Chain of Vapor
Return target nonland permanent to its owner's hand. Then that permanent's controller may sacrifice a land. If the player does, he or she may copy this spell and may choose a new target for that copy.
|Want (2)||Darui , KillKid20095|
Printings View all
|Commander 2016 (C16)||Uncommon|
Combos Browse all
|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Latest Decks as Commander
Chain of Vapor Discussion
2 weeks ago
From a competitive standpoint the deck is running so little interaction and protection as it stands that it won't ever be able to hold up in competitive settings.
You'll definitely want each of these pieces of interaction in a Kinnan helmed deck at a minimum:
As it stands that won't be quite enough pieces to consistently have the access to permission and protection elements to remain in a competitive position in most game states and these pieces are worth running much of the time:
xNegate xDelay xInto the Roil/2cmc bounce spells (UG has very limited access to tools that can remove hate pieces from the board that prevent a win like Grafdigger's Cage, Notion Thief, or Narset, Parter of Veils.) xBeast Within
As an additional note about competitive Kinnan builds, you can lose the Dramatic Scepter stuff entirely. There's no need in a Kinnan deck. The most effective and efficient method of generating the infinite combo needed to win is any dork that can produce U and G mana combined with Freed from the Real and Pemmin's Aura. Basalt Monolith is worth running in Kinnan decks because it generates infinite colorless with just Kinnan out on the field also, so you can usually get a couple of Kinnan activations off to dig for Thrasios. For the mana dork complement it's best to stick with BoP, all the 1 cmc tap for G elf dorks, and then a handful of 2 cmc "tap for any color" dorks. The most effective back up infinite mana engines for a Kinnan deck are typically Simic Ragworm or Horseshoe Crab paired with Paradise Mantle and the Monolith (which is often why the deck runs Staff of Domination as an additional outlet that's easy to tutor for in the colors) rather than Dramatic Scepter combo as the Scepter combo relies on density of dorks and rocks to be engaged and this can be more difficult than a less card intensive engine (Crab, Mantle, Kinnan is 3 cards with one from the command zone compared to Kinnan, Dramatic Reversal, Isochron Scepter, 2 mana rocks/dorks at 5 cards to engage) and thus less reliable for the game play patterns Kinnan wants to ideally play from. Shapers of Nature and Thrasios, Triton Hero are the standard outlets that will eventually be found from Kinnan activations that allow you to draw the whole deck. From there winning is easy, so stick to win conditions that are more live than things like Blue Sun's Zenith and run Thassa's Oracle plus a looping mechanism (such as Narset's Reversal and Timetwister or Elixir of Immortality) to use the interaction pieces like Swan Song and Pongify as the win conditions (this helps to avoid other issues too, like not being able to win with Oracle due to Angel's Grace, etc, in addition to improving card slot efficiency). Green Sun's Zenith and Drift of Phantasms are generally considered must runs as tutor options for competitive Kinnan lists, but a good number of quality tutor options are available to provide consistency. Incubation Druid+Vigean Graftmage is somewhat popular as another back up 3 card game winning infinite combo line.
3 weeks ago
It makes our board lands, so they can't remove it to a ton of effects!
4 weeks ago
For anyone interested in a budget version, here are some changes I would recommend:
Chain of Vapor becomes literally any removal spell, it's just in here because I own a Chinese one and I like the card a lot. (Plus it can bounce your own commander and sac a land to make it into a removal spell.)
Mystic Remora becomes any draw spell.
There are also a couple of randomly expensive mana rocks or whatever, figure it out.
1 month ago
Regarding Psyche, you are typically going to be over that minimum number of spins just on your way to Psyche. It’ll be overkill by the time you get it off. On that note, you can get yourself to a position where you Psyche right after Sunrising all your stuff back. Or the fact that those bounce spells only make Psyche better in terms of its primary effect. At least if they’re responding to Psyche with the bounce.
The deck probably can’t go completely infinite but it can go well beyond what it needs including spinning until you get a finisher with counter magic or enough to do multiple spins off one hand. That’s the differentiation between this and the other wheel decks. Sunrise and Reward will eventually get you multiple spins that can’t be countered. Protect the reanimation and the bang/buck ratio increases as you sequence.
I do completely understand that the vulnerability of spinning your opponent into counters is a given with all wheel decks. You are certainly right about how that inhibits them from being viable. It’s a meta thing. Maybe save it for Dredge. Leyline of the Void is an extremely good reason for why Chain of Vapor should be in the sideboard.
I think that the wheel decks are interesting as they are very similar concepts but perhaps each would thrive under different metas. They goldfish very nicely but their exposing nature makes them tricky in practice.
1 month ago
Depends. If you catch a Force, even if you Force. They're still 2 cards down and Psyche will only deal 19. Any free pitch cards will make you keep going. Then you have to achieve Metalcraft or cast one of your return cards at the point, and then produce enough mana to cast Psyche. Depending on what's in the yard, and what you have in play, you may lose metalcraft, and if you even keep spinning will run out of gas.
And the biggest problem, is you're going to start eating your draw 7's to keep Forcing, since you're running a very limited amount of blue. Probe and Recall will go first, then it'll be either Negation and Forces, if you have to keep going or Timetwister and Windfall start taking the chopping block. If you go with the assumption you will Wheel yourself into Force you also have to assume your opponent has one as well.
1 month ago
Hit the nail on the head perfectly.
Defense Grid is interesting but very unnecessary. With so many cards to increase mana costs, you'll just bait the FoW
1 month ago
1 month ago
Key Mana Rocks:
Mana Crypt, Sol Ring, Mox Diamond, Chrome Mox, Lotus Petal, Mox Opal, Mox Amber, Mana Vault, Grim Monolith, Basalt Monolith, Arcane Signet, Fellwar Stone, the Signets and Talismans, Mind Stone, and Thought Vessel
Key Mana Dorks:
Deathrite Shaman, Birds of Paradise, Noble Hierarch, Avacyn's Pilgrim, Elves of Deep Shadow, Elvish Mystic, Llanowar Elves, Fyndhorn Elves, Arbor Elf, Boreal Druid, Bloom Tender, Priest of Titania, Faeburrow Elder
Key Mana Ramp (Other):
Collector Ouphe, Notion Thief, Ashiok, Dream Render, Narset, Parter of Veils, Null Rod, Linvala, Keeper of Silence, Cursed Totem, Grafdigger's Cage, Chains of Mephistopheles, Rest in Peace, Aven Mindcensor, Drannith Magistrate
Key Blue Countermagic:
Swan Song, Spell Pierce, Flusterstorm, Miscast, Dispel, Force of Will, Force of Negation, Mental Misstep, Fierce Guardianship, Pact of Negation, Mana Drain, Dovin's Veto, Drown in the Loch, Counterspell
Key Non-Blue Countermagic:
Chain of Vapor, Swords to Plowshares, Nature's Claim, Dismember, Fatal Push, Vandalblast, Winds of Abandon, Cyclonic Rift, Gilded Drake, Oko, Thief of Crowns, Legacy's Allure, Abrade, Abrupt Decay, Assassin's Trophy, Drown in the Loch, By Force, Shattering Spree, Natural State
Lands are Fetches, Horizon Duals, Og Duals, Shocks, Pain lands, sometimes triomes, sometimes the castles. Command Tower, City of Brass, Mana Confluence, Exotic Orchard, Forbidden Orchard, Gemstone Caverns, Gemstone Mine, Ancient Tomb, Gaea's Cradle, Wirewood Lodge, Mystic Sanctuary