Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
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Legality

Format Legality
1v1 Commander Legal
Arena Legal
Block Constructed Legal
Canadian Highlander Legal
Commander / EDH Legal
Commander: Rule 0 Legal
Duel Commander Legal
Gladiator Legal
Highlander Legal
Historic Legal
Legacy Legal
Leviathan Legal
Limited Legal
Modern Legal
Oathbreaker Legal
Vintage Legal
Casual Legal
Custom Legal
Quest Magic Legal

Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite

Legendary Creature — Phyrexian Praetor

Vigilance

Other creatures you control get +2/+2.

Creatures your opponents control get -2/-2.

Giriel on Karametra Hates You!

1 month ago

Maybe Avacyn, Angel of Hope could be for some use? It has high cmc, but if you play Kormus Bell + Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth + Wrath of God, instead of Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite you could still hold your lands.

TypicalTimmy on Will Lifeblood Hydra die if …

2 months ago

Enter The Battlefield is a trigger that goes on the stack. What happens is when something says "Enters the Battlefield", the game will check to see what conditions have been met, put that on the stack, and await to see if there are any responses and whether or not it resolves.

For example, if I have an Impact Tremors and I play a Hordeling Outburst, Impact Tremors is going to check to see if all three Goblins did in fact enter the battlefield, and further more if anything responds to it. I may have an opponent on their last legs who decides to use a Teferi's Protection in response, preventing Impact Tremors from dealing 3 damage to them - although Impact Tremors will still deal the damage to each other opponent, assuming we are playing EDH and I have multiple opponents.

However, State Based Actions do not use the stack. They occur automatically and can not be responded to. For example, suppose one of my other opponents happens to have out Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite. What happens?

My three 1/1 Goblins DO still enter the battlefield, and Impact Tremors WILL still see them entering the battlefield, however Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite will also give them all -2/-2.

They will, therefore, enter the battlefield as (technically) -1/-1. Because their toughness is 0 or lower, they will die.

  • NOTE: They do not "die"; This is a colloquial expression that many of us will use in the community. They are actually "moved to the graveyard" via state based actions. This is why dealing 5 damage to Thassa, God of the Sea with Crater's Claws won't kill her - she's Indestructible - but hitting her with -5/-5 via Toxic Deluge will. Indestructible prevents damage from being lethal, but having Toughness reduced to 0 circumvents that.

So, because State Based Actions are what's being done here, you don't get a chance to go "Wait, I cast Echoing Courage in response!"

There's nothing to respond to. State Based Actions don't go on the stack. The Goblins simply get moved to the graveyard as -1/-1s where, as tokens, they are subsequently then removed from the graveyard and the game, as another example of a State Based Action. (Not put in exile; Exile is a zone "outside of the game", within the game. It's... weird.)

Worx on Competitive Captain Sisay (Proven)

2 months ago

MstrCpr Thanks mate. It's been in the works a VERY long time and has won many many tournaments.

The Paradox Engine ban was at first a disaster, but now, I can still win turn 5-6 virtually all the time, and IF I get a good draw, then I can still win turn 4! ;)

I haven't made any notes for a long time and I really should update...

But to answer your questions regarding Vivien, Monsters' Advocate, Ashaya, Soul of the Wild, Ugin, the Spirit Dragon, and Eight-and-a-Half-Tails;

Let's just say that I am constantly tossing up whether to include Akroma's Memorial or not due to it's mana cost and the introduction of Crashing Drawbridge. I deliberately stay away from mana costs of non-creatures of higher than 4 so Gaddock Teeg is not an issue. So having a planeswalker of Vivien, with a cost of 5 with no real instant win - I just can't see it's value. Same with Ugin - just an overkill and horrendous cost of 8.

Ashaya is just to expensive for what it does. I mean I used to ALWAYS run the combo Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite and Kamahl, Fist of Krosa for win in removing opponents lands. But I also have a lot of wincons now so I just want to keep the mana costs down.

Eight Tails was a card I used to run, but I found I rarely needed it in Tournaments and if you are doing it only for removing opponents lands, then the above said Elesh Norn/Kamahl wins hands down.

The latest iteration and what I am working on is to ensure I can get the 'haste' out easily, ie Oswald Fiddlebender with artifact tutor so I can get Thousand-Year Elixir out, and then I can again remove Akroma's Memorial, and put back in Masako the Humorless

The deck has undergone a LOT of changes over the years, but still kicks butt and is VERY reliable. (I did sell some cards - mainly lands and foils - kicking myself over selling my foils of Selvala, Heart of the Wilds) So hat's why the lands don't seem 'stable'.

Thanks for commenting and the appreciation.

Guerric on Teysa, Orzhov Scion: Life and Death

4 months ago

Hi wideline1414! I've been playing Teysa for years, and have had at least three distinct variations of the deck. She's definitely one of my favorite commanders, and the version I'm playing now is very powerful whereas the second incarnation of the deck ended up playing terribly. I am working on writing a full primer for it, but I write very full and ambitious primers and I haven't quite got the time to commit to it yet. I think my biggest piece of advice is that Teysa can do a lot of things, but she can't do everything well, so you really need to focus on the way you want to play her. She can be a great honest token deck, an aggressive and powerful multi-combo deck, an aristocrats deck, or an orzhov goodstuff sort of deck, but she can only do one of these well.

The original version of the deck was a relaxed Orzhov control deck that focused mostly on generating white tokens and using Teysa's exile ability as a sort of threat to get people to leave me alone. I had the Darkest Hour in the deck as a way to win, but I didn't rush towards it, and I usually won via token pump cards like Jazal Goldmane and Mirror Entity. I also had lots of boardwipe and interaction that Orzhov is good with, as well as a bunch of token generating Elspeths, and it could grind out games real well. I really enjoyed the relaxed approach of the deck, but felt like I wasn't getting the most out of Teysa's ability since I didn't have a ton of black token generators, so I set about to rework it to get more value.

I started out well by adding Chittering Witch, Sengir Autocrat, Dreadhorde Invasion, and a bunch of other black token oriented cards. I still run these cards today. Where I went wrong was in stuffing way too many expensive good stuff cards like Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite and K'rrik, Son of Yawgmoth. My mana curve became accordingly less palatable, and I just found the deck was trying to do too many things to really get anywhere.

Third time's a charm as they say, so I cut most of the good stuff and pretty much all of the token pump support to lean more heavily into combo-control with a life-gain subtheme. The great thing about the Darkest Hour combo is that there are so many cards that support it that are also good on their own, so I made sure to have lots of sac outlets, a few aristocrats, Blasting Station, and both Ashnod's Altar and Phyrexian Altar to make infinite mana to power mass drain spells like Debt to the Deathless, Exsanguinate, and Torment of Hailfire. I also put the Reveillark/Karmic Guide combo in for another combo route. The deck can win without these cards by just draining people out, possibly with mana generated by Smothering Tithe and Pitiless Plunderer, but combos are the thing to go to. My favorite part about all previous versions of the deck were abusing Bolas's Citadel and Necropotence, so I added in the soul sisters, Daxos, Blessed by the Sun, and some other lifegain stuff to support this. The deck as is getting to the point where I won't play it as often with my playgroup because the win rate is getting pretty high.

I like the current version of the deck best, but you should do what is good for you. I'd just focus. If you want to care about attacking with spirit tokens, then by all means play Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite, Jazal Goldmane, and others. Just try to keep your curve low and have lots of token generators and sac outlets. In my first version of the deck I played most of the Elspeths, and even in the current one I still play Elspeth Tirel and Elspeth, Sun's Champion and they rock the house. If you want to lean into combo or aristocrats, you might want to play fewer of the above cards.

If you are interested in my current list, you can find it here- https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/teysa-combo-with-superfriends/?cb=1645410923. Hopefully in the next month or so I'll finally get to the primer! Until then, happy magic, and enjoy the best Teysa!

DawnsRayofLight on Target Acquired

4 months ago

One, maybe it would be funny to call the list Hinata-Kun XD

Control

Render Silent, Counterflux, Disallow for a bit more counter magic

Hullbreaker Horror: I have been really loving this card lately, it is expensive (CMC) but helps to keep control of the board

Opposition: works with Willbreaker and other cards I will suggest

Reality Shift, Fateful Absence, Generous Gift : spot removal

Malevolent Hermit  Flip: counterspell and protection

Teferi, Time Raveler, Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir, and Grand Abolisher protect your shennaigans

Drannith Magistrate: stop you oppnenets from casting their commanders

You could run Orbs with Urza and Opposition

Baral's Expertise

Supreme Verdict, Winds of Abandon, Wrath of God: Wipes

Blinkers

Brago, King Eternal

Deadeye Navigator

Eldrazi Displacer

Thassa, Deep-Dwelling: slow, but consistent

Blink Targets

Skyclave Apparition

Venser, Shaper Savant

Dockside Extortionist

Spellseeker: search your X spells

Cyberdrive Awakener: if you want to win off your rocks and treasure tokens

Draw

Whirlwind of Thought

Esper Sentinel

Sea Gate Restoration  Flip: may as well if you're playing blue

Shorikai, Genesis Engine: fun card, can be a win con between being an 8/8 beater and some combos involving Intruder Alarm

X spells

Distorting Wake

Mass Manipulation

Disorder in the Court: this can help for draw, protection, and "Blinking"

Smoke Spirits' Aid: I don't know if it fits, but could be spicy

Comet Storm

Call the Coppercoats

Combos

Deadeye Navigator/Eldrazi Displacer + Peregrine Drake = Infinite mana

Elsha, the Infinite/The Reality Chip + Sensei's Divining Top + Thassa's Oracle/AetherFlux

Hullbreaker Horror + Mana Crypt, Sol Ring, Mana Vault: Infinite bounce only need 2 rocks

Dockside Extortionist + Deadeye Navigator: can generate infinite mana

Grand Architect + Pili-Pala: Infinite color mana, only need a Blue to initiate, I would have at least 2 infinite mana combos with all the X spells

Synod Artificer (I wish Hinata worked for abilities + Swift Reconfiguration + Gilded Lotus = infinite mana

win cons (Outside of combos)

Metallurgic Summonings: you make big tokens and gives recursion.

Guttersnipe: ouch

Monastery Mentor: tokens

Shark Typhoon: tokens

Jin-Gitaxias, Progress Tyrant is made for this list

Urza, Lord High Artificer: can make use of a lot of artifact tokens that can be created in this list and can be an outlet for infinite mana to cast your deck

Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite: probably good if you run a lot of token producing cards like Saheeli, Sublime Artificer, Monastery Mentor, Shark Typhoon, Metallurgic Summonings, Manaform Hellkite, Talrand, Sky Summoner, Kykar, Wind's Fury

Other

Primal Amulet  Flip

Kykar, Wind's Fury

PsychicPanda on Maelstrom Wanderer Scapeshift

4 months ago

Forceofnature1 It's a lot of fun, I used to have the deck built with a bunch of extra turns, tooth and nail, and lots of cascades, but toned it down into this and my playgroup found it more fun. Note Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite is especially good against this deck.

Optimator on Alela

4 months ago

Since you're going so creature-heavy, you might be interested in Etchings of the Chosen. Should be amazing. Ethereal Absolution is a solid choice too, but kinda pricey (mana-wise). Still, getting a discounted Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite that makes a faerie is nice. Every deck needs a bit of graveyard hate.

AstroAA on [EDH][Primer] Sythis Enchantress Prison

4 months ago

Hello aisthetikos! Thank you for your comment!

That's a pretty nifty combo, albeit very mana-inefficient. I would personally much rather only pay the five mana for Nature's Revolt and either the four mana for Linvala, Keeper of Silence or the seven mana for Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite than an eight additional mana for Ezuri's Predation. Plus, with Ezuri's Predation, our opponents could save their stuff through the likes of Heroic Intervention or other methods of giving indestructible; Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite kills through indestructible, which is part of the reason as to why she is so good.

The only reason I run Craterhoof Behemoth is to act as a closer if I need to kill someone immediately. I've thought about cutting it before and am not against the prospect in the future. The deck itself doesn't run much recursion if we need to get something back, and it's a lot easier to get 40 damage to kill someone in a single turn than it is 70+ damage to mill someone out in a single turn - especially with this deck in regard to the fact that most of our creatures are 2/2's. If I were to mill someone out, it'd be using a method like Aluren + Whitemane Lion + Altar of the Brood. However, keep in mind - this is a deck designed to prevent our opponents from playing Magic, not a combo-oriented deck.

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