|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Guilds of Ravnica (GRN)||Rare|
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Undergrowth — Search your library for a black card with converted mana cost less than or equal to the number of creature cards in your graveyard, reveal it, put it into your hand, then shuffle your library.
Mausoleum Secrets Discussion
1 week ago
2 weeks ago
Wow, thanks realsoupersand, appreciate all the work you put into this review and comment. I have lot's to work on here.
I spent about an hour making a reply earlier today, but when I clicked preview forced me to login and it was gone forever. So I decided to make some updates to the deck before responding again, here it is.
I understand and appreciate your comments about Kaalia of the Vast and cEDH, of course, your correct the play analytics certainly support the position. The meta is fairly narrow on cEDH, however, like most formats (eg: Modern), there are non-meta decks that can be competitive in the format, but perhaps not with a high degree of consistency. I feel that the ability to have T1-T4 win-cons can make it competitive in the cEDH format, and with your help if we can get avg turn win under 4 or improve T1/T2 win %, it certainly can play although being mardu, it doesn't have access to the core strengths of the Tier1 decks.
I reduced my lands count a few. I read an article and ran their statistics through a bunch of models I created based on the raw data. Their conclusion, and my analysis verified, there is a co-relation between playing or missing a T3 land drop and your winning % in commander. At my previous lands, I still miss the T3 land about 20% of the time. I'll see how the reduction in lands impacts those statistics. I removed Rugged Prairie , but the other 2 filter lands, provide additional conversion avenues for a Turn 1 win, so although not the best lands, the higher T1 win % benefits from their inclusion.
I also hate any land that ETB tapped like Hall of the Bandit Lord . The way I was thinking about it was, Dragon Tempest is CMC2 (but active that turn if I have mana to play something), if I play Hall of the Bandit Lord tapped on T2, it is only CMC1 because I still have my T1 land available (although it doesn't do anything that turn). Haste is important for utility, I didn't include it for a long time, then added it back to see if it brought my avg win turn down, will do some testing with it in and out.
Yawgmoth's Will mostly has been beneficial. Although its CMC3 (terrible), assuming I have a Fetch land in the graveyard, and don't have a land drop in hand, it can play the fetch, so in some cases it's a modular ramp. Also, it can cast a Karmic Guide (we'll get to her) to start the Infinite Combo, also, it can cast a Reanimate or Animate Dead to do the same, or be a Demonic Tutor /modular tutor/removal, etc. Also, with the inclusion of Worldgorger Dragon Infinte Mana, going to allow me to play my entire graveyard in a single turn. It helps with improving the T3 and T4 land drops % and provides as good a ramp as mardu is going to get.
Mox Diamond unfortunately I don't have one, I have several decks including this one that need it, but it's not budget friendly either, so going to be a future add whenever I can get my hands on some. I'll see what I can do with artifacts to get to a reasonable consistency on Mox Opal going to take a while to make all the updates and buy some cards. Arcane Signet still shows as Illegal in commander, I assume the Brawl decks will be released soon or else tapped out will update their system. It's the best CMC2 rock, it will be in there whenever legal.
Diabolic Intent has only screwed me once so far, outside of Grand Abolisher there isn't anyone (including Kaalia of the Vast ) that I won't sacrifice to pull my combo piece and go for the win. It usually finds the last piece. Mausoleum Secrets works nicely with Buried Alive and Entomb to pull the Reanimate card. They are not the best, they were includes for testing purposes, I just find I need more tutoring to be consistent so having CMC1 and CMC2 tutors with conditions is still useful, I wish there was better options for mardu. I'll keep evaluating them, if they are unplayable when drawn in too high a % of circumstances they do not add value to the deck.
To replace the Swiftfoot Boots I added Idyllic Tutor , I know you didn't suggest, but with Worldgorger Dragon in, any way to pull Dragon Tempest for haste or Infinite damage or Animate Dead feels right? Steelshaper's Gift with just Lightning Greaves does feel weird. I'm wondering on the Swiftfoot Boots though, the Equip 0 is key certainly on Lightning Greaves , but usually just throw it on Kaalia of the Vast maybe a Grand Abolisher so Steelshaper's Gift + Lightning Greaves is similar CMC to Swiftfoot Boots and equip () but of course not playable on T1 (boo). I'll try with boots out and keep the tutors in, see how consistently I get to haste when I need it to drop a Razaketh, the Foulblooded , would never want to be waiting for haste when I have a win-con in hand.
As you mentioned Sensei's Divining Top works well with Dark Confidant , but mostly I use it to enable same turn Vampiric Tutor / Imperial Seal or to ensure I get the lands I need or try and find an ADD to resolve if Kaalia of the Vast is available and don't really need the mana. Also, if I have nothing else, it's a good random draw chance to stop a win-con or pull a tutor (and shuffle it away! happens so often).
