|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Modern Masters (MMA)||Rare|
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Tooth and Nail
Choose one --- Search your library for up to two creature cards, reveal them, put them into your hand, then shuffle your library; or put up to two creature cards from your hand into play.
Entwine (Choose both if you pay the entwine cost.)
|Have (2)||, Forkbeard|
|Want (6)||real_cool_jeff , uptonrt , SticeM , Geistlake , liquid_water , Rasputin0o7|
Tooth and Nail Discussion
12 minutes ago
I just noticed Regal Force says green creature so it doesn't even work with Kamahl, Fist of Krosa . Yes, he pulls weight for sure. I'd hate for you to make me tutor for a crucible of worlds every game :o
Tooth and Nail is that card that everyone loves and hates for similar reasons. I just thought it could help you get your wincons. I dont like craterhoof personally either, but I hope I'm not too big a schmuck by casting T&N 2-3 times in one turn. For me, my wincon is Boardstate into drawing into haste outlet like akroma's memorial or even untapping hall with temple sadly. I'm different.
Scavenging Ooze - I felt I gave a sufficient argument above but perhaps your experience has been different? This is the way I see it, in terms of numbers....
Scavenging ooze hurts your opponents some of the time: -2 (negative indicating hurting opponent) Another dedicated spell (one that synergizes with the deck) almost always helps your deck (depending on the spell) - Ex: +3
^ The difference between the 2 numbers is 1. Again, if you have felt ooze has been very useful for you, then the # would be higher, its subjective for sure. I just feel like there are times where you would almost always want something else unless your opponent is specifically playing from the grave or uses lots of recursion.
51 minutes ago
lol hey profet
I'm gonna go through my thoughts on each of the cards you mentioned
Khalni Heart Expedition - I'm just playing this card cuz it feels so RG Landfally (probs feel that cuz RG valakut plays it). I'm down to cut for something rad.
Tooth and Nail - This is a sweet one. I wanna try putting this card in Maelstrom Wanderer. Here though, I'm not as into it. I feel like in red green if you're not just going to get craterhoof you a schmuck and I don't really want to play crsaterhoof or be a schmuck.
Emrakul, the Promised End - Emrakul is not my best friend.
Scavenging Ooze facks people up. You're gonna half to give me a good reason to cut this.
Regal Force - Sigh. Unfortunately in this deck this is not a good enough reason. Because of field of the dead a lot of my creatures aren't green and if I'm untapping with Avenger of Zendikar and a bunch of plants, I'm probably winning the game anyway.
Shamanic Revelation - I'd play this before I'd play regal force because of black zombies and lack of interest in playing Tooth and Nail.
1 day ago
Yo P-Money, it's your local jew in your crew.
Cut Khalni heart for Tooth and Nail - While it can ramp you, assuming you play it T2, it takes a turn or 2 to activate it. Not bad, but I feel like finding bombs can be useful. Furthermore, you can look T&N with Greenwarden and E-wit.
Cut prismatic omen for Kamahl, Fist of Krosa - Tutorable with T&N, provides trample, wrath protection, make your lands creatures to become a wincon with oodles of extra mana with cradle and temple. I understand it can be part of your wincons but you haven't used it often enough, at least when I've vsed you.
Also, I can't stress anti wrath protection enough. IF you ever wanted, you could try to create a "soft protection" by adding asceticism. That way they can't kill Kamal (or another other important creature thru regen) and can't wrath the board because they will lose lands. There are exceptions and bypasses such sac effects like barter in blood, or even your BEST friend Emrakrul who doesn't like Witchbane Orb . Not that im suggesting either of the cards listed in this paragraph, but funny to mention.
Cut Scavenging Ooze for Regal Force /anything you want in your maybeboard. I know you LOVE your little (g)ooze (means fart in Farsi), but why not help your own game plan rather than hurt anothers? From the times you have played it, it has been weak, maybe some value here and there. As previously stated, getting help finding your wincons card draw is best through, Regal Force (tutorable with T&N), Shamanic Revelation (already in your maybeboard), and Zendikar's Roil . I believe Regal force should be swapped in because once you use T&N for Avenger + Regal, you draw a bunch. Assuming avenger is destroyed/unavailable, Kamahl can be used in response to the ETB trigger of Regal to draw cards.
1 day ago
The basic idea behind the deck is to get Emrakul, the Aeons Torn / Urabrask the Hidden out via Tooth and Nail and attack the same turn. TnN is wished for with Fae of Wishes . With Fires of Invention and 7 mana in play, I can essentially cast Fae and TnN (with entwine) on the same turn to win. Growth Spiral , Hour of Promise , Oracle of Mul Daya , and Search for Tomorrow can get me to 7 mana fairly quickly.
