Destroy target creature or planeswalker.
|Have (2)||PostContact , metalmagic|
|Want (9)||Cactusman , Kavex , OneRudeChild , astacy1993 , Blackswordsman123 , Asfael , JazzCrimes , manweb , wolfboy245|
Printings View all
|Promo Set (000)||Rare|
Combos Browse all
|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Hero's Downfall occurrence in decks from the last year
All decks: 0.04%
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.06%
UB (Dimir): 1.14%
Hero's Downfall Discussion
4 days ago
You are going to need more than 12 lands. Whenever I build a deck, I always start with 40 lands and then for every 3 pieces of ramp, which for a mono black deck would be a mana rock or swamp doubler or ritual spell like Dark Ritual, I remove a land.
Please retune the deck with 12 non-land mana sources and 36 swamps for starters and you can think of non-swamp lands you want to include later.
My suggestions for those sources are any 12 of the following, depending on your budget:
Songs of the Damned
Cabal Coffers <- could replace a swamp
Pristine Talisman <- defiantly want that
After that you've got the commander, which takes up 1 card slot, so that leaves you with 51 cards to choose from.
I see the bare beginnings of either an aristocrats or a reanimator deck. In my opinion you should push more for aristocrats. It can draw you tons of cards and gain you quite a lot of life. There's no harm in keeping some reanimation spells in there though.
You want a good number of sacrifice outlets. I haven't heard of what a hard number should be so I'd shoot for at least 5. Here's a list of some that I remember off hand:
Infernal Tribute <- has a funny synergy with Spine of Ish Sah
Altar of Dementia
Disciple of Griselbrand
Lampad of Death's Vigil
For this strategy you'll need recurring creatures or token generators
Bridge from Below
Open the Graves
Blood Artist is a staple
Plunge into Darkness is something you might want for the pure lifegain of 3 per creature you sacrifice. Not sure that you want to use the "exile a bunch of your deck" too often.
Shadows of the Past
and so forth. I'd look through some already built aristocrats decks to see exactly whether you want to take that strategy.
Oh yeah, for utility lands I'd choose any of the following within your price range:
Geier Reach Sanitarium
5 days ago
Really nice deck. Just a quick question, why Hero's Downfall over Murderous Rider? I tend to think that having access to the body afterwards makes Rider the better of the two cards, but maybe I’m just wrong?
2 weeks ago
2 weeks ago
Alright, I have some suggestions. Now, never have I dipped in the complot of nocent life-gain, but I do see some follies withal the current decklist.
So, ramp and card draw are necessities of any commander strategy. I typically play decks that dump their hands aggressively, thus I have far more draw than normal. Around 34 slots grant me card advantage and 11 slots are for ramp. Here, you have four cards of ramp and five cards of draw. Granted, one of the draw engines is your commander, but that's six-mana afore it does so.
Furthermore, there are plenty of cards in here that just lack reach. Ajani's Sunstriker is horrid to draw turn 8 and onwards. It may be aggressive betime in the match, yet it is outclassed far too quickly.
So, what I'd cut due to card quality: Agent of Masks, Ajani's Sunstriker, Drana's Emissary, Fog Bank, Goldenglow Moth, Grim Guardian, Night Market Lookout, Oreskos Sun Guide, Pride Guardian, Servant of Tymaret, Wall of Essence, Elixir of Immortality, Fountain of Renewal, Narrow Escape, Spell Pierce, and Mana Leak.
Alright, same drill but I wish to offer some substantiation afore I denunciate these.
Coastal Piracy is a very potent card in decks possessing cheap, evasive creatures. This deck does not, thence I would advise ablating it; merely too inutile.
Sinister Possession and Stab Wound, no matter how much I love the Wound, are easily removed. A sacrifice outlet just negates this effect. The Possession in particular doesn't seem to do anything against certain creatures. Chainer, Dementia Master or Oracle of Mul Daya just don't oft attack or block. Even if, it is a mere two damage. Sure, it may stack quickly, but there are better ways to do so.
Condescend is just outclassed so quickly. Counterspells above two mana must do something potent, and this is potentially more. Scrying 2 is fine, but that also doesn't do much.