I'm thinking on Tymna the Weaver seems not bad, I don't play to her strengths but still viable as mardu can't draw properly.
About 40% of my wins are my primary win-con of Buried Alive + Reanimate , Karmic Guide is the enabler. Even when I draw her to hand, CMC5 is still playable, or cheat-able with Kaalia of the Vast . She did combo with Reveillark but that wasn't working, Reveillark was too high CMC. She re-pops a Razaketh, the Foulblooded then he sac's her, outside of the primary win-con, its never a dead draw usually. I put Dance of the Dead in, but now, I'm thinking Necromancy is better, because it also works with Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker as well. Might swap the Dance of the Dead to Necromancy if I have one, I'll check tomorrow.
Dismember I like, play it in Modern even, Fire Covenant makes sense, but feel I would rather just Tutor Toxic Deluge which can remove indestructible and not have the duplication. Usually, I just try and win instead of disrupting, just let the Counterspell players stop the others, that opens a windows sometimes for me to try going for combo. I hate how Red Elemental Blast and Pyroblast are potential dead draws, but realistically always of value. Similar to a more generic Silence (wish it had Split Second), probably need them, need to review for more cuts. Path to Exile is a CMC1 exile, so it's good for decks that rely on commander (understanding they often don't care if they are removed because that is too late), I also use it as a modular ramp card, CMC1 to pull a land into play. I haven't found it hurts me most of the time, it's usually stopping a go for the win (like a Laboratory Maniac or something), usually wouldn't play it to enable a win.
Thoughtseize and the like, one of my favorite cards BTW, I found just hurts me and 1 player. Gives a wide opening to the other 2 players to go for the win, and now I'm short on card advantage, draw poorly, and disabled a player potentially that could have stopped the win. If it's pre-emptive (like Silence ) before going for the win, do I really want to increase my Win-Con by CMC1 or wait that extra turn to have the mana, or just go for it now, and maybe win? Tough to tell. Again too, wherever I can would rather go for my win than stop others win.
I'll have to go over creatures responses tomorrow as I'm out of time tonight, my earlier message addressed everything plus a bunch of cards I'm considering putting in and your opinion on those. For another night!
Thanks again for the fantastic input, I'm really working on making the changes. I ordered a bunch more cards on Card Kingdom today, so in 7 days free shipping, should see some more changes coming down the pipe. Also going to continue reviewing your recommendations and deciding on cuts tomorrow and over the upcoming weekend.
2 weeks ago
Thanks for the suggestions! I like all of them except for I'm a little wary on putting The Great Henge in here. I see where you're going with it but I'm just wary because I've been burned trying to go outside of the straight line win con before. I will certainly test it with an open mind but just the thought of it makes me kinda wary.
As for putting a big pay off, I really like that idea. Colors aren't too much of a problem in here considering most of the time they'll be whipped back so I think I'm going to go with Drakuseth, Maw of Flames as a 1 of.
Not sure how much I like dropping to 1-of Doom Whisperer . I think if I'm going to go down to 1 I might as well cut him completely because he's one of those creatures that you either really want or really don't, especially at that 5 drop slot.
As for Molderhulk and Underrealm Lich I certainly will playtest with them and will likely end up including them. Not sure how much I wanna drop the Mausoleum Secrets because they've come in real handy but I'll find somewhere to put them, even if I do end up having to cut the Mausoleum Secrets .
2 weeks ago
First I'd like to say I enjoy your take on a classic build. I think graveyard interactions are an interesting way to play the game, and can be very powerful in the right situations/meta. With that being said, I have few suggestions:
As it pertains to the deck, I would like to suggest two cards that might power up this strategy: Underrealm Lich and Molderhulk . I think that if you're looking to reliably fill your graveyard, Underrealm Lich is a perfect way to do that. Every upkeep it stays in play, it can reduce the cost of The Cauldron of Eternity by 0-4 mana, trigger Syr Konrad, the Grim 0-2 times, as well as fill your graveyard with threats you would like to later recur. It is hard to deal with due to the indestructible ability, and is a solid creature for the mana cost. Molderhulk also plays nicely into the self-mill style you are achieving here. It will be a 2 mana 6/6 in this build most games, and allows you to recur Fabled Passage to ensure hitting land drops as well as thinning your deck. To include these, I would suggest cutting Mausoleum Secrets and Eye Collector . I think you will have enough removal in the deck that you won't need to specifically tutor them, and Underrealm Lich will be a way to mill yourself both more efficiently and reliably than having to attack with a 1/1 flier.
