Necronomicon | Teysa Karlov | Primer
Commander / EDH
SCORE: 375 | 432 COMMENTS | 113720 VIEWS | IN 169 FOLDERS
Modern Horizons 2 —June 4, 2021
EDIT: Reuploaded to fix formatting
MH2 Adds a ton of great new cards to the format. For Teysa and aristocrats, we have a few new toys. I'm also making some changes to refine the deck further, including some cards that I think I should've been playing before, and cutting some cards that are too redundant.
IN
- Urza's Saga: This thing goes in every deck with skullclamp. It's a land that ramps on its third turn into Sol Ring or Mana Crypt, or it grabs Skullclamp if we need more draw. For a land slot, that's pretty good. It can also generate creature's in a pinch if we need sac-fodder.
- Nested Shambler: It's a Hunted Witness that makes another token if we Skullclamp it, so regardless of the tokens coming in tapped, it's now our best 1 mana fodder piece. Just don't forget that it won't work with Toxic Deluge.
- Vanishing Verse: This is a card I underestimated from Strixhaven. It's 2 mana, it exiles, and it can target any monocolored permanent which make up the majority of threats you'll have to deal with. While it can't target artifacts or most commanders, it's about as efficient as it gets in orzhov for 2 mana. I like it more than Despark, Final Payment, Dire Tactics, etc.
- Spawning Pit *list*: It's a sac outlet that's harder to remove than a creature yet also makes creatures, similar to Bastion of Remembrance. This'll be our 5th non-Razaketh repeatable sac outlet, which feels more comfortable compared to 4.
- Stoneforge Mystic: I'm finally putting her in to smooth out our card draw package a bit more. Even though she only tutors for Skullclamp, that's powerful enough, and she's at least a creature if our skullclamp is already out or unobtainable.
OUT
- Generous Gift: I like vanishing verse better. I'd rather have the option of tutoring for a 2-mana removal spell than having both of my targeted-permanent removal be 3-mana.
- Victimize: I like playing more proactive cards than this. If we had more ways of putting Razaketh, the Foulblooded into the graveyard, it'd be better, but right now it's not the best. Bringing back two creatures for value reactively isn't what I want to spend a card slot on.
- Dictate of Erebos: I don't think we need both this and Grave Pact. We can still tutor for grave pact if we need that effect, but having both often means having these clunky enchantments stuck in hand more often.
- Ministrant of Obligation: I like Nested Shambler more. Its 2 less mana and can generate the same amount of tokens if Skullclamp'd.
- Blinkmoth Nexus: Urza's Saga is ultimately stronger. It provides the same creature-utility as blinkmoth while also being able to generate more mana and fetch Skullclamp
Omitted Cards
Here are some of the things I thought were cool but didn't make the cut.
- Esper Sentinel: I'm still a bit on the fence about this card. It's not as consistent as any of our current draw engines, but it's tutor-able with Ranger of Eos. Ultimately, since we have no way to buff its power, it won't be good lategame.
- Solitude: I like how it's a creature, but 2-for-1'ing ourselves to plow something isn't great. I'd probably play Path to Exile before this.
- Damn: This is a strong wipe since it's strictly better than Wrath of God, but I like our current wipes more. Toxic Deluge is more efficient, Living Death doubles as a reanimation spell, and Tragic Arrogance hits artifacts and enchantments. It's definitely solid, so I wouldn't blame anyone for playing it.
- Dauthi Voidwalker: If we need grave-hate, this is probably the best thing we could play. It's a creature, it only hozes opponents, and it can cast a free thing later on. However, I dislike playing cards like these by default since they can make the game very unfun for opponents who aren't necessarily doing broken things.
This is a great set, and while it doesn't have a ton of inclusions for our deck, not many sets will. The inclusion of Urza's Saga and Stoneforge Mystic will make the deck feel smoother, and the other updates will improve the deck's performance. If there are any cards you think I forgot to include, anything you think I misunderstood, or if you have a question, make sure to leave a comment. I'll respond to every comment eventually, but sometimes it can take a few days to a week.
Hi :)
Solemn Simulacrum out ? I don't think it's a good idea... Keeper of the Accord is strong (I am also testing this card in my Teysa Karlov) but different...
I play Solemn Simulacrum , I have a land and if Murder , I can draw 1 or 2 cards. I play Keeper of the Accord , and if Murder .... nothing (but ok, can be better if the card stays on the board... or no, depend of the board)
About Monologue Tax , it's more efficient than you think... I think. Cost less than Smothering Tithe , you will have less treasure, but enough for an Avg. CMC deck of 2.85
(that's only my opinion, can be wrong ^^)
My Teysa deck list : Teysa Karlov Aristocrate
April 24, 2021 4:29 a.m.
Hey Masterful! Hope all is well. Just wanted to check in here to see if there are any Strixhaven cards you think would go well in Teysa? I saw there are some new cards added into your list. I imagine you are still working on making your update post, but figured i'd see what are some of the cards you cut and what cards you added in. I'm seeing Brought Back , Second Sunrise , Keeper of the Accord and a few others in your list now - which I was thinking of adding as well! Would love to hear what cards you cut as well.
Also, any thoughts on Valentin, Dean of the Vein Flip??
April 25, 2021 9:13 p.m.
Disregard my last question - i forgot Valentin had a backside that was green lol. Cheers!
April 25, 2021 9:14 p.m.
Actually, I just saw your most recent posts! Thanks as always for the in-depth details!
April 26, 2021 5:50 p.m.
Khyheauts I've found Solemn Simulacrum to be too slow combined with having a low ceiling. His advantage is his consistency, but only generating 1 land plus up to 2 cards drawn is too little for 4 mana. The other ramp cards I included with this update are more versatile while also having higher ceilings. Brought Back and Second Sunrise both can give us up to 2 lands and double as creature recursion, Keeper of the Accord can generate a ton of tokens and lands, etc. Sure, Keeper doesn't draw cards if he's instantly killed, but it's not too common that people spend their removal on a ramp creature. While I don't play solemn in the list anymore, I do still think its a good card for the strategy. I just no longer have a place for him in this deck in particular. If you find a lot of success with him in your list, keep playing him.
As for Monologue Tax , I'm still testing it out. It hasn't amazed me so far, but I've been trying to include it in other decks to get a feel for how good it is. Thanks for dropping a comment. Your list looks really fun. I like how your curve tops off at 2.62. That must make for a smooth early game.
cfost827 Sometimes tappedout shows an outdated version of the page. I'm not sure why, but that may have been why you didn't see the update initially. If Valentin, Dean of the Vein Flip was in our colors, it would be interesting. He wouldn't double-trigger off of Teysa since you can't exile their creature twice, but as a single creature, he could make a lot of tokens. Cheers!
April 30, 2021 2:52 a.m.
Hi Masterful,
Just wanted to see how the play testing has been going with some of your new additions such as Archaeomancer's Map , Second Sunrise , Brought Back , etc.
I'm a bit skeptical about Second Sunrise and Brought Back but think they could both still work. I mean it's a lot of setup and even with running a lot of fetches, I wouldn't consider them to be "ramp" spells. Things usually don't always seem to work out perfectly in EDH. However, I would like to see if you have success with using them. Also, has Archaeomancer's Map seen any success? I'll keep an eye out for your feedback.
Additionally, for ramp, while it sucks sometimes to rely on mana rocks..it's sometimes the sacrifice one must make for playing 2 colors haha. But i was thinking about Marble Diamond and Charcoal Diamond , etc. Those could also be used as ramp instead.
Lastly, any thoughts on Dawn Charm ? It's actually a crazy versatile card to add into any deck with white.
But anyways, thanks again for all your knowledge and I'll keep an eye out for your feedback :)
April 30, 2021 12:43 p.m.
cfost827 Archaeomancer's Map has been strong so far. It's good against green ramp, smooths out early turns, and can turn iffy hands into good ones. I haven't had a turn or game where I was unhappy to see it in my hand yet. As for Second Sunrise and Brought Back , they're not as inconsistent as they may seem. I ran the numbers in a card probability calculator, and we have about a 60% chance of drawing a fetchland by turn 2. At that rate, we can play BB as a stronger Rampant Growth on curve. However, if we get a bit luckier, we could double Rampant Growth on turn 2 for untapped dual lands at instant speed. Since they both also double as recursion, they're super strong with aristocrats. So yes, they aren't as consistent as 2 mana rocks, but they provide a much higher ceiling combined with versatility. We're also not hurting in terms of the amount of ramp we have. Some of our ramp might be a bit conditional, like BB, SS, Knight of the White Orchid , etc. but we have access to 13 pieces plus additional sources of mana in the form of Pawn of Ulamog , Ashnod's Altar , Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx , etc. I'd play Coldsteel Heart , Marble Diamond , and/or Charcoal Diamond if I felt we needed more consistent or more early ramp. In testing though, SS, BB, and the ramp package as a whole proved consistent enough.