Dismiss into Dream is sweet, but this deck cannot deem to hent much from it.
Lovely! Now upon what I would add.
Given that the curve is rather high, I'd add Pristine Talisman; Arcane Signet; the talismans of dominance, progress, and hierarchy; Orzhov, Azorius, and Dimir signet; Mind Stone; and Worn Powerstone. This should grant you later plays far earlier in any match.
Unto thee, benison in card draw. Painful Truths is one I much enjoy. Sign in Blood or Night's Whisper are cheap and efficient. Phyrexian Arena and Underworld Connections go in quite a few decks. Well of Lost Dreams is just splendid. Fact or Fiction is never bad. Dawn of Hope is slow but on-theme. Erebos, God of the Dead seems all too perfect due to its static and activated abilities. Dream Trawler is awfully enticing for gameplans such as this. Lastly, Unfulfilled Desires is a hidden gem that I play in any deck that produces blue and black mana.
Of course, just some efficient engines and finishers. Debt to the Deathless and Exsanguinate are each nocent once resolved. K'rrik, Son of Yawgmoth could also be fine, but lacking depending on your hand, for it cares only if the cost is black. Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord fetches fallen utility creatures from the yard and proffers much in life-gain. Aetherflux Reservoir does much in murdering everyone, too.
I'd recommend some more wraths in this deck. Fumigate is perfect, Merciless Eviction or Austere Command deal with those pesky artifacts efficiently, Elspeth, Sun's Champion is never bad, Supreme Verdict is fine though pricey, or Kaya's Wrath is always lovely. Take your pick.
Okay, now for some other upgrades on the basics of the deck. Swords to Plowshares, Path to Exile, Abolish, Return to Dust, Murderous Rider, Anguished Unmaking, Despark, Hero's Downfall, Reality Shift, Generous Gift, Pongify, Rapid Hybridization, and Heliod's Intervention all remove permanents efficiently and at instant speed. Vindicate is fine but a sorcery.
Finally, some more life gain payoffs as consideration: Authority of the Consuls has oft shut down my strategies, Ajani's Pridemate gets far too large, Blind Obedience does something similar, Divinity of Pride and Serra Ascendant are giant threats in their own right, Bloodthirsty Aerialist does the same, Propaganda and Ghostly Prison make opponents pay to deal damage, Soul Warden and Soul's Attendant are early drops that allow for quite a bit of life to be gained, Archangel of Thune is always potent, Vona, Butcher of Magan is spicey, Angel of Vitality bolsters your engine, Boon Reflection doubles it, Twilight Prophet can get out of hand, Beacon of Immortality puts you heavensly ahead, Ajani, Strength of the Pride can win games on its own, and Felidar Sovereign demands an immediate answer.
That's all from me! Have a lovely day.
Thank you and farewell.
4 weeks ago
First, Vona can’t be used in response to a planeswalker because she has to be used on her controllers turn, but for the sake of the example it could be a Hero's Downfall...the question you’re asking is whether the planeswalker is a legal target or not after it has used its ultimate and removed all the loyalty counters.
Once per turn as a sorcery you can activate your walker. Like activating any other ability, you pay the cost after declaring your intention to cast and any relevant targets (none in this case,) and then you put it on the stack. This object now exists independently of its source so whether you destroy Bolas with Hero's Downfall or he’s put in the graveyard as a state based action or having no loyalty counters on him, it doesn’t matter because the ability resolves (Again unless there are targets which in this case there are not.)
1 month ago
Ah, I have piloted a mono-black discard deck for quite the number of years. I have Chainer, Dementia Master at the helm myself, as he is a rather powerful card when everyone's hands are empty, thus he reigns unanswered. Therefrom, a great amount of methods may be used to win.
Tinybones is less of a finisher itself, more so a value engine. As such, I would recommend possessing a lower curve to take advantage of the card draw and more potent finishers within the deck to hent for victory. Also, having card draw outside of the commander would grant a better backup plan. A discard deck's goal is to empty each opponent's hand and win by going unthreatened. If no players have cards to discard, Tinybones cannot provide draw.
