Activated Sleeper
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Legality

Format Legality
1v1 Commander Legal
Archenemy Legal
Canadian Highlander Legal
Casual Legal
Commander / EDH Legal
Commander: Rule 0 Legal
Custom Legal
Duel Commander Legal
Highlander Legal
Legacy Legal
Leviathan Legal
Limited Legal
Oathbreaker Legal
Planechase Legal
Quest Magic Legal
Tiny Leaders Legal
Vanguard Legal
Vintage Legal

Activated Sleeper

Creature — Phyrexian Shapeshifter

Flash

You may have Activated Sleeper enter the battlefield as a copy of any creature card in a graveyard that was put there from the battlefield this turn, except it's a Phyrexian in addition to its other types.

Gidgetimer on EDH Merens Reanimator

2 days ago

The most compact Hulk line is going to be Mikaeus, the Unhallowed and Walking Ballista which requires you to add only Protean Hulk and Walking Ballista both of which are decent outside of the combo. The combo does require a sacrifice outlet, and I was having trouble thinking of how to grab one since the combo already uses all 6 CMC of the tutor and I am most familiar with the combo in Abzan where you get Karmic Guide. Luckily DreadKhan supplied the missing piece, if you add in Activated Sleeper you can tutor the Sleeper and Viscera Seer to provide the sacrifice outlet.

Combo I am describing in case you are not familiar with Mike and Ballista. Mikaeus, the Unhallowed gives non-human creatures +1/+1 and undying, so the Ballista enters as a 1/1 and doesn't die. Sacrifice Walking Ballista and it comes back with a +1/+1 counter. Remove the counter from Ballista and deal 1 damage to an opponent. Repeat loop of sacrificing Ballista and removing counter until all opponents are dead.

You are also already running Yawgmoth, Thran Physician, so you can add in a few low cost undying creatures and get that combo with low opportunity cost. Young Wolf and Butcher Ghoul are the easiest to cast ones since they only have a single colored pip. Treacherous Pit-Dweller, Geralf's Messenger, and Strangleroot Geist are perfectly defensible options too, though the pit dweller is more all-in on having a way to sacrifice for value before the trigger to give an opponent control resolves and as such I think isn't a great fit here.

In general you can also up the power level of the deck by adding tutors. The "good" ones you are not running are Worldly Tutor, Grim Tutor, and Vampiric Tutor.

DreadKhan on EDH Merens Reanimator

2 days ago

The OG Fetches are very good cards in almost any deck, and as I mentioned in my first post, I don't know if it would be easy to improve this deck without either adding Fetchlands or increasing the power level.

The easiest way to increase the power level a deck like yours is to add a combo, but your present power level is high enough that you'd need to add a fairly efficient combo, something like Protean Hulk to find a complete combo (ideally via a single pile), this would leave you at a strong 8, not quite cEDH but it's fairly hard to make Meren a cEDH deck at this point, her ability is too slow/grindy for cEDH games. cEDH Meren lists are likely to make use of something like Razaketh, or possibly a Phyrexian Devourer combo. Razaketh uses something like Life / Death to turn your lands into creatures so you can keep tutoring until you find both your combo of choice as well as the mana to play it. Razaketh decks love stuff like Lion's Eye Diamond, which is extremely pricey and does very little other than combo off. You'd also want Dark Ritual type cards, and possibly things like Lotus Petal and Elvish Spirit Guide. The main problem with Razaketh is getting him out early, but something like Final Parting can get you there by putting Razaketh in the bin and a Reanimate into hand. Similarly, you can reanimate a Protean Hulk (which you then sacrifice) to tutor up a game ending combo, the advantage of Protean Hulk is that it's easier to cast when you're desperate, but the upside of Razaketh is that you can tutor up any cards you want, Razaketh just gives you a new hand in exchange for a few creatures. I think Protean Hulk is the best of the lot, but Phyrexian Devourer isn't a bad option, you use Triskelion with it by getting both into your graveyard, with a Necrotic Ooze on the battlefield, you then just exile cards to put counters on your Devourer, and the only real drawbacks are your limit on individual MV (Devourer dies if it gets too big), and you'll need enough total MV to actually kill everyone (this isn't too hard if you go off fairly early, but it can suck if you take all game to get into position and can't kill everyone because you don't have enough cards left. Another upside to Devourer is that Triskelion also wins the game with Mikaeus (you ping Triskelion with the last counter so it dies (without any counters left) and has Undying). Oh, with Protean Hulk the 'smallest' pile I am familiar with involves Disciple of the Vault, Melira, Sylvok Outcast, Lesser Masticore, and Carrion Feeder/Viscera Seer, with that pile you don't even need Activated Sleeper to nab a second Protean Hulk (with only 3 MV after you account for the Sleeper). The main drawback of this pile is that the cards are individually bad IMHO (I would run Feeder and Seer, but none of the others fit in a generic Meren deck), and the lack of redundancy (Melira and Masticore aren't used in a lot of other combos in Meren decks afaik) makes it less stable than some lists. The final one I feel is worth mention is Demon of Dark Schemes, Mitotic Slime, and Phyrexian Altar nets you infinite mana, ETBs, death triggers, Energy, and all the creatures in each graveyard can be reanimated by you. The nice thing about the Demon is that it's only 6 mana (so technically Hulk can find him), and it can do a lot of work in certain situations since it can wipe small creatures as well as reanimate cards from anyone's graveyard. It's one of the better generic reanimation effects that can go infinite, and it's sheer range of utility makes it worth looking at even if you didn't use Mitotic Slime. The Slime btw is very good in most Meren decks since it offers a plethora of tokens for only 5 mana, while Phyrexian Altar (or Pitiless Plunderer) are both amazing cards in a deck like this.

If you feel like adding a combo, I wouldn't have more than ~2 trees/paths to work with, unless the cards are shared between multiple lists.

I can go into more detail if it would be helpful, I have a Meren deck on here you could take a look at, it's a lot more combo oriented than your list, but it's combos aren't optimal, they're all made with stuff I already had.

CrystalQuarry on Liesa, Forgotten Archangel (Budget EDH, Combo)

1 year ago

Hey, thank you so much for commenting and taking the time to read through the deck description!

While this is intended to be a budget deck, I personally just really like foils and original printings of cards. The versions of each card listed in the deck here are what I actually have for it in paper.

Activated Sleeper is a card I have been looking at and considering adding to the deck, but it seems highly conditional given that it can only copy a creature that left the battlefield the same turn. I agree it can go infinite with Karmic Guide and Karmic Guide even helps set it up given that Echo would often force you to sacrifice it on your upkeep anyway. That said, I'm a bit worried about how effective the card is when you DON'T have access to Karmic Guide. I guess depending on the pod it could still be quite good at stealing an opponent's creature. I will have to test it a bit and see how it performs in practice.

Kaya's Ghostform is a card I've considered as well but what concerns me with it is the Sorcery speed nature of it and that it is a bit more telegraphed what the intention is. That said, the ability to bring back the creature even if it gets targeted with something like Swords to Plowshares is very cool! In the pods I've played this deck and where people have gotten to learn more or less how it works, they tend to try and remove Liesa, Forgotten Archangel very quickly, so I've found cards like Undying Evil to be essential for keeping Liesa in play. I've found the instant speed to be extremely relevant in many situations as well. That said, Legion's Landing  Flip is a particularly weak card in the deck and I could definitely see cutting that for testing Kaya's Ghostform.

Thran Vigil is a cool new card that I must have missed in the BRO spoilers. However, this deck isn't really all in on persist type effects. Twilight Shepherd is pretty much the only card it would strongly interact with. I would say it's pretty rare for this deck to win through combat and as such the value of the +1/+1 counters in it (even an arbitrarily large number of them) is a bit questionable. If the deck has assembled one of the infinite death engines, then it should be winning outright without the need to even go to combat. I like the interaction with Tortured Existence but it's such a shame that it only works on your turn! If you could suddenly pump up Liesa on an opponent's turn after they've already declared attackers at you, then that would make it a lot better.

Profane Tutor is a great budget tutor, but having to wait two entire turns is a major detriment to how useful of a card it is, especially as a mid to late game draw. The decks I've seen take the biggest advantage of Profane Tutor are the ones that somehow exile and cast a copy from exile or copy it from graveyard and cast the copy immediately, rather than having to wait the two turns. Mid to late game I would much rather pay a little extra mana to guarantee getting a card immediately rather than having to wait. If you get Profane Tutor in the early game, then yes it's definitely better than Diabolic Tutor or Mastermind's Acquisition for the lower mana cost. If I had a means of cheating on the suspend part of the card in Orzhov then it would warrant an inclusion over one of the other tutors in my opinion.

Vile Entomber is another card I considered and even in an earlier iteration of the deck I ran for a while. The issue I often found with it was that it only grabbed ONE card to put to the graveyard. Burning-Rune Demon and Final Parting are in the deck because they find TWO cards. With Vile Entomber I could find Karmic Guide but not another card to combo with it. With Burning-Rune Demon I can find Karmic Guide and another card to combo with it and often times whichever piece the opponent gives me is irrelevant. Blinking or reanimating Burning-Rune Demon is also significantly more value and helps assemble combos much faster than Vile Entomber can.

Bolas's Citadel is extremely powerful, but it is at least right now (12/17/2022) more than $5 which is where the line in the sand has been drawn for whether or not a card can be added to the deck. That said, even if it was a bit cheaper Bolas's Citadel would require leaning much harder into a life gain theme. While life gain is another very popular and powerful strategy, I feel it is a bit orthogonal to the direction of this deck which is more heavily focused on creature ETB/LTB triggers and the graveyard.

I've been working on a Liesa, Shroud of Dusk deck which leans very heavily into life gain/life loss shenanigans and in that deck I do run stuff like Children of Korlis. That's not to say that Children of Korlis isn't a good card in Liesa, Forgotten Archangel, but I feel like you have to already be on the life gain game plan to get the most out of it.

Plumb the Forbidden is a great card, but you need sufficiently many throw away bodies and a sufficiently high life total to manage it. Without sufficient life gain or creature token generators it runs the risk of being a dead draw. Body Count can also be a completely dead draw at times, but it has a much higher ceiling in this deck specifically than Plumb the Forbidden does. Body Count can literally draw the entire deck for 1 black mana with a death engine assembled. Plumb the Forbidden could never draw more than the greatest number of creatures in play at one moment and I must have the life available to pay for it plus 2 mana. If the deck was more of an aristocrats style build spewing creature tokens left and right and running things like Soul Warden then Plumb the Forbidden would be a much more natural inclusion I feel.

Fanatical Devotion is a really cool sacrifice outlet that can do relevant things like protect Liesa which is very important. That said, thanks to BRO another arguably much better sacrifice outlet just became budget (<$5). And that's Ashnod's Altar. I will be adding this to the deck shortly as a third sacrifice outlet.

Thanks again for reading the long description and commenting!

multimedia on Liesa, Forgotten Archangel (Budget EDH, Combo)

1 year ago

Hey, this is one of the better budget Commander decks I've seen and great description. Really good job with the card choices keeping within the price restriction. If you're on card price restriction, why all foils and alternative card arts?

Activated Sleeper and Kaya's Ghostform are good budget cards when you want your creatures to die. Sleeper is another creature who infinite die combos with Karmic Guide and Ghostform infinite die combos with Sun Titan.

Thran Vigil is the new budget infinite persist enabler, it infinite combos with Twilight Shepherd or another persist creature such as Lesser Masticore. If a creature dies on your turn and you control Liesa then Vigil will trigger to put a counter on a creature for each creature who died. Tortured Existence interacts with Vigil if you activate it on your turn equal to the amount of black mana you have available as long as you have a creature in your graveyard and a creature in your hand to repeatedly swap them. Put the counters from Vigil on Liesa making her huge to threaten lethal Commander damage.

Profane Tutor is the budget lesser Demonic, it's still powerful for it's price. Because you have lots of reanimation and recursion than Vile Entomber can be great support especially to get and bin Leonin Relic-Warder. Entomber getting any card of your choice is nice with Sun Titan.

Bolas's Citadel, is less than $6, the card is amazing when your Commander can gain life, you have a lower avg. CMC and even if you don't have top of library manipulation. Children of Korlis goes well with Citadel, to sac to gain all the life back you lost casting spells. Greed interacts well with Citadel and Children, it's budget repeatable draw when you can gain life. It can help to draw land that's revealed on top of your library so that you can keep Citadel going.

Plumb the Forbidden can instant sac all creatures you control to draw for each one for 2 mana. I'm a big fan of Fanatical Devotion for a budget sac outlet that can protect your Commander from many types of removal and also protect creatures in combo while being the sac outlet in the combo.

Some changes to consider:

Good luck with your deck.

Neotrup on Activated Sleeper and Commander.

