|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Vintage Masters||Mythic Rare|
|Commander's Arsenal||Mythic Rare|
|From the Vault: Relics||Mythic Rare|
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Karn, Silver Golem
Legendary Artifact Creature — Golem
Whenever Karn, Silver Golem blocks or becomes blocked, it gets -4/+4 until end of turn.
: Target noncreature artifact becomes an artifact creature with power and toughness each equal to its converted mana cost until end of turn.
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Karn, Silver Golem Discussion
6 days ago
Your artifacts would return with a -1/-1 counter on them. Here's the relevant rule:
608.2b If the spell or ability specifies targets, it checks whether the targets are still legal. A target thats no longer in the zone it was in when it was targeted is illegal. Other changes to the game state may cause a target to no longer be legal; for example, its characteristics may have changed or an effect may have changed the text of the spell. If the source of an ability has left the zone it was in, its last known information is used during this process. The spell or ability is countered if all its targets, for every instance of the word target, are now illegal. If the spell or ability is not countered, it will resolve normally. Illegal targets, if any, wont be affected by parts of a resolving spells effect for which theyre illegal. Other parts of the effect for which those targets are not illegal may still affect them. If the spell or ability creates any continuous effects that affect game rules (see rule 613.10), those effects dont apply to illegal targets. If part of the effect requires information about an illegal target, it fails to determine any such information. Any part of the effect that requires that information wont happen.
It's a bit wordy, but the part we want to focus on here is the "last known information" concept. Cauldron of Souls gives the creatures persist, meaning that the creature is the source of the ability. Now, the card is in the graveyard and not the battlefield, so the game has to look at it as it was the moment before it left. If you animated your Razor Boomerang with Karn, Silver Golem, gave it Persist with Cauldron of Souls, and let it die, the game would see the Boomerang as an Artifact Creature, even though it's just an Artifact now. The ability would resolve normally and the Boomerang would return to the field with a -1/-1 counter on it, which doesn't make a difference unless you go to animate it again
CORRECTION: That's not quite the right rule to cite, but this does have to do with Last Known Information. The MTG Wiki article on Persist actually explains it rather concisely, though it doesn't provide the reasoning on the page: "Likewise, if a noncreature permanent becomes a creature, gains persist, and is put into a graveyard, the persist ability will still trigger even though that permanent won't be a creature when it returns to the battlefield."
6 days ago
If I use Karn's ability to make several artifacts into artifact creatures, then activate the Cauldron's ability to give them persist, then sacrifice them for something, will those artifact cards return to the battlefield, even thought they aren't creatures anymore? Will they still have a -1/-1 counter on them? I don't think they would, because they would not be creatures anymore, but still wonder if the Cauldron's ability will work to bring them back.
I read through the rulings on Gatherer, but I wan't quite clear on this.
Thanks for the help.
2 weeks ago
Endbringer because of the untap during each upkeep and versatility of the card.
Hecatomb don't know if you want to sacrifice 4 creatures, but then it turns all your swamps into "Pingers"
Being Black you may have trouble dealing with Artifiacts. Have you thought about Karn, Silver Golem to animate them and then kill them?
Mirage Mirror seems pretty mean, you can stack the triggers and might still end up with a copy of the first target until end of turn.
you only have 5 zombies but Zombie Trailblazer can be tapped the turn it comes into play
and lastly for $#its and giggles squee's toy of death
3 weeks ago
Pia Nalaar is chronically underwhelming in Commander format. Unfortunately, there simply aren't enough ways to abuse one thopter token that will have an adequate effect on a game of commander. But, two thopters... now that's pretty insane.
cough Breya, Etherium Shaper cough
I would highly recommend reconstructing this deck into a Tiny Leaders deck. Very similar formats, and Pia's thopter goes much further with only 25 life to start. (I believe that's the starting life total, I don't recall exactly)
However, if you do insist on keeping this a commander deck, I'd throw in a healthy amount of dredge and artifact graveyard shenanigans. A couple notable cards to that end include Grinding Station and Mesmeric Orb. Additionally, if you don't switch the commander to Daretti, Scrap Savant, (who is extremely good as a commander) then add a healthy amount of artifact reanimation, namely Scarecrone, Lifeline, Trash for Treasure, etc. I'd also add some good token generators, i.e. Myr Battlesphere, Myr Turbine, and Thopter Assembly (which I see you already have). Add as many token generators as you can, primarily because they fuel other cards, such as Ashnod's Altar and Krark-Clan Ironworks, which can help you lay down your larger creatures. Then, you reanimate them, get the tokens again, and repeat the process. They also provide handy blockers and fuel pia's second ability. (Metalworker and Quicksilver Amulet work as well to lay down cards like Blightsteel, but worker is a bit pricey.) Speaking of ol' BS, having Warstorm Surge otb when blightsteel enters one-shots an opponent. Just fyi ;)
As for some just generally good cards for this style of deck, I'd recommend Inventors' Fair, Kuldotha Forgemaster, Hedron Archive, Blinkmoth Urn, Voltaic Construct, and Myr Retriever are all great cards. For more synergistic artifact suggestions, I'd take a look at some Karn, Silver Golem EDH lists and some Daretti, Scrap Savant EDH lists. A deck with Pia at at the head would run a lot of the same cards and work similarly to those, I'd imagine. I've never seen anyone try to use Pia in EDH before, so bravo, good sir, exploring new territory. Good luck with the deck!
3 weeks ago
1 month ago
Lifeline, Scarecrone, and Nim Deathmantle are all auto-includes for a Hope of Ghirapur deck. They allow you to brutally abuse its ability and recur it every turn, circumventing command tax. Metalworker, Copper Gnomes, and Ancient Tomb are also great cards, and I see a couple strict upgrades to fit them in. If you're considering Darksteel Forge, I'd add Mycosynth Lattice, since those two win the game with Nevinyrral's Disk out. (It destroys all permanents except your own) mycosynth also deals with pesky cards like Null Rod, and since you're using voltron, you'd likely win the ensuing mana-less battle. I'd also add Kuldotha Forgemaster as an additional tutor tool. Karn, Silver Golem also happens to combo with lattice to wreak havoc on lands, if that combo interests you. In a ramp heavy deck like this, I think Planar Portal would do a lot of good, especially since it actually cheapens Darksteel Forge and is a reusable tutoring engine. Also, Lightning Greaves is a strict upgrade over Swiftfoot Boots. Avarice Amulet is a very bad card, if you're looking for draw, Sword of Fire and Ice does the job better. Same deal with Vulshok Morningstar and Sword of Light and Shadow; it just does more.
1 month ago
Spatial Contortion is in the deck simply because my meta runs a lot of low cost low health generals, like Kalia and Krenko. I agree that Karn, Silver Golem and Panharmonicon are not great and on second look seem kinda pointless. Gonti's Aether Heart is certainly greedy but more often than not my meta won't be able to blow it up and it'll give me a fre e turn
1 month ago
Not a huge fan of Spatial Contortion in any deck really. I just think it's underwhelming in EDH.
Does Karn, