Autumn's Veil

Instant

Spells you control can't be countered by blue or black spells this turn, and creatures you control can't be the target of blue or black spells this turn.

Discussion (47)

klaudiohmm on Flavor Text Tribal, aka: Vanilla Beats

14 hours ago

Hey! If you aren't necessarily running a Bear subtheme, maybe you should swap some of them for vanilla elves. You can strengthen your Elf synergy with Cylian Elf and Elvish Warrior , for example. Maybe a card like Nullhide Ferox works too. Your opponents may hesitate to activate its ability (if they activate, it loses hexproof but becomes unblockable), but I don't know if it is good or fun enough.

I think that other token generators can work very well with your commander. Avenger of Zendikar is a very strong creature that puts a lot of 0/1 tokens without abilities, so they are buffed by your commander. Deranged Hermit and Deep Forest Hermit can be very powerful in your strategy because they swarm the board, and G likes creatures on the field (you can use card draw like Shamanic Revelation or buffing effects like Beastmaster Ascension with better results). For card draw, maybe you should use Regal Force or something like it (benefit from tokens) or Guardian Project (tokens won't trigger it, but other creatures will).

If you go more for a token strategy, token doublers can help you a lot (that is, if you already have them or Quandrix commander from C21 didn't spike them). I don't know if the "return creatures from graveyard to your hand" is that strong. If it doesn't, maybe a token strategy works better. If you think that it goes against the idea of the deck (using cards forgotten in our boxes for ages), then really it's the case of running a lot of vanilla creatures (although I think that you should use them in the ideal quantity).

Don't know if it's worth, but you aren't running any boardwipes. Maybe Oblivion Stone helps you reset the board if opponents' boards become a problem. Other problem I see is recursion. I think that Eternal Witness is a green staple and maybe you should use it. Maybe swap a land for Bala Ged Recovery  ^Flip. To deal with graveyards, maybe Scavenging Ooze is a great addition.

I don't know if cards like Blossoming Defense or Autumn's Veil worth the slots. If you go for a token, more go-wide strategy, maybe lose a creature or other does not affect your game thaaat much. Maybe you should swap them for card draw or recursion cards.

That's all I can think for now. Hope it helps :)

Catonis on TnT, Scepter Squirrels

1 week ago

Nerdytimesorwhatever first, thanks for taking the time to comment! So for your first question I'm running Veil of Summer and Heroic Intervention I didn't think Autumn's Veil was necessary.

As for Blasting Station I know I could do the combo without it, and for the longest time I did, the only problem is I then have to wait a whole turn cycle with the combo on the field which opens me up to blow outs and has lost me games, being able to win the second it hits the field seems to work a lot better. I can also use infinite mana from scepter combo to play my commanders an infinite number of times and feed them into the station.

As for Eldritch Evolution I had never thought of using that card as a way to easily get Muse but that is a good idea and something to consider, I personally prefer rocks to dorks they seem to last longer in my meta and I hardly ever get attacks in so I don't often lean on Tymna for draw.

Honestly not really, I could add them and I have considered it but as you can see I don't have wheels or Notion Thief I would have to change the deck around quite a bit to make it worthwhile. As for the agent it is something to think about.

Don't worry about stepping on my toes any advice is appreciated, thats why I'm out here seeking it. Thank you for the kind words though

Nerdytimesorwhatever on TnT, Scepter Squirrels

1 week ago

Heroic Intervention, why are you including this card over Autumn's Veil ?

Blasting Station is a part of a 3 piece combo that would win on its own without it. Is this card really worth including in your opinion? I would cut it for more interaction or as this appears to be a budgetless list, a timetwister.

Eladamri's Call but no Eldritch Evolution? Tymna + EE = Put your seedborn muse to field.

I don't see Notion Thief or Hullbreacher, either. Just don't like the cards or what? You're also on a pretty low dork count for a tymna deck.

I don't wanna step on toes so Ill leave it there. I like the inclusion of Earthcraft + Squirrel Nest :)

TriusMalarky on It's time Hybrid mana is …

2 weeks ago

First, can I state the the conversation is about Hybrid, not or . Those should not be used in any argument, because all three are vastly different. For example, something with in its cost is definitely a Green card. It was built to be a green effect on a green card that had a weird casting cost to help some players out when their mana is weird. Additionally, Dismember is 100% a black card.

And can I say that I absolutely hate the "slippery slope" argument, especially in Magic. It's entirely irrelevant. It isn't even capable of holding water.

Now, the Hybrid mana thing is weird. The design of the mechanic allows mono-colored decks to use effects that are supposed to be 2-color. Technically, you can also use them in 2-color decks that don't line up, like Nightveil Specter in a deck, but that puts a lot of strain on your manabase and I don't recommend it.

The problem comes down to, do we actually want some of these cards in certain monocolor decks? Looking through the cards, most of them wouldn't even be played in commander. And honestly, oh no mono blue gets Overbeing of Myth is not all that scary. There's a couple minor pie stretches and breaks that would happen, but for the most part very few of the cards are playable and very few of them actually change much about what the mono color decks already have access to.

The only cards I can see actually being crazy are Guttural Response , which is a third member of green's Autumn's Veil and Veil of Summer package and another anti-counterspell in red's gang of Red Elemental Blast , Pyroblast , Ricochet Trap .... etc. Or maybe Vexing Shusher ? Hmmm, well . . . no. Again, red and green on their own are perfectly capable of saying "screw you blue" without either of those cards.

Or Waves of Aggression in mono white? Oh, wait . . . most mono white lists are stax or janky creature mcSlappies. And them getting one Extra Combat effect is honestly meh. It wouldn't break anything. Honestly, I don't even think it's all that powerful.

Or Dovescape in mono white? Oh, wait, monowhite has better stax pieces. In monoblue? Nah, monoblue is spellcaster. It loses to Dovescape.

The impact of making such a change is so small that, for those campaigning for the change, it is entirely an ideological victory. The impact is quite literally restricted to "now I have to explain why I'm allowed to run this card". Which honestly is no worse than having to explain some of your more complicated turns to newer players. Which I have to do all the time.

I don't have a stance here, because there isn't actually a compelling reason to make the change or to refuse the change. Actually, check that, there is one reason to refuse the change, and that is "actually bothering to make the change". So this change will not happen, because the single point awarded to either side is against it.

Neotrup on Does Veil of Summer count …

3 weeks ago

Veil of Summer and Autumn's Veil don't target. Spells and abilities only target if they use the word target (which Autumn's Veil does, but it doesn't tell you what to target, rather it says that things can't be the target). That said, you'll typically cast these spells in response to your opponent targeting one of your creatures. You're opponent's spell will still trigger Gargos, Vicious Watcher allowing it to fight a creature, and you can use your Veil to 'fizzle' their spell by making the target illegal.

GoblinsBeatElves on Does Veil of Summer count …

3 weeks ago

Context- I’m building a Gargos, Vicious Watcher EDH Deck, and I need a bit of clarification on how Veil of Summer / Autumn's Veil interact with their bottom ability. Do those spells trigger that ability? Sorry if this seems like an obvious question, I’m just coming back to the game after a long break and I’m kinda fuzzy on some of these interaction rules, and I just want to make sure of how that works.

TriusMalarky on Dime-store Derevi (Competitive, Budget $100)

1 month ago

You have 11 taplands. 11. When playing cEDH, the most you have is 1. Ever. Yavimaya Coast , Botanical Sanctum , Exotic Orchard , Sungrass Prairie , Skycloud Expanse , Sunpetal Grove , Glacial Fortress , Hinterland Harbor , Razorverge Thicket , Seachrome Coast , Spire of Industry . You'll have to spend a little more, but it's only like $30. And without that, you're never gonna win at a cEDH table.

Also, Edric, Spymaster of Trest , Triton Shorestalker , Mist-Cloaked Herald , Slither Blade , Gudul Lurker .

You're also not running Spell Pierce , Autumn's Veil , Dovin's Veto , Swords to Plowshares , Pongify , Rapid Hybridization , Path to Exile , Dispel , Mystical Dispute , Delay . Those are pretty much necessary. Also, Neoform , Eldritch Evolution , Eladamri's Call .

Most of your combos are . . . not cEDH viable. They require you to run taplands AND bad ramp cards and they require you to have several pieces on top of just needing several cards that aren't good outside the combo.

Now, is this a solid deck that will do well in moderately tuned games? Definitely. But it isn't competitive. And it is totally possible to make a competitive deck without going over $200, you just lose some of the speed and have to build your deck a bit differently to stay in the game.

StopShot on B&R February 15 2021

1 month ago

@TriusMalarky While Twin can force a land to get tapped on turn 3 to prevent 3 mana spells from getting cast you do need to remember doing so leaves the combo piece open to sorcery speed removal such as a Dreadbore , Flame Slash or Declaration in Stone in the first game and in the second and third game it allows cards like Torpor Orb or Blind Obedience to be played - tapping all out to put the combo piece down means you won't have counter-mana up to stop these effects from hitting the board and often the Twin player will instead choose to cast the combo piece on the endstep of their opponent's turn incase if there is a sorcery-speed threat such as T-orb that needs to be countered on their opponent's turn instead. The Twin player will (in most cases) only choose to preemptively tap down the land if they know their opponent is mana-screwed, if they don't have a counterspell in hand or if they know their opponent is running Twin to further stall the opponent's combo. With that said I wouldn't entirely discount 3 mana answers that can be made uncounterable by Cavern of Souls or Aether Vial or 3 mana spells that completely disable the deck beyond repair such as Unmoored Ego if they resolve.