65 VIEWS | IN 1 FOLDER
2 days ago
3 days ago
@MindAblaze: For tokens: Oh.
For everything else, I love the Heartless Hidetsugu + Gisela, Blade of Goldnight Combo also. But to determine as to whether idea should exist over the other, I'll have to ask around about what of the 3 Trinket Epics would be the best choice for Bloom Tender ; POST-PARADOX ENGINE BAN.
Actually, I decided to put in Heartless Hidetsugu , Defense of the Heart & Tooth and Nail after all. But I actually wanted something in exchange in regards to Bloom Tender + Staff of Domination / Sword of the Paruns / Umbral Mantle . How does each 2-Card Combo w/ Bloom Tender as a base work here?
My thought process is truly stressing; I mean, I got a lot of stuff to bring to the modern age. So, how do these 3 2-Card Infinite Mana Combos Work? I'm intriguing myself from this...
4 days ago
From my experience as a Mayael player (in a 75% meta,) I would limit the number of one-shot tutors I run. Mayael doesn’t, and Atla would be the same, care about what creatures you’re beating face with usually, mostly that you have fatties to beat face with. Silver bullets are nice, but from my experience if you’re needing to deal with problem permanents you’re not going fast enough. This is of course dependent on the environment you find yourself in.
I guess as far as other cuts go, look at cards that don’t do anything when they come in, or anything useful when other things happen. Su-Chi for example might be useful sac fodder in some decks, but in a three color fatty deck, how much does it contribute to your game plan? Is it going to die more by your hand or someone else’s? With 27 cards to cut you’re going to have to take a hard look at what’s helping you and what is not.
1 week ago
Hi again realsoupersand,
Had to fly out to Ottawa, ON in Canada for a bit, so back in action.
50% of the time, I win with my primary win-con, which is Buried Alive + Reanimate , generally between T1-4 depending on how much tutoring and mana ramps I have available. It's CMC4, which happens on T1 occassionally, T2/T3 more realistically.
Karmic Guide is a critical component of that combo, also, yes she is playable with Kaalia of the Vast . Also enables Razaketh, the Foulblooded from the graveyard, and provides for sac/tutor. It's usually never a dead draw, and at CMC5 is still playable from hand, on occasion if the game is going on, and the Protection: with Flying also has assisted occasionally. Other than her obvious CMC as just a recursion tool, she's generally been good, and a requirement for the primary win-con.
Angel of Despair is just a Vindicate for CMC7, its ridiculous and only 5/5 flying. However, it's what I ALWAYS Tainted Pact to when Show and Tell + Omniscience , unless they have Leyline of Anticipation it's "usually" good enough. I can tutor Anguished Unmaking , however, I have to give priority up with an Omniscience on the table, so it's far too late by then. Can also destroy other random threats if needed too. She's borderline for sure. Red Elemental Blast is too slow in this case.
Angelic Arbiter was answering the Jeleva, Nephalia's Scourge but now it's always Kess, Dissident Mage . Also for Tooth and Nail type encounters (eg: Craterhoof Behemoth ) or any type of haste/recursion. All together stops a few. I usually just put 1 response to any situation, because I just tutor the exclusive solution needed.
Avacyn, Angel of Hope protects against MLD type situations, but she's not difficult to remove anyway, everyone's removal deals with her no problem. If she buys me an extra turn though, it's worth it. Can also put a player on a turn timer or make them act before prepared (no Force of Will for example), sometimes... Not the strongest for sure. Or like a The Gitrog Monster looping destroy maybe...
Balefire Dragon is again, just to solve specific issues or eliminate high value ground targets. Like the others, Tainted Pact to hand whenever, a situation calls for it. I tried to cut back on creature controls (ex: Damnation ) just because its not a creature world, but often creatures can be enablers.
Baneslayer Angel cut, served no purpose other than lifelink for the Hatred but the CMC5 was too much, and only removed a single opponent. Serra Ascendant T1 "usually" puts enough pressure on 1 player (usually )), who is now on a turn timer, spending life for tutoring becomes harder, and sometimes waste time removing it. Statistically found, I was usually nearly 1 turn earlier to win with Serra Ascendant , plus overcharges me for an early Necropotence or Razaketh, the Foulblooded win or Doom Whisperer win.
Phyrexian Arena is tough, high CMC, no return. It still the second highest played card in commander, and I don't know how else to draw? Mardu is a drawing nightmare. Have to think on it, how to deal with it but agreed, same issue is with Bloodgift Demon . I've had Skyline Despot recommended has a same turn impact (draw at EOT), but also, might be ramping oppponents draw too, especially if I have no way to reconnect on attack as Skyline Despot doesn't have trample.
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight has the added benefit of removing 1-damage win-cons like Impact Tremors , Blasting Station , Goblin Bombardment , Dragon Tempest (with 1 dragon), Etc... Also puts pressure on. Usually just for a specific application though. I think my interaction package is more similar to a Thoughtseize type application, where if I can't win early, I tutor what I need to address the specific threats, instead of using Instant spell to do them? If that makes sense. Gisela, the Broken Blade i've cut.
Hellkite Tyrant was specifically answering an almost consistent Breya, Etherium Shaper deck. It's been a while since C16 set now, so definitely seeing it less and less. Might help with Teferi, Temporal Archmage or Urza, Lord High Artificer on occasion. It wasn't enough on it's own though, it also needed a Linvala, Keeper of Silence to go with it. Prior to this, I had nothing to compete with Breya, Etherium Shaper , had no way to win.
Lyra Dawnbringer is on my cut list now, might become the Sire Of Insanity or something like that. Mother of Runes works good with Master of Cruelties , also can protect Kaalia of the Vast , makes guys like Balefire Dragon unblockable too, or protects a Razaketh, the Foulblooded and becomes Tutor mana, or blocks an early Infect attack. Slow yes, but has some utility. Also can protect my Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker or Worldgorger Dragon causing me to win (instead of lose). It's borderline for sure, have to think about it. Aven Mindcensor feels good, looking for a way to include him as well as the Sire Of Insanity .
Steel Hellkite I tried for over a year, I would either, not be able to connect (no trample), or when I did, not enough mana to get the threat that I really needed to remove. I gave up on Steel Hellkite , also needs a Mother of Runes for support.
Ancient Tomb is back in, can't recall why I removed it. Think it screwed me one game with the colorless, but now that I've removed most of the colorless, it makes sense. Prismatic Vista isn't great, only 2 basics (can put in the snow's but for why), I like that it filters a land out (lower probability of drawing a land), but also destroys my mana-fixing as well, so agreed, unnecessary in this build, but feels weird.
I'm probably going to continue reducing CMC and reducing land counts as you've recommended, but needs some expensive 0-CMC rocks which I don't have, or some resource planning around alt. mana sources.
Overall goal is still to build for cEDH, understanding that consistency isn't going to push into more than a Tier-2.5/3 categorization, so I'll go over High Power again later lol.
Thinking about Interaction, I really don't want to go heavy into that with things like, Dismember or Lightning Bolt would rather let the opponents use their removal, and PRAY that I can sneak through a combo. If I combo T1 it has a fairly high success rate (other than a Pact of Negation which eliminated themselves) usually don't get stopped (Odd Force of Will or Swords to Plowshares here and there), T2 is still decently good, often others are still tutoring for a T3 win, but outside of T3 or beyond, usually I need to wait until someone tries to combo, and then is stopped, before I have a chance. I just go for it whenever I can though, increases winning % over trying to strategically go for it and being too late.
I think perhaps Red Elemental Blast or Pyroblast or both perhaps will be handy, Silence I wish it had Split Second (like Teferi's Protection ) because most combos don't have a "sorcery" speed interaction so doesn't stop. Can protect me on the turn I'm going for it like another Grand Abolisher but outside of that not highly useful. Will do some playtesting with it and see if it improves my completion % for combo and increases my combo win % because that's all that matters.
I decided not to go MLD, can Stax/MLD certainly is a strategy, but prefer just to ignore others, and just go for the win myself, win or lose. Plus I don't repopulate my hand nor ramp, so probably just slowing myself down instead of the opponents. Plus I don't have a Ravages of War so would require a financial commitment, would rather focus on finding a way to go for the win on T1-T3 more consistently.
I think if you found Kaalia of the Vast wasn't competitive using MLD before you dissolved that strategy, don't think it's the right course to go down either. Would rather try some out-of-the-box planning, and see if we can get her into a cEDH, which your comments are VERY helpful, and VERY appreciated. Think I've made some decent strides, still waiting for my card order to come in the mail so I can make some more cuts/adds to the deck!
I'll reply on high power shortly since it's lower priority, and hopefully you'll see my deck going in a stronger direction. Pushing that T1 probability up is key. I keep thinking there must be a T1 with Entomb and Goryo's Vengeance that I can do somehow? Razaketh, the Foulblooded would need another enabler, but there must be someone (like Griselbrand aka Griselbanned) to win with? Hmm.
Tooth and Nail occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.04%