ThaneGarrus Those are actually really good ideas. That package seems incredibly useful since ranger or recruiter can provide up to 3+ creatures for sacrifice fodder each, or they could fetch outlets. Hangarback was also something I've been considering for some time, and I think ranger would really push it into mainboard territory.

The problem is what to cut. I'm considering Deathrender since it might be a bit too narrow, Carrion Feeder since ranger would act as a second Viscera Seer anyways, Martial Coup or Living Death because we already have many ways to deal with creatures, and Teysa, Orzhov Scion as her abilities are quite restricted. I love the idea that I can recruiter for ranger, ranger for seer and doomed traveler, sac doomed traveler to get two tokens with Teysa, then sac all of them to get a billion death triggers. Also the fact that recruiter can tutor for card draw, ramp, sac outlets, and tokens makes him very hard to pass up.

I agree on Deathrender , Martial Coup and Living Death , but I like having a backup fetch in Carrion Feeder if viscera seer gets exiled or we don’t have a way to recur it. Teysa, Orzhov Scion is pretty restrictive to use outside of the combo with Darkest Hour

I was toying with the idea of Stoneforge Mystic , Sword of Light and Shadow (recursion/protection), Nim Deathmantle (combo potential) and Open the Armory since skullclamp is such a powerhouse Possibly cutting Mentor of the Meek

ThaneGarrus I'll have to test the ranger package with/without Carrion Feeder to see if the redundancy is worth it. As for this new package (you're very good at suggesting packages btw), Stoneforge Mystic and Open the Armory are certainly good for getting Skullclamp and the other artifacts you've mentioned. I would play this package if running Deathrender and Nim Deathmantle , but without them, the package is a bit thin. Personally, I'm against cards that are too narrow outside their combos even if they are fetchable by a package such as this (the same reason I don't like Darkest Hour ).

It might be worth mentioning that the package might be good enough just to search for Skullclamp since it's so powerful, but I'm edging on the side that it isn't quite there yet. With enough artifacts and obviously if you're already running deathmantle/deathrender, that package seems very worthwhile.

Mentor of the Meek has been on my radar for possible cuts as well. He just doesn't work as well into the engine the deck is trying to assemble.

I have made my own Teysa Karlov EDH/Commander deck, though I could use some critiques. I am banking on tokens and life gain as the main ideas with sac outlets strewn about the deck, here is the link if you would like to view it. Life After Death

literaturecult46 The deck looks good for the most part, but I do have some suggestions:

1. I'd replace Syndicate Guildmage and Beckon Apparition since their abilities are very low impact.

2. If you're sold on running the Glass of the Guildpact , Seal of the Guildpact , and Tome of the Guildpact , I'd run a lot more multicolored cards, especially creatures. Remember, afterlife tokens are multicolored, so they do work with glass.

3. If you're going for heavy lifegain, some cards to consider would be: Felidar Soverign, Gray Merchant of Asphodel , Kokusho, the Evening Star , Font of Agonies , Dawn of Hope , Kambal, Consul of Allocation , and Well of Lost Dreams .

4. Your curve is quite heavy on 4 cmc cards. This can be tough since Teysa is also 4 cmc, so in the early turns of the game, you might have a lot of 4 drops stuck in your hand.

If you'd like to ask any more specific questions, I'd love to give more specific advice.

Masterful Thanks for the critique, what would you suggest removing for the higher costing cards, and what is your take on my mana base as presented thus far?

literaturecult46 The mana base is looking good, though I'm pretty sure Cabal Stronghold isn't doing much with only 9 swamps. I wouldn't say its a very good replacement for coffers since its just so hard to activate. From my experience, mono black or very heavy black are the only decks that can support it.

If I had to rank your high cmc cards from best to worst in terms of impact, I'd do so in this order: Razaketh, the Foulblooded > Elspeth, Sun's Champion > Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite > Rune-Scarred Demon > Sheoldred, Whispering One > Ashen Rider > Sun Titan > Knight of the Last Breath > Pontiff of Blight . None of these are bad cards to play in this deck, I'm just ranking them on their impact relative to each other. Pontiff is very grindy and can stack a lot of drain over a long period of time, but it costs a ton of mana to pay for each extort trigger, and I'd personally rather cast more spells than pay for a bunch of extorts. Knight of Last Breath is just a bigger version of what other cards do, and it costs a lot more mana, so I'd replace at least those if you want the cmc of the deck to be lower.

I think this idea of pooling all possible good value cards in one place for this commander was an excellent idea. The convesations we are sharing will also be a whealth on knowledge in a couple of months from now.

I’m still researching different synergies in different toolboxes.

One entire category that should added in this knowledge pool is Anti-Graveyard Hate. GY hate is a huge weakness here. I know we are all focused on tokens, value, ramp, etc etc. But all it takes is one well timed Bojuka Bog or a Leyline of the Void and we are back to the Stone Age.

I also think an added category for bulk recursion strategies should also be added and discussed. Most of these would need to be planned around obviously, but I’m referring to spells like Lifeline , Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker , Endbringer's Revel / Soul of Innistrad , and the synergy between Mikaeus, the Unhallowed and Cauldron of Souls . Etc...

I know some of those previous recursion cards are kinda janky, but I was just mentioning them for the lower budget casual lists.

I also thought of Enduring Renewal and Yawgmoth's Will Immediately after I hit post.

These forms of mass recursion need to be discussed and analyzed for efficiency.

Effeciency is everything in these decks. Running this commander is basically a final exam on your Resource Management skills in MTG.

nickelphoenix I'm glad you brought up the point of graveyard hate. I added an entire section about it and how to better deal with it.

The recursion cards you mentioned are very interesting. Lifeline is a huge impact card that provide unlimited fuel to the engine, and I'm considering adding it to the deck. Another you've mentioned that sparked my interest is Cauldron of Souls . Free recursion is very good, especially when it allows our engine to keep running a lot longer. Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker and Mikaeus, the Unhallowed also give free recursion, but they only work with some of our cards. Nonetheless, they're quite good. Enduring Renewal is weird. It provides very good recursion but makes drawing creatures impossible. Yawgmoth's Will however, doesn't work well with any of our death triggers since it exiles them instead of letting them die, but it does get back our other cards for value.

Another one I just came across is Strands of Night .

Yes I had came across the Strands of Night

It’s expensive however unless we have Sun Titan , Crucible of Worlds , etc in play.

Still an interesting card, as it is recursion that opponents will definitely assess as a very low threat.

I know Elenda, Hangarback etc are all going to be strong staple cards. this next one is not really worth mentioning for most peoples meta. However if someone is considering the route of the “maximum” strategy with Teysa, Roc Egg is a cool death trigger that gives us nice flying 3/3 birds.

Again there is far better death trigger cards that will probably soon be known as “staples” that should be ran first.

Again since this thread is growing in popularity 6600+ views at the time I write this, I’m not expecting any of my suggestions to be included in the list above, I’m just looking to share some of the stuff I dredge up for the folks that are reading the comments.

So, it’s going to be hard to beat the raw value of Karmic Guide and Reveillark Especially, if we are focusing on Aristocracy. The burden of the “2 or less” is no big deal if we are packed heavy with Aristocrats.

However, what if we want to turn our attention on something a bit different? I’m not saying I’m personally going to go this route. I haven’t even begun drafting a list yet, because I’m still soaking in all avenues of potential with this commander.

I want to remind everybody of another more broad re-animation loop that can work on any creature not confined to power to “2 or less”.

Adarkar Valkyrie and the Thornbite Staff

I’m reminding everyone of this one first because it’s great if you have a sac outlet in play and happen to find your Kokusho, the Evening Star or Wurmcoil Engine

But wait, there is another Valkyrie like cat that is interesting here,

Whisper, Blood Liturgist

Hmm, the option to sac two tokens or token generators, to bring back a non-token DIRECTLY to PLAY! and then the option to rinse repeat? The permutations of how either of these with most cards I’m seeing in these lists can generate value or possibly go infinite is actually pretty bonkers.

My head is literally hurting from trying to visualize them.

Also, the Thornbite Staff plays nice with an MVP here Hangarback Walker and I’ve also seen it get pretty bat shit crazy when equipped on Ghoulcaller Gisa

nickelphoenix The Adarkar Valkyrie + Thornbite Staff combo you mentioned has potential. It's good for the reasons you mentioned above, but I personally won't be playing it because I dislike combo pieces that can't do anything on their own. Valkyrie by herself might be worth it just for her repeated reanimation. I've also experimented a little with Whisper, Blood Liturgist , and she provides good recursion albeit slow and easily disrupted. You're provided many great card suggestions, and I'll be adding them to the maybeboard.

In the ramp section of your main list I noticed Knight of the White Orchid . It’s a classic mono-white staple for ramp. Should be noted that Boreas Charger has a similar LTB. Now I get it’s tapped versus the knight untapped, but still if your a few land drops behind, two plains in play tapped and a bunch in hand ain’t too shabby. Thanks Teysa :)

nickelphoenix I've seen Boreas Charger before, and it seems very powerful if it dies early, but that might be difficult. The best time for ramp is turns 1-5 for this deck, and the consistency of pulling off charger during those turns is questionable. If it does go off though, with Teysa on board, it is very powerful ramp. It might be better than Burnished Hart , so I'll start testing it.

Masterful

Agreed, there are certainly better choices especially since black is involved.

I've been brewing with the new Teysa myself, though still haven't worked out the kinks. I like the list, but I've noticed something missing: Treasure Keeper . Now I understand with it you could lose a potential threat that costs more than 3 mana, but the value of this card cannot be overstated in decks with lower CMCs.

Another possibility could be Promise of Bunrei to get a massive amount of tokens.

Spirit Bonds may provide some added value considering Teysa's strategies leans more toward creature-heavy playstyles.

For some slower decks that are need of more recursion, Sigil of the New Dawn could be good to add to the PRIMER.

ShikiTen Yeah Treasure Keeper certainly is good in this deck with a lot of low cmc cards. It's comparable to Matter Reshaper . I'll add it to the maybeboard.

Now, I'm not a judge, but I'm pretty certain Promise of Bunrei doesn't actually work with Teysa. Similar to Academy Rector , you can only sacrifice it once, so you don't get 4 tokens from each trigger.

Spirit Bonds is a slower token generator/value card that's similar to Dawn of Hope which is good for some builds. Sigil of the New Dawn will find a home in the same kinds of decks. I'll add both to the maybeboard as well.

@Masterful Ah, I knew Academy Rector wouldn't work, I'm not sure why it didn't click that Promise of Bunrei wouldn't either. At least that makes slimming my deck down easier, heh.

I see you run Reassembling Skeleton , what are your thoughts on similar cards like Bloodghast or Nether Traitor ?

ShikiTen In my opinion, both Bloodghast and Nether Traitor are worse than Reassembling Skeleton due to their inconsistency. With skeleton, I can reanimate it whenever I want for 2 mana, but the others need a specific scenario in order to reanimate. I'd play traitor over bloodghast since bloodghast can only reanimate itself up to a few times a turn, but they're all viable though if you need more effects like these.

Old School, ... :)

Baron Sengir , Sengir Vampire , Krovikan Vampire , Soul Collector ,

Oops, cancel krovikan and soul collector, can’t steal a creature twice. Haha.

nickelphoenix In more casual groups this deck could totally be a home for them. Just because krovikan and soul collector can't steal two creatures per death doesn't mean they can't steal one ;)

Since she says tokens gain lifelink and vigilance did you think about couple of lords like Ravos, Soultender and Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite. (support lords) with all that tokens, these two would do nicely