|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Dragon's Maze (DGM)||Uncommon|
Combos Browse all
Give / Take
Put three +1/+1 counters on target creature.
Remove all +1/+1 counters from target creature you control. Draw that many cards.
Fuse (You may cast one or both halves of this card from your hand.)
Give / Take Discussion
2 months ago
5 months ago
I see! I missed that obvious ETB interaction.
- If Toothy is at no counters, Give + Pir (or Scales) puts 4 counters on Toothy. Then Take removes those 4 counters and you draw 4. Each draw adds 2 counters, so Toothy is left with 8 counters, right?
- If Toothy starts with 3 counters, Give + Pir (or Scales) add 4 more counters. Then Take removes 7 and you draw 7. Toothy is left with 14 counters.
- If both Pir AND Scales are out, and Toothy starts with no counters: Give + Pir + Scales add 5 counters (right?). Take removes 5 and you draw 5. Each draw adds 3 counters to Toothy, who ends up with 15 counters!?
7 months ago
Klazen: As Foretold is now on my radar for sure. While it does take some time to get going, this represents an interactive instant with, say, just 2 counters, during other players turns, let alone casting free things with more counters. This is probably among the best 3-CMC mana sources for this kind of strategy and might actually be better than Astral Cornucopia.
Give / Take is another card I have looked at but am not totally sold on. Take is the obviously exciting side, which would be used with Toothy most of the time, triggering Toothy with the draws to replace all the counters almost immediately. However, Give (or fusing Give with Take) is a little underwhelming for three extra mana, however, as there are better spells for distributing counters. Crucially, the effect of Take on Toothy can be replicated (for instance with Repudiate / Replicate itself) simply by cloning Toothy. If this were another Simic +1/+1 counters deck, I could justify including Give / Take, but this particular interaction between Toothy and clones means that I would rather have the flexibility of a clone instead of a narrower card such as this.
TheNocholas: Yes! War of the Spark (with proliferate and loyalty counters abound) could be even better for this particular deck than Ravnica Allegiance was. Already I want to play with Merfolk Skydiver , Neoform , Karn's Bastion , and the Landfall -- Proliferate elf, and some other cards, including the planeswalkers, are good candidates as well. Looking forward to seeing what else is announced for this set.
channelfireball12345: I do notice this card whenever I am looking for a cut. Bond Beetle is a good suggestion, and as I was looking into getting one, WAR is already providing a strictly better Ironshell in "Pollenbright Druid" (and the even spicier Merfolk Skydiver at the same CMC). Another alternative is Elvish Visionary or the new Fblthp, the Lost if I'm finding the main purpose of the beetle is to put the counter on Toothy. The reason I included this card is because Ironshell Beetle's original printing was in the first magic deck I ever owned, given to me as a gift, and I happened to collect the card in this deck at a GRN draft. The beetle will definitely be cut for something from WAR once it drops.
7 months ago
This is a very cool deck, you've built. I built out a Pir and Toothy deck as a per-cursor deck to my deck, Mad Science. You've got a lot of the same cards and abuses of counter creation built in ( Astral Cornucopia + Power Conduit types of things), and I love it! One thing I actually didn't think to do was put in level up creatures, but that's a nice touch! Out of curiosity, did you ever consider As Foretold ? I'm curious what you think about that card in a deck like yours. I get that you don't have too many huge mana cost spells, but a free one each turn would be nice if you're drawing tons of cards with Toothy.
Another card I really love for your deck is Give / Take , and I don't even hesitate to suggest that one, like I do with As Foretold. If you can cast both halves of it, it gives you the ability to draw cards off of Toothy without his needing to die, and then to power him back up again to a 5/5 (if Pir is also on the board). Alternatively, you can power Toothy up even higher with the 'Give' half, and then remove the counters to draw even more cards. If you can't cast both halves of it, it's still a nice card for early-mid game, and you choose which effect is most useful. It's a fantastic card with those two commanders as it has synergy with either/both of them.
7 months ago
9 months ago
Since Simic Ascendancy doesn't need the counters to stick, I could see Give / Take working as a solid way of drawing cards here.
9 months ago
9 months ago
LupineShadow, you make some good points, especially in the since that Protean Hydra is a counter engine that replaces its own counters when I use them for something. It's just that from my perspective, I don't have enough counter coffers to really feel the need to put in Protean over something I already have. In addition, a couple of my counter coffers let me draw, which I can use on Toothy and replace his counters, and in the case of Give / Take , even more. It isn't so much as he doesn't do the trick as much as I already have something close enough and makes room for something else. It is a great card though, and as I get some more games against my pals down the line, I might end up swapping him in, who knows?
Also, in my Simic Manipulator's defense: I'm only expecting Evolve to trigger once or twice on him on average, since he does get 2 counters from each trigger with Pir down (though sometimes 3 triggers happen too), I have quite a few cards that can grant extra counters or even double them, and that's when you can practically steal anything. You are right though, it is a mid-game style card, even in this counter-craze deck, but taking commanders can really swing games.
Give / Take occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.0%