|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Magic Game Night (GNT)||Common|
|Core Set 2019 (M19)||Common|
|Iconic Masters (IMA)||Common|
|Conspiracy: Take the Crown (CN2)||Common|
|Shadows over Innistrad (SOI)||Common|
|Dragons of Tarkir (DTK)||Common|
|Khans of Tarkir (KTK)||Common|
Combos Browse all
As an additional cost to cast this spell, discard a card.
Draw two cards.
Tormenting Voice Discussion
15 hours ago
TypicalTimmy Just curious; where's the rule about the planeswalker card using the subtype to determine whether or not you can use an ability? I couldn't find it; all I could see was that it was the same permanent. Is there currently a planeswalker that changes subtype when it transforms?
Assuming for the moment that you can't activate both sides of it in a single turn, I think they'd currently look like this. I'm keeping my weird mana cost, just because I like it.
Sorin, Out for Blood
Legendary Planeswalker - Sorin
You may have this card enter the battlefield transformed.
+1: Each player discards a card. Draw cards equal to half the number of cards discarded this way, rounded up.
0: Gain life equal to Sorin, Out for Blood's loyalty, then transform it.
-X: You may tap up to X creatures you control. Creatures you don't control get -1/-1 until end of turn for each creature tapped this way.
Nahiri, Heart of Stone
Legendary Planeswalker - Nahiri
As long as it's your turn, Nahiri, Heart of Stone is a 4/4 Kor Ally creature with menace and indestructible that's still a planeswalker.
+1: Deal 2 damage to target planeswalker or each opponent. You may transform Nahiri, Heart of Stone
-X: Tap Nahiri, Heart of Stone. X target creatures you control get +1/+1 for each mountain you control.
So, - changing Sorin's +1 to make him a Rummaging Goblin in 1v1 and Tormenting Voice in EDH/Oathbreaker - Nahiri stays legendary as a creature - replace Nahiri's -X with the +1/+1 bonus for mountains
4 days ago
Hey man, Duelist's Heritage might be a fun addition to make allies. Captive Audience is also good to threat your opponents, you just need to show the card, haha. I see that you have a lot of instants; Vial Smasher the Fierce can be a little agressive, but you can always use the old argument, "Sry man, but it's random damage".
More draw wouldn't hurt IMO, I like to use cheap cards like Sign in Blood , Painful Truths and even Tormenting Voice . I would also consider to use at least 36 lands. Anyway, Marchesa seems to be a blast to play with that theme.
Feel free to check out my Mathas, Fiend Seeker politics/group slug deck, suggestions are always welcome.
1 week ago
Thanks for the praise.
Imho Tectonic Reformation is a no. Three mana and lose a land to get a card that it replaces in the deck. Further cards might drift towards value after 2-4 cycles, but you can't really expect that much spare land regularly and are probably dead with the mana sunk and such draws anyway. Likely a lose less card that otherwise clogs hand. Far better options imho.
I'd also prune the numbers of some cards to one, as you simply don't want to have opening hands of 2+ of these. An opening hand with 2 lava darts is in struggle land. You already need to consider a Mulligan if no paradise mantle or if two or more, adding further bad opener multiples hurts a lot imho.
I think the Elixer is also bad imho. It distracts from your game plan and is too toolbox cute in a linear aggro/combo deck. The deck really really needs to rapidly hit creature + paradise mantle + two lands + 2 or more useful red draw spells, and is far too likely to fizzle on cards like enchantments or the elixer compared to the amount of actual losses turned to wins they actually give it. Avoid Mulligan pressure and avoid whif cards like this to focus on winning more.
When you hit your combo game plan of a Wierd with mantle casting an expedite or similar, you actually would ideally aim for your deck to consist of only 1 mana red cantrips plus a Grapeshot . Given the presence of numerous lands and other non cantrips cards (whiff draws) your gameplay is: 1. attempt to luck out, ie draw and cast x cantrips, without interruption, where x is the number needed to immediately perform a combo of swing/thud/grapeshot/thermo-Alchemist for lethal; or 2. have more spare red cantrips or equivalent in hand than the y whif draws that occur before you reach x. Multiple drawing low cost cards greatly assist this plan.
