|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Modern Masters 2015 Edition||Rare|
Combos Browse all
Creature — Elf Knight
Other green creatures you control get +1/+1.
Other white creatures you control get +1/+1.
If a spell or ability an opponent controls causes you to discard Wilt-Leaf Liege, put it into play instead of putting it into your graveyard.
Price & Acquistion Set Price Alerts
|Have (15)||ironax , awalloftext , bakeraj4 , firemind12 , Forkbeard , perrin515 , tragic_slip , bigc137 , KillDatBUG , Faceless_Being , Pocketmouse , dexxter7 , dplerner , jhTheMan99 , philktoken8998|
|Want (4)||bradyofportdetroit , fireborne1986 , zachi , Dadaman11|
Wilt-Leaf Liege Discussion
1 day ago
That leaves me 2 cards high still. And what about Anafenza, the Foremost ? Just sideboard for additional graveyard hate?
I went ahead and pulled all my Paths out of commander for now, but I'll still need to borrow Experiment One and Loxodon Smiter as well as buy 1 Scavenging Ooze, 1 Voice of Resurgence, 4 Wilt-Leaf Liege and another Inquisition of Kozilek and Abrupt Decay.
I ended up with a lot of 3-ofs after our box openings.
2 days ago
xyr0s I think we didn't understand each other well. My point is that winning is not by nature the goal every player have in mind. What I meant is that definition of words or concept are a mirror of human interaction, words have the meaning we give them. Winning has definitely a definition, a game-related definition, but it also have a human-related definition, which are not necessarily equivalent. What my stance was is that whether or not you want to win, you must define it's definition within yourself, and then play alike. If you follow me, if you wanted to win game-wise, in a competitive environment, play another deck, stompy is good but there's better, but if you want to win flavor-wise, or within your own definition of the concept of winning, play whatever you like, which englobe the deck and a thousand other casual ones.
In the same way, the deck is how you define it as much as how people defines it around you, names have no universal meaning and can (and will) change within a population and time. It's not more of an aggro deck for everyone as a midrange deck for you. I know it's meta and not really important, but nonetheless, it's true. Even if I must admit that yes, it's quite frankly a aggro deck, no need to be Einstein to understand that, my point is that there is no need to fall into a obscurantism of opinions, in which strange place only one matters: there is no "real" way to play the deck, nor "real" way to win. You can't assume the intention of players by the fact they play magic, it's not because they wrote "competitive" on top of the page that they are playing to win, as strangely as it may sound.
How many time have I seen people play douchebag decks only to make people suffer, not even to win. They feel good even if they lose at the end. It happens especially in commander, and they call their decks competitive.
Anyway, Wilt-Leaf Liege is against discard, yes. Loxodon Smiter is another good exemple of great answer against discard. With Death's Shadow decks all around and our ability to play everything we have in our hand super fast, discarding it to a surprise Thoughtseize (having no other target) or a late game Liliana of the Veil is great way to punish them. I prefer them in sideboard tho, unless your meta is full of discard.
Groundbreaker as a one of, in the situation you've shown, is quite funny and interesting I must admit. keeping them from playing their removal is interesting, good interaction. It could surprise a lot of players game 1, and keep them on the edge game 2. You can even side it out and the opponent won't even know it, no one will ever Surgical Extraction you so they won't search your library. I'd say go for it, I agree. I personally prefer consistency over surprise win (in which case I feel like playing against my own deck), but it's a matter of taste/meta :)
2 days ago
@mahdik Not to be a know-it-all or anything, but... erhm... winning is pretty well defined in magic. You know: Reduce your opponents life total to 0 or less, or have your opponent attempt to draw a card without having any cards left in library - in both of these cases, you win the game. Other than this, there are a few cards with their own conditions for winning, like Felidar Sovereign. And playing a game like magic, poker or parcheesi, actually has some fairly clear conditions for determining when the game is over, and what the results of this particular match was, including who won. And while some players may appreciate other things you can do in a game like magic other than winning (splashy plays, theme decks), those that mark their deck with the "competitive" tag, probably care about winning, at least with this particular deck. Those that also mark their deck "budget" cares about winning, but without having to sell their firstborn to do so. What can seem a little odd, is a long and eloquent essay about how you find the urge to make every deck competitive hard to tolerate - you could see the "competitive" tag, so... why bother complaining about it? There is a whole pile of casual decks, that you could comment on.
Regarding this deck: Yes, it's possible to classify decks in terms of their approach to winning, and many cards are only played in one type of deck. This deck is an aggro deck. That defines how it's going to win. It's also a budget deck. Like a couple of other decks, it's a metacall: Sometimes the local environment shapes up in a way, where certain decks would be easy to win with. This one would be pretty good if there's a lot of burn decks, I think. But in a UW-control heavy meta, it wouldn't really shine. It's probably one of the decks, that are that little bit too fair to be really competitive. but it does have it's uses.
I agree on a couple of your opinions: 4 cmc cards are hard to play in modern, at least if you are going to do so on curve - you don't suggest Wilt-Leaf Liege as a 4 cmc creature, but a way to deal with discard, right? Also, this deck might have a bit too many buffing cards - and a correspondingly low creature count (it's a bit of interpretation, but that's what I think you meant).
The single copy of Groundbreaker I really like. At a single copy, it's unlikely to clutter your hand. And it's the type of card, that can end a game against an opponent who runs out of removal, or thinks he is safe for some other reason. More than 1 copy would be too much, though. And I think a point about it could be, that some opponents might hold back removal specifically for this, and let some of your other creatures live.
3 days ago
First of all, I see some people here having really stubborn opinions over the game. I mean, personally, I have an old saying, marked on my heart, who tells "play what you like and be the best at it", and I feel like some might forget that magic is a game before anything. Playing a game, by nature, hasn't a defined goal nor ideal end, "winning" is not universally seen as the same, and it's even more not seen universally as the goal. Competitiveness is not the ultimate thing to achieve, it can be to one, and be the opposite to the other.
Yes, interaction is important in playing magic for fact, and if you have no removal nor clear plan you won't go further against opponent who will, but the fact is that even if the deck you play is called agro by the majority, it doesn't define it's nature to the unique, you can't just say "it works like this and there's no way you can change it". This deck is not more aggro then what you may think, like, calm down with the unstoppable need to win, stop comparing everything to what used or is winning right now, statistic aren't mirror of reality nor definitive answer to what we should play.
What I mean is that if you really want to win each game, or go competitive like so many people want to, stompy is definitely not the deck to play, so there is no reason to not have fun in tweaking the deck as one may like. If the deck was to become competitive, it would have been WAY before because the deck is old as hell, old as modern itself. So play the deck as you like, splash color or play mono-green, use only forest or use non-basic lands, play removal or don't, do whatever you like, no one cares beside you.
Anyway, that was a small rant, I can't stand this irreparable will to make everything competitive. If you still want to hear my (personal) thoughts on the deck, here are they, but take them as they are, opinions, not facts:
- I prefer mono green, less life loss, cheaper (even if it shouldn't be a problem in a perfect world), and you can work around with Dismember and Prey Upon for removal. If you need more protection, there's lots of response even in "mono green": Blossoming Defense, Wilt-Leaf Liege for instance;
- No ramp, ensuring a better start is less interesting than thinking about a better late-game, the speed you gain doesn't make you apply more pressure nor save you after they stop your treats, I suggest late-game alternative over them if you really want to spice up your list. Otherwise, play more aggro;
- Groundbreaker is easily removed, for 3 mana it's not enough of a treat, even as a one-of, if the opponent knows how to play, he will never tap out against you, you are the danger, playing one and get it bolted means literally loosing a turn. Don't bother playing them, I know they are funny and surprising, but they are once, not twice;
- The graveyard hate plan is better than the Hooting Mandrills one, your graveyard play is far less efficient than grixis player's one, no cantrip or anything to fill it, don't count on them to kill your creature and keep them in your graveyard, they play Scavenging Ooze too. If you can't play with it properly, stop them to too, or else they will beat you on that level, don't bite more than you can chew and keep on nurfing Tarmogoyf and Snapcaster Mage;
- I prefer having a diverse land base and skipping over Dungrove Elder, it's good with Hexproof, but against wipes it's like any other creatures, so I suggest not to bother building around it too much, that's the more subjective that I can be. It's good as a one-of, but not more than that with a different land base (I like playing rich and diverse land base, strictly subjective like I said);
- Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx is indeed not really good, unless you run some more mana-sink like Scavenging Ooze mainboard, you should probably skip it;
- Don't overdo cards that depends on the board state, like Aspect of Hydra and Khalni Hydra, if the board doesn't cooperate, it's a dead draw, unless you want to make the deck a little bit more midrange. I wouldn't suggest you to do it, but if you still want to (I'm culprit of this), don't play too much late-game cards, still keep in mind you don't want to go in late-game, and if you do, play interactive cards, they will at least spice up your play and assure you have fun and give a interesting fight with your opponent;
- lastly, never play 4 CMC spells, seriously, you won't be able. The only 4 CMC spell you should consider is Collected Company, and personally, the value of this card is good when you run more than 28 creatures, and especially when the majority cost 2 CMC or more, which you don't, so I wouldn't suggest it. It's good, really good, but still, you can perfectly go without it.
Otherwise, have fun m8, it's one of my favorite deck and I can't keep seeing it played!
3 days ago
Hello there! (I found you through the Modern Users Specialties list, if you were wondering why I randomly commented.)
This deck is really nice! I also started Magic around 2004 (Kamigawa), and after Lorwyn, Elves became my favorite archetype.
Why run westvale abbey? You already have few lands, and drawing a one lander with westvale means you have to mulligan, but if you had any other land, you wouldn't have to mull. Sacrificing 5 elves to get a solid flyer usually isn't good enough, because if you were able to get those 5 elves out, you could probably end the game.
Now, onto the real reason why I came here.
I was wondering about Wilt-Leaf Liege. Recently, I've been working on Abzan Elves, and wilt leaf liege looks good. However, I'm not exactly sure when to board it in, the purpose of it, and I wanted to hear your opinions on it. Thank you. :)
3 weeks ago
Do you want to make this a token deck or life gain or just good green white cards? If you want to make a token deck then cards like Advent of the Wurm and Parallel Lives are good starts. If you want to make it life gain then cards like Archangel of Thune and Ageless Entity are good. And if you just want general good stuff then Wilt-Leaf Liege and Thrun, the Last Troll are some good cards. Hope some of this helps
1 month ago
1 month ago
Leyline of Sanctity is a great card for decks that play white.
black can run discard to grab their discard. or maybe some madness cards. i don't exactly know what the best option is.