I also think it would be more problematic for Twin decks to also splash in a third color for enchantment removal. One aspect that made Twin decks so oppressive was a solid portion of them would include copies of Blood Moon in the mainboard in order for it to be more difficult for their opponents to interact with their combo. Dedicating to a third color to run Dovin's Veto is going to come with not being able to run Blood Moon while being easier for the Twin deck to also get disrupted by an opponent's potential Blood Moon as well. On the other hand, Blood Moon has also been made weaker in the meta as Cleansing Wildfire and Force of Vigor make effective get out of jail free cards from sideboard.

Plus, I think you're undervaluing some cards in your assessment. Back when Twin was around the only one-mana spells that could remove an endstep flashed-in Deceiver Exarch was Path to Exile , Rending Volley , Vendetta and the ever so infrequent Skred and Lightning Axe and out of those, the only cards that were mainboard worthy was Path to Exile and Skred (which only worked if you were running a niche deck and you were going first with extra technicalities). Fatal Push has had a huge impact on the format being loads better than Vendetta which gives many more decks greater flexibility when holding removal mana up especially in game 1 given how playable it is in the mainboard. There's also Veil of Summer which also deserves mention and while you may see it as a simple upgrade to Autumn's Veil , fundamentally it's not. In the event I toss a Path to Exile or Fatal Push at a Pestermite and the Twin player responds with a Dispel , or as you suggested a Dovin's Veto , if I play an Autumn's Veil (which would effectively counter either counterspell), it would be a 2-for-2 trade. I lose the kill spell and veil to remove the Twin player's combo piece and counterspell. This lukewarm outcome is the reason why Autumn's Veil saw none if any modern play as Silence typically did its job better enough to warrant a splash in white over it in most cases if such an effect was absolutely needed in sideboard. Veil of Summer surpasses both because it has a built in cantrip that turns the interaction into a 1-for-2 trade in your favor and if the interaction happens while your opponent is trying to put a Splinter Twin on the combo piece it becomes a 1-for-3 trade in your favor. Veil of Summer 's value is by no means merely replacing Autumn's Veil or Silence 's role in the format, but more accurately it's replacing the clunkier Krosan Grip and Sudden Death that were typically used against the Twin-combo instead which makes it its own unique answer against the combo in my opinion.

Two more cards that I think also deserve further assessment is Sinister Concoction and Dovin's Veto . To say Dovin's Veto is just an upgrade to Negate I think is an understatement. "This spell can't be countered" is the reason Abrupt Decay was a banger of a card at thwarting Twin's machinations and I think the fact a Dovin's Veto can stop a Splinter Twin on cast makes it good enough to be a Twin-killer too. You suggested Twin might have to go into white to run its own Dovin's Veto es and Path to Exile s but I think the fact this card can also be used against Twin may be a more compelling reason for Twin to splash green over white just to have Veil of Summer as a necessary means to put up with the combined pressure Abrupt Decay and Dovin's Veto would have in keeping Twin in check as the Veil is the only card that can universally counteract both spells. (And even so Veil of Summer isn't a 100% failsafe as it has nothing against Rending Volley .) As for Sinister Concoction , I'm not going to pretend this card sees much Modern play, but this thing is a serious contender at throwing a wrench in Twin's plans and outside of Twin it's not an unplayable removal spell either. The reason why is it works much like your explanation for why Authority of the Consuls works - you can play it turn one and your opponent has no means to remove it without splashing a third color. Now Authority of the Consuls may be the more ideal card to use over it, but if your multicolor black deck can't splash white this is your next best thing and it even has some upsides over Authority of the Consuls . Sinister Concoction may be more fragile to effects like Stifle and Tale's End or effects like Spellskite and Apostle's Blessing , but it makes up for it when enchantment removal is thrown at it, as you can crack it in response to dumpster one of your opponent's creatures, in this case most likely a combo piece, while also rendering the enchantment removal as a waste in the process. This in turn is going to make the Twin player more cautious about playing their combo pieces before drawing into enchantment removal which can potentially delay the Twin player's progress harder than an Authority of the Consuls otherwise would. And if the Twin player doesn't have an answer, you'll always crack the Sinister Concoction in response to whatever creature they'll try to enchant with Splinter Twin to inflict the most damage. Even if you're playing on the draw or you draw into the card later, much like Authority of the Consuls , Sinister Concoction also bypasses quite a couple of Twin's favorite counterspells too such as Dispel , Spell Snare and Remand which is why I think the spell has much merit as yet another Twin-hate specific sideboard card that just wasn’t available to be utilized before in the past.

Lastly, the list I put up above was something I compiled over a quick gatherer search. I wouldn’t be surprised if I missed a few cards that may be just as worthy of discussion on countering Twin as well.