Second Sunrise

Second Sunrise

Instant

Each player returns to play all artifact, creature, enchantment, and land cards that were put into his or her graveyard from play this turn.

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Second Sunrise Discussion

TriusMalarky on Banlist Open Discussion

4 weeks ago

Second Sunrise and Krark-Clan Ironworks are banned almost entirely because they ruin tournaments. Not from a game balance perspective, necessarily, but because they can make so many games go to time, which can drag out the length of a tournament, which gets really problematic really quickly.

Mycosynth Lattice and Bridge from Below are banned because they either do unfair and unfun things, and possibly busted beyond belief things, or they do absolutely nothing. Bridge did squat until MH1 brought the Gaak and Altar, Lattice wasn't anywhere near playable until KTGC was printed. In bridge's case, the card that made it busted was also busted, and now bridge does basically nothing. In Lattice's case, KTGC is a fine card that is actually better for the format than it is bad, but add lattice and it takes a deck people aren't fans of anyways and turns it into a stax deck, which is probably the single most hated concept in Magic.

(Karn is a failsafe in case powerful artifact decks become a thing again -- there's a solid, reasonably castable value walker that can slot into any midrange build, maindeckable, that kills artifact based decks. I feel that that failsafe is important, and that the effect doesn't harm the meta significantly)

Blazing Shoal is similar -- when does it do fair things? The decks it'd be in would either die to Fatal Push or win on turn two. It's either a meme or format breaking. The conversation of unbanning things has to include "what does this do to make the format better?" In the case of a lot of these cards, nothing. Shoal, Lattice, Bridge and more don't do anything at best and become problematic at worst.

Twin is not unbannable either -- while it would be fun to see, it is a deck that plays the control role and then wins as soon as you let your guard down. Yeah, it's an easily stoppable combo . . . but the Twin player doesn't have to go for the win until they are sure you can't stop them. If they can Remand, Counterspell, Archmage's Charm and Cryptic Command their way into a good position(and that package is just very good anyways), then they can wait until you tap out for a threat and just win then. And cards that can answer them for no mana tend to be bad enough that they don't help against other decks -- which is problematic, to say the least.

Pod is interesting. It has a bit of an "eggs" feel, where it can take a while, but it's not as bad. Couple that with the fact that it can make use of every single creature, period, and you get a deck that's mostly just a headache for Wizards. It might not be bad for the format right now, but Wizards makes one mistake(and did you see 2019?) and suddenly it runs away with the game and becomes busted as all hell. So Pod should stay banned, not because it would really be bad(it would probably be fun) but it makes Wizard's job a lot harder(they have to check every, and I mean every, creature that they ever print against basically every other one).

Jitte is bad because it's used by creature decks to beat creature decks. First, it can't be unbanned in a Modern with Stoneforge in it(tutoring up Jitte would be way too consistent), but also, if I wanted to build a creature deck, I don't want to be forced to purchase some random equipment that has nothing to do with the rest of my gameplan other than "resolve this against another creature deck and you win". And then creature decks become Jitte versus Jitte. It would have a Copter effect on Modern, which just isn't fun from a variety standpoint. Especially with Ragavan in Modern. We unban Jitte, and RW Stoneforge Ragavan Jitte is probably the best deck by quite a bit.

Oko is, as mentioned, a 3 mana answer to almost anything. And by almost anything, I mean he gains enough life singlehandedly to make aggro untenable, he can be a good enough win condition to make non-Oko control not worth it, he answers big mana decks with an uptick, and more. He's the best permanent because he makes all other permanents irrelevant. Oh, you have a Prime Time? Elk. That's a nice Bob you have there, be a shame if I forcefully traded it for a food. Ragavan, Nimble Pilferer? How about Ragavan, Suddenlyonmysideandthere'snothingyoucandoaboutit? He'd be bad in a meta that's entirely storm(oh wait . . . that sounds a lot like Vintage and cEDH . . . I wonder what the two formats he's still playable in think about him? Oh? He's still busted there? Dang.) and I don't think that's fun.

As for Field of the Dead? Once that's online, you don't get to win. It's miserable. Most things I can get behind the first couple times I play against them, because most decks are cool, but not Field. It's just unfun to sit across from it.

Oof_Magic on Banlist Open Discussion

1 month ago

SynergyBuild I’d sooner see KCI than Second Sunrise unbanned. Most are aware of how infamously long Eggs turns we’re back in the day (when Eggs didn’t even run KCI). Many forget that it wasn’t uncommon to be going off on turn 2-3 with Sunrise.

Safe unbans would include:

Blazing Shoal

Field of the Dead

Mycosynth Lattice

Punishing Fire

Splinter Twin

Tibalt's Trickery

After that you have the tier of discussion, cards which are probably not safe but warrant investigation and testing. These would be:

Birthing Pod

Golgari Grave-Troll OR Bridge from Below

Oko, Thief of Crowns

Umezawa's Jitte

I’m not saying this second listed section is safe to unban. I am saying that I could see the format work it’s way to a point where these could be unbanned.

SynergyBuild on Banlist Open Discussion

1 month ago

I'd say since KCI was banned I would imagine Second Sunrise to be able to return.

Outside of this since we have seen the previous Jace and Stoneforge unmanned the next card I'd say fit that would be Splinter Twin.

I wouldn't make any other bets or assumptions

Icbrgr on Banlist Open Discussion

1 month ago

I watch a podcast from The MMcast discussing this subject... there talking points about Second Sunrise was particularly interesting in my opinion.... basically stated that in a large tournament where time is such a factor is the reason why it should stay banned however in smaller tournaments or if things went digital/automated it could probably come off.

sergiodelrio on Banlist Open Discussion

1 month ago

Hello fellow Planeswalkers. I made this thread so we can discuss the cards currently on the Modern banlist (SEE BOTTOM OF POST) and look if there may be candidates for unbanning, since it has been a while since something moved off the list.

I'm one of those crazy people that wants to live in a world where Mental Misstep and Gitaxian Probe are legal, but I see how that's not realistic whatsoever, so I won't talk about here. Let's have this discussion to be about REALISTIC, reasonable and safe unbannings.

Here are my candidates:

Deathrite Shaman - With all the easy cheap removal and grave hate in the format plus the general push of power level in the recent years, is this really a big deal anymore? Not even sure Jund wants it anymore. Since this doesn't enable a game winning combo or lockout on the spot, I think it deserves a second chance.

Artifact land cycle ala Ancient Den. So, they even injected another 10 artifact lands - are those even being played much competitively? My gut is this was a probe to see if they indeed could unban the old artifact lands. Artifact removal is much more available these days and the old artifact lands don't even come with indestructible sooo...

Rite of Flame - but Sergio! Fast mana is broken. Yes indeed. But they did ban Simian Spirit Guide and hear my out why Rite of Flame is weaker. SSG does not require you to play or a mountain to activate, Rite does and even costs a mana to begin with. SSG has a secondary feature being a creature and can be cast at a reasonable cost of 3 mana. Rite doesn't have that. Since they took Mox Opal and SSG, I think Rite of Flame might deserve a chance as a weaker substitution.

Please tell me what you think about that and/or show me your argumenst for other unbannings that you can see happening.


Ancient Den

Arcum's Astrolabe

Birthing Pod

Blazing Shoal

Bridge from Below

Chrome Mox

Cloudpost

Dark Depths

Deathrite Shaman

Dig Through Time

Dread Return

Eye of Ugin

Faithless Looting

Field of the Dead

Gitaxian Probe

Glimpse of Nature

Golgari Grave-Troll

Great Furnace

Green Sun's Zenith

Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis

Hypergenesis

Krark-Clan Ironworks

Mental Misstep

Mox Opal

Mycosynth Lattice

Mystic Sanctuary

Oko, Thief of Crowns

Once Upon a Time

Ponder

Preordain

Punishing Fire

Rite of Flame

Seat of the Synod

Second Sunrise

Seething Song

Sensei's Divining Top

Simian Spirit Guide

Skullclamp

Splinter Twin

Summer Bloom

Tibalt's Trickery

Treasure Cruise

Tree of Tales

Umezawa's Jitte

Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath

Vault of Whispers

Masterful on Necronomicon | Teysa Karlov | Primer

1 month ago

kirbysan Housegheist Just found time to release the update where I briefly go over these. Curse of the Restless Dead makes tokens too slowly. While ideally it can make a bunch in one turn with fetchlands + Second Sunrise, that's too specific of a situation. Mostly, it'll be making 1-2 tokens per turn, which isn't ideal as a non-death-trigger.

I don't think geistcatcher compares favorably to Nightmare Shepherd or Luminous Broodmoth. Its a one-time effect instead of providing repeated value every time like shepherd or broodmoth. This means its potential is a lot lower.

kirbysan on Necronomicon | Teysa Karlov | Primer

1 month ago

Masterful Thoughts on Curse of the Restless Dead? Seems like your pod goes heavy on ramp so this could be an interesting card. You could also just enchant yourself and save your Brought Back or Second Sunrise to fill up your board.

Peoyogon on Odric lunarch marshal deck

1 month ago

I really like the unique, tribal-focus you went with; I don't think I've ever seen that with Odric at the helm!

I've been wrecked by an Archangel of Thune many, many times and it seems like it could do some serious work here too! If Odric is out, Archangel would give all your creatures lifelink and could make some serious +1+1 counters!

Do you have issues with sweepers/board wipes? I play a lot of creature-based decks and that's always a hurdle I encounter. If you do, Cauldron of Souls, Faith's Reward, or Second Sunrise could help save your creatures!

Your deck also looks amazing how it is though! I figured I would put out some ideas, in case they were interesting :)

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