The changes I would make are more instants so you kill things once they resolve as opposed to waiting a full turn, swifter discard in the early game to make your commander more effective, stronger finishers for the sake of ending the game betime, and just cutting some cards.
So, first, there are some things I would remove.
- Murderous Compulsion may go with the discard theme, but it's conditional removal at sorcery-speed.
- Bad Deal is ironically a bad deal, as it is six mana for two cards gone.
- Assassin's Strike is just egregious. A six-mana sorcery to kill one thing and they discard but one card. Begone.
- Unnerve is fine but not great. Being a one time effect at four mana, I dislike it, though Xantcha is a great character in the art.
- Haunting Hymn is six mana, which is far too late for discard effects to be effective. You want discard early, as it makes it far more difficult for decks to catch their footing.
- I have the same reason for Tasigur's Cruelty.
- Cabal Conditioning has an identical reason.
- I have a shortlist for this category, being creatures without long-game value; Burglar Rat, Liliana's Reaver, and Banshee of the Dread Choir have discard stapled to them, but don't do much else whilst lacking much in terms of evasion for Larceny.
- Scythe Specter is slow and other cards just do its job better, and Herald of Anguish is slow and lacks fodder for its second ability.
- Necrogen Spellbomb is just crap. Two mana for one card from a single player's hand is awful. Don't play this.
- Awaken the Erstwhile neglects the game plan of having more cards than your opponents whilst lacking the option of going back. I'd just add a stronger finisher.
Alright. With that out of the way, I may suggest other cards.
Upon card draw, you have none outside of the Trinket Thief, Rankle, and Geth's Grimoire. I'd add any of Phyrexian Arena, Sign in Blood, Underworld Connections, and Dread Presence. Necropotence may seem as if it negates the strategy, but it is always worth it.
Lightning Greaves just seem great.
Now, for the finishers I have many. Do note that these are meant to be played when people haven't any cards in hand, hence lacking answers for these once on the field. Sheoldred, the Whispering One grants value from each player's bin whiles eating at their board. Abhorrent Overlord offers a swarm of flyers to end the game. Grave Titan is much the same. Archfiend of Despair goes well with Tinybones's second ability. Though I am not too fond of it, Archfiend of Spite offers much. Geth, Lord of the Vault hents the opponent's graveyards to swarm the board. Kokusho, the Evening Star is a massive threat that harms upon death. Kothophed allows for a quite a bit of card draw. Lord of the Void is always fun. Lastly, Gray Merchant of Asphodel does so much every time it hits the field.
Of course, I'd add more ramp and reanimation. Mind Stone, Arcane Signet, Charcoal Diamond, and Lake of the Dead are great for ramp. Animate Dead, Reanimate, and Dread Return are fine ways to get stuff from anyone's yard, save for the Return.
That shall be all from me. Do enjoy your day!
1 month ago
mikeywayne08 Hello fellow control mage. Just gonna give my 2 cents regarding the deck.
With your Mill package you are inadvertently helping Dimir Inverter decks reach their win condition with Thassa's Oracle and Jace, Wielder of Mysteries and is personally too slow. Plus will help fuel Escape cards like Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath and Delirium strategies. You also do not have much of a finisher outside Doom Whisperer. There is some synergy yes but take that out of the equation and you have a shell.
Having 4x Drown in the Loch feels very awkward especially if you have in your opening hand and the graveyard isnt stacked in the early game. Would suggest to drop down to 2x. Eliminate coming in from M21 does a good imitation of Abrupt Decay plus lines up quite well against decks based on Lurrus of the Dream-Den.
Fatal Push should be one of the premier cheap removal options in the deck against aggressive strategies. This may be more of a personal opinion but Hero's Downfall might be better than Murderous Rider just for the life loss. More of personal preference in that regard.
For creatures The Scarab God feels like a must have for raw power. Even a single copy would swing the game around to your favor, being difficult to remove from the game and the ability to steal a creature from the yard. Torrential Gearhulk as a flash, large body with great synergy with Dig Through Time and Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet to combat the graveyard are some creature options I can recommend to try out and see how they feel.
Hope this somehow helps you in giving you ideas on what to change and for your next approach to your deck :)