As such, we need to seek to minimise y (the whiff draws) and seek to maximise the x (cantrips). The constraints are running sufficient lands and creatures to rapidly reach initial conditions to start our combo, plus 1-2 flex meta spots.
whiff cards in above deck: 2 sorcery 5 artifacts 18 land 2 instants 10 creatures 1 enchantment = 38/60 whiff cards This means that your deck had 22 draw cards, and pushes up the number you need to have in hand/drawn to overcome the likely 4+ whiffs with a 38/60 whiff rate. The deck runs out of gas hard.
Note that I'm ignoring mana generating spells here, they have their own role that I'll discuss later.
I'd think you could push the draw cards to say 30, and throw in some cards that draw multiples.
Bedlam Reveler as a 2 of. Improves as your deck fills with more cantrips.
Noxious Revival as a definite 4 of. Is a whiff that makes another draw an auto non whiff, ie net value gain if Whiff cards are 30+, and huge toolbox value with Bedlam Reveler or Reforge the Soul or other multidraw cards or to return a slain weird.
Reforge the Soul as a 1-2 of. If miracle, great, if not, discard with Looting and Noxious Revival it into a win. Maybe find another red instant/sorcery cantrip discard outlet - maybe swap 1-2 Magmatic Insight for Tormenting Voice ?
Imho drop to say 15 lands. It's not like you don't draw cards, and you run Faithless Lootings etc. Perhaps we should consider running 4 Simian Spirit Guide - it's effectively a 1 use land that can be played on top of other lands in any turn.
Drop the enchantment and the elixer and 3 lands and 1 creature and 2 whiff instants and try a version where you throw in 4 Noxious 2 Bedlam 2 Reforge, then re add lands as needed.
1 week ago
Black can also be for reanimation and tutors. Angel of Despair is a good Orzhov Angel and Rune-Scarred Demon is a good Demon. With Kaalia you play a lot of high CMC creatures because her ability lets you cheat these creatures onto the battlefield. There's however a drawback when playing so many high CMC creatures, it can make your overall deck's mana curve clunky to play, but you'll have this problem with any Angel deck because many Angels have high mana costs. If Kaalia is getting to attack and you're getting to cheat creatures onto the battlefield then you're in a good position. This is however not always the case thus want back-up plans, other ways to take advantage of high CMC creatures without Kaalia. Build your deck in a way that you're not completely relying on Kaalia in a game.
Reanimation can be a back-up plan. Ways to get high CMC creatures out of your hand/library into your graveyard and then onto the battlefield. Or ways to reanimate your dead creatures or even Kaalia since she will be a prime target for opponent's removal. Some options are:
- Animate Dead
- Karmic Guide
- Emeria Shepherd
- Nahiri, the Harbinger
- Buried Alive
- Faithless Looting
- Tormenting Voice
- Demonic Tutor
- Rune-Scarred Demon
- Diabolic Intent
Another back-up plan is ramp especially Signets and Talismans. High CMC creatures have high mana costs which ramp can help with to cast them without needing Kaalia. Low CMC mana rocks (0-2 CMC) also help to ramp into Kaalia which is good. Some options are:
- Sol Ring
- Talisman of Hierarchy
- Talisman of Conviction
- Talisman of Indulgence
- Rakdos Signet
- Orzhov Signet
- Boros Signet
- Fellwar Stone
- Mind Stone
- Knight of the White Orchid
Other back-up plans can be other ways to cheat high CMC creatures onto the battlefield or combo finishers. Some options are:
- Quicksilver Amulet
- Sneak Attack
- Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker + Restoration Angel
- Aurelia, the Warleader + Helm of the Host
With Kaalia you want lots of protection and haste enablers because you want to be able to attack with her the turn you play her and you want to be able to protect her so she can do this. Some options are:
- Mother of Runes
- Giver of Runes
- Grand Abolisher
- Swiftfoot Boots
- Lightning Greaves
- Defense Grid
- Boros Charm
- Dragon Tempest
- Mass Hysteria
Kaalia can provide a lot of value especially if you can successfully cheat a high CMC creature onto the battlefield the turn you play her then you're in a really good position in a game. For instance with Kaalia cheat Aurelia, the Warleader onto the battlefield. Aurelia gives you another combat phase thus another creature can be cheated onto the battlefield with Kaalia because she gets to attack again.
2 weeks ago
I recommend Hazoret's Monument since it helps reduce the cost of the more expensive creatures. Throne of the God-Pharaoh is good for extra life loss, and helps get around cards like Glacial Chasm . Impact Tremors as always has great synergy with Goblins. Finally, Last-Ditch Effort is a good end it all card. If you find yourself lacking in draw power, I also suggest Tormenting Voice and Wild Guess .
1 month ago
Rather than completely ignoring planeswalkers, I think at least 1 copy of Vraska's Contempt could be pretty valuable. To help mill and gain counters, Ashiok, Dream Render would be greatly helpful as it not only mills 4 but additionally negates things like Vivien's Arkbow . Having Tormenting Voice could be pretty good to help with additional card advantage and provides more guarantee to the combo going off. It also seems you need to raise the amount of blue mana and lower your red mana.
1 month ago
This seems like a deck for War's Toll , making opponents attack and use their mana. I also think running some more ramp cards could be helpful since your curve is so high, letting you get your disruption spells out earlier, so cards like Golgari Signet and Elvish Mystic . I also am very dubious about the inclusion of Cabal Stronghold as you are only running 4x Swamps making its value extremely low, I'd rather just run another basic in its place. I also notice that you have many cards that care about the graveyard and what's in it without having any real ways to reliably fill it outside of combat and self sacrifice. Maybe including card draw such as Tormenting Voice or Faithless Looting , or even better yet Underrealm Lich . Also, if you are going to be using your graveyard, cards like Eternal Witness and Grapple with the Past are ways to get things back to your hand to use again. Anywho, super cool deck, Jund is great and I am loving the abuse of combat. Fun concept!
1 month ago
A couple thoughts :) Hopefully some tickle your fancy, and fit your budget.
We probably should drill down to the important creatures, and really weigh which ones have the best impact / best efficiency and cut the others. We need to focus on the mana curve, too, to keep the deck running efficiently. And of course, that means control, too.
- Ilharg, the Raze-Boar is amazing, but due to it's high cost, is perfect at 2x copies. Every other creature on this list should really have good synergy with it.
- Dreadhorde Butcher , I believe, is going to wreck. It has a reasonable floor and an ultra high ceiling. With the haste, low CMC, and death trigger, it will always have value. I see 4x copies easily.
- Etali, Primal Storm is great, particularly when paired with the Raze-Boar. However, this should be the very tip top of your aggro curve, and probably should be at 1x copy.
- Grim Initiate is the beginning of your curve, and has good value for a one drop. Run 4x. The fact that it can replace itself and consistently keep the pressure is gold.
- Dreadmalkin is a kitty. Kitties are great, and so is this one. The sacrificing ability is great even in the late game. However, you'll have to sink a lot of mana into this. A possibly better replace is Diregraf Ghoul but ain't bad!
- Krenko, Tin Street Kingpin is a three drop, and you don't have any of those. He pairs excellently with the Raze-Boar, too!
- Massacre Girl might work soooo well here as a 1x copy. Not entirely sure, but it'll be hilariously fun lol
- Lava Coil , Bedevil , Cast Down , or Jaya's Greeting are incredibly efficient and will work a lot faster than Flames of the Raze-Boar . Specifically Bedevil, which is just an insane card.
- Costly Plunder or Tormenting Voice just cause card draw in an aggro deck is critical to not running out of gas.
- Angrath's Rampage is gonna be a staple sideboard card. Not always relevant, so I wouldn't run it MB
- Hilariously, Tibalt, Rakish Instigator might be able to find it's way here.
Anyway, just a few thoughts. Basically vomited a bunch of cards, so I apologize if they're not the best suggestions xP
Tormenting Voice occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.03%
All decks: 0.07%
All decks: 0.1%