If including the 2 previously mentioned cards, I would suggest also running The Great Henge . On its face you may not see its importance to this style of deck, but with Underrealm Lich , Syr Konrad, the Grim , Molderhulk , and Doom Whisperer all being high power, the cost reduction will be easy to achieve. The life gain from its tap ability is going to be key to counteract Underrealm Lich , Doom Whisperer , and The Cauldron of Eternity 's need to pay life, as you've already noticed with Gorging Vulture . Additionally, the card draw attached to creatures entering the battlefield will be huge for allowing you to keep up tempo with your opponent. To include this, I would suggest going down a copy of The Cauldron of Eternity as you would hate to have one stuck in your hand all game.
To make the most out of The Cauldron of Eternity , I would suggest adding a copy or two of a really impactful threat upon reanimation. Drakuseth, Maw of Flames and Agent of Treachery are the two commonly used in reanimation style builds, however if wanting to stick to the colors I would suggest Vilis, Broker of Blood . He is a huge threat with card draw and removal all on the same card, and will trigger even if paying life with other methods in this deck. I would suggest going down a copy of Doom Whisperer .
Finally, I have a suggestion pertaining to your deck description formatting. I would like to see you take advantage of the "Spoiler Block" and "Accordion Block" functions to slim down your description. This will make it easier for readers to view the deck description in full, then proceed to read more on your card inclusions if interested. An example of something I might do is shown below:
Card Inclusions / Choices Show
Overall, I like the design of the deck, and I hope these suggestions help you with the build! Let me know if you have any more questions about why I recommended the cards that I did.
1 month ago
WUBRG87 Last thing I'd want is to sculpt your deck into something that doesn't feel like yours(!) - I love EDH's lack of homogeneity. Happy to give you my 2 cents with the direction I'd be thinking of from here though and with not too bad of a budget...
More of a sacrifice direction that isn't 'aristocrats'; add another altar ( Phyrexian Altar or Altar of Dementia ), maybe switch Dark Ritual for Culling the Weak - then you would have a good level of sac outlets to have some heavy hitters like Gray Merchant of Asphodel and Kokusho, the Evening Star replace Noble/Zula/Buccaneer. It's a bit contradictory adding sac outlets and removing aristocrats I know but I think the aristocrats make better use of volume (like tokens) and our boy Chainer is better off packing more value into a big recur-able punch.
If it were me, I'd be thinking:
- Falkenrath Noble
- Zulaport Cutthroat
- Glint-Horn Buccaneer
- Charmbreaker Devils
- Corpse Augur (switch for Disciple as another sac outlet)
- Scheming Symmetry (switch for Intent)
- Dark Ritual (switch for CtW)
- Burning Vengeance (Warstorm Surge and Flayer do it better, or drop Warstorm if you wanted to lower the overall CMC)
- 1 of Vampiric Rites , Cathartic Reunion or Underworld Connections (I think there's enough card selection that all 3 of these aren't necessary. Depends if you like the speed or reusability as to which)
- OK I'm stuck on the last one just now!! Maybe Stitcher's Supplier , but then I'd maybe want the Altar of Dementia instead... I'd probably end up saying Dreadbore because sorcery speed. That way Mausoleum Secrets -ing for your Bedevil is essentially your second instant speed spot removal for Planeswalkers
Also, to your point about the 'Compet-o-meter', I'd say the impact will be from the system rating Zula/Noble highly because of combo involvement in decks that revolve around them and the Buccaneer showing up in Nekusar, the Mindrazer lists, which tend to be pretty savage!, rather than necessarily your changes being significantly worse one-for-one. I actually really like Embodiment of Agonies in this, it's cheap and can be a massive beatstick pretty easily.
1 month ago
What're your thoughts on Mausoleum Secrets possibly seeing play in this list? The idea being that it could, in theory, fetch Oblivion Crown , Squandered Resources , or something else of value? (Assassin's Trophy for example...)
As an added oddball question, with the unbanning of Painter's Servant , has there been any discussion between you, Razillox, or Kiebitzen about P.S.'s possible inclusion? The rationale behind this thought is that with it on the field (Naming Black), Autumn's Veil and Veil of Summer become more powerful, and can be found via Mausoleum Secrets. Additionally, for those that want to be cheeky monkeys, that also makes Lifeforce a possible consideration for budget lists.
I'll also drop you a line via discord in case you're not able to check the primer.
1 month ago
Pretty good base for good dimir cards pre-rotation !
I would suggest playing with Lazav as he's crazy good recursion value. I've tested it in multiplayer and it's really nice.
1 month ago
Yes, I saw Glint-Horn Buccaneer on your list and knew I had to have one lol.
I've decided to take those three cards out and I subbed in:
Mausoleum Secrets occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.01%