Dawn Charm is a good card. I could see it being good against certain decks or strategies. If any of the modes are something you frequently find yourself needing, I'd play it. I haven't found myself needing a fog or that type of counterspell very often myself, but if you play in a combat heavy meta or against a player who loves to target you for graveyard hate, it could be useful. Another similar card which you might want to consider is Orim's Chant . It's also good against players who like to target you with spells or in combat. I play it in some lists and find it to be a great political tool by saying, "Hey, you better agree not to screw with me this turn, or I'll skip your whole turn basically."
April 30, 2021 9:25 p.m.
Ok, make sense, you have fetchlands, not me, so Brought Back is more than ok. And I just receive my Monologue Tax and I will test the card instead of Smothering Tithe , just to have a less average CCM :)
Yes my deck is fun to play, nice early game, but was hard to cut cards like Cavalier of Night or Requiem Angel , but it's working well.
May 1, 2021 2:42 p.m.
Hey Masterful! Hope all is well and your play testing is continuing to be successful.
Just had a few thoughts on other cards to add/cut. Have you ever tried running Kokusho, the Evening Star or Yosei, the Morning Star ? I feel like they are even better than Vilis, Broker of Blood in this deck (I know you just cut him already). With Teysa on the field and getting their death trigger, it makes these two quite powerful. Recurring them would also be great great. I'm thinking of testing adding in one of them. Which of the two would you add if you wanted to/could ?
Additionally, what are your thoughts on Spawning Pit as a sac outlet? I feel like it could actually do pretty well in this deck, maybe in place of Carrion Feeder ? Would like to hear your thoughts on this card as it could just make us more tokens.
Thanks!
May 10, 2021 11:59 a.m.
Oh and lastly, what about Secure the Wastes ? I feel this card is great especially if you get your opponents to swing into the tokens, either just as defense or with an aristocrat out - as it's an Instant.
May 10, 2021 12:05 p.m.
cfost827 Secure the Wastes is pretty good. I've run it in the past, but I prefer my token-makers to be from death triggers. That way, there's potential to get a lot more tokens with Teysa for very little investment.
May 15, 2021 11:50 p.m.
Awesome, thanks!
Lastly, have you ever tried running Kokusho, the Evening Star or Yosei, the Morning Star ? I feel like they are even better than Vilis, Broker of Blood in this deck (I know you just cut him already). With Teysa on the field and getting their death trigger, it makes these two quite powerful. Recurring them would also be great great. I'm thinking of testing adding in one of them. Which of the two would you add if you wanted to/could ?
Additionally, what are your thoughts on Spawning Pit as a sac outlet? I feel like it could actually do pretty well in this deck, maybe in place of Carrion Feeder ? Would like to hear your thoughts on this card as it could just make us more tokens.
May 17, 2021 11:01 a.m.
cfost827 I played Kokusho, the Evening Star for a while, and he was strong when he hit the board, just slow. I ended up taking him out cause I wanted a faster curve. Yosei, the Morning Star was always too stax-ey for my liking. He would slow down games a lot, and it didn't seem fun, but he's definitely powerful. For power level, I'd add Yosei, but for fun, I'd add Kokusho. However, I find that the deck runs much smoother when we don't have 6 mana creatures.
I like Carrion Feeder mostly because its a creature. It can be tutored for with Ranger of Eos and Recruiter of the Guard and can be recurred. Spawning Pit is a good sac oulet though. It's only 2 mana and can provide tokens as we sac things. Victimize is probably what I'd replace since its not a great sac outlet, and I recently put in more recursion in the form of Brought Back and Second Sunrise .
Housegheist says... #1
Nice take on Teysa. She's my favourite card of all time as well. Upvote!
Maybe you wanna have a look on my take on Teysa, too
Death and wine
April 21, 2021 4:06 a.m.