1 year ago

As stated, you won't have priority to cast Activated Sleeper after the commander dies before it's back in the command zone, but if a single spell or ability resolving kills the commander and puts Activated Sleeper into play, such as Living End, it will be able to copy the commander as it hasn't yet been put into the Command Zone.

bhst5019 on Activated Sleeper and Commander.

1 year ago

Activated Sleeper

If someone kills a commander, non exile, can I use Activated sleeper to copy it before it goes to command zone?

multimedia on Nethroi. More mill support?

1 year ago

Self-mill yes, opponent mill no. You'll want plenty of self-mill to fuel Nethroi along with lots of ramp since Nethroi is 7 mana to mutate.

Fauna Shaman, Buried Alive, Jarad's Orders, Unmarked Grave, Vile Entomber are helpful especially if playing dredge creatures. Shigeki, Jukai Visionary is nice for self-mill + ramp + recursion.

Culling Ritual is a powerful card in multiplayer Commander that also provides ramp for Nethroi. Songs of the Damned goes well with self-mill + lots of creatures for ramp especially since Nethroi has 6 black mana in it's mutate cost.

Body Launderer and Karmic Guide are two good creatures with self-mill and they combo with a sac outlet such as Viscera Seer for infinite scry/loot. Activated Sleeper is an underrated 0/0 creature who also combos with Karmic. Braids, Arisen Nightmare is powerful draw in multiplayer Commander when sacing your own creatures helps you.

Plumb the Forbidden is mass sac for mass draw. Vivien, Champion of the Wilds, Emergence Zone, Savage Summoning lets you mutate at instant speed on an opponent's turn.

DreadKhan on Meren of Clan Nel Toth

1 year ago

I usually recommend people try out Diligent Farmhand and Dawntreader Elk as creatures for Meren to reanimate and ramp you because they are sacrificed. This makes these play better than Wood Elves in a lot of situations, but you can certainly run both (I only run 30 lands in my Meren deck, and no mana rocks, I usually end up with a ton of lands by the time the game is done).

If you use creatures that make a bunch of tokens upon entering the battlefield, you might like Demon of Dark Schemes, which can be used as a tiny wipe and as a repeatable source of reanimation? It combos fairly well, using Phyrexian Altar, Ashnod's Altar or Pitiless Plunderer, another card very good with the Demon or in Meren in general is Mitotic Slime, which is a ton of bodies for 5 mana. Another solid card in Meren is Callous Bloodmage, a very versatile creature to reanimate for sure, it also doesn't exile your graveyard when it exiles an opponent's. Dauthi Voidwalker is a really good card if you play against people who use a lot of spells, especially powerful ones, the ability is amazing in Meren because the cards that are exiled stay that way even if you recur Voidwalker it can still see all of those exiled cards, including any an opponent's Voidwalker exiled from your opponents. Helm of Possession is a really off-colour ability for Golgari, and you probably can pay the creature. When you want a new creature you can just sac the old one and steal a new one. Midnight Reaper is another Grim Haruspex, not sure how many you necessarily want, but I rarely mind having two out.

I don't love spells in Meren, but I make an exception for Jarad's Orders, Final Parting and Ritual of the Machine. Graveyard tutors are good in Meren, and tutoring cards into hand is also good. Ritual's ability to steal most creatures can really save you if people run certain kinds of decks. Another good tutor to consider is Fiend Artisan, digging out a Sidisi feels pretty good if Meren is out, I can usually recur her right away for a second tutor.

I'm not really sure if your creature count is high enough at 38, but I absolutely adore Lurking Predators, it can put out multiple creatures per cycle for me, which will usually put me ahead quickly. I run 55 creatures IIRC, so technically I should get a creature a little more often than every other spell, which is obviously absurd if someone else can't combo off. It's just hilarious when you pull something like Plaguecrafter or Ravenous Chupacabra.

It's pretty pushed so you might not want to run it, but Protean Hulk can find 6 MV worth of bodies, so it can find Walking Ballista and Mikaeus in one go, which is pretty solid. If you use something like Activated Sleeper you can get an extra 3 MV worth of creature, which can mean a Blood Artist and Carrion Feeder or Viscera Seer to just win on the spot.

If you are using Mazirek, I feel like I have to mention One with the Kami, this very easily goes infinite with Mazirek, giving you infinite deaths and enters as well as infinitely large tokens for something like Altar of Dementia, or even swinging.

Your deck looks great as is, just throwing a few ideas out there for you, hope some are helpful!

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