adversary of Tyrants does the same thing as Mentor of Heroes, but eventually gives you another kind of token. Aminatou, the Fateshifter and Deepglow Skate. Garruk Wildspeaker is some lovely ramp. Jace Beleren is card draw and can gain you some early-game allies. Jace, Architect of Thought is a little protection for the walkers. Jace, Unraveler of Secrets + is an Opt. Kaya, Ghost Assassin is a nice swiss army knife. Teferi, Hero of Dominaria is just the best. Venser, the Sojourner is insane with Deepglow Skate, or if you get Djeru, With Eyes Open it's just the best thing.
3 months ago
I can agree that there isn't enough instant speed blink to necessarily warrant Venser as a blinkable target, but his main function of the deck was more for spells on initial cast, and dealing with permanent threats that get through while on the board with Aminatou and Closet, along with other cards to bounce him to hand to have him at the ready. Nonetheless, he isn't a prime target for recursion and being that Sun Titan can't get him out of the grave, he's not AS useful as I'd like him to be (even if I try to include him in all my blue decks). I will make this cut.
Elixir of Immortality is to prevent myself from decking out, as I continuously pump cards into my graveyard. It also is a back up plan to get back things I couldn't afford to lose. I feel the bottle can stay for now, unless testing proves it to be unnecessary. This will be taken into consideration for other options in the future.
I guess I should have actually explained Solar Flare as I saw it in the past. Solar flare is the use of cycling cards from the deck to the grave while putting the needed value in your hand, and recurring the discarded pieces back for later use, mainly through Unburial Rites and Sun Titan. That's how I saw it at least from the build someone I used to know had. That being said, Liliana Vess can possibly go, as I mainly included her to set up miracles on the fly, for which I have much better options. Liliana of the Veil is too useful to the deck as it causes hand disruption while filling my graveyard with recurring threats later on. Her ultimate is devastating and her use, if out early enough, for her minus ability is very helpful. Jace, Memory Adept was an alternate win condition in the standard version of Solar flare, but in EDH he won't be doing too much in this build for his cmc. I can make that cut. Jace Beleren however, is beneficial in both being a political tool with his +2, and can be brought back by Sun Titan at a later point if needed again. I can ditch Karmic Guide and Debtors' Knell, but I feel Crucible is just too powerful in a deck that throws away cards. It also fights off land destruction, an archetype I'm not extremely fond of. For those reasons I wish to keep Crucible in the deck.
Suture Priest helps fight back against token strategies by draining their life. The board wipes help stop myself from losing too much. It's also a legal target for Sun Titan. However, like with Elixir, I will consider it if testing proves it to be not as useful as planned.
I appreciate all the help and suggestions. I am happy to see reasoning and kindness towards suggestions for deck changes and will definitely be finding room for Eerie Interlude! I am also open to suggestions for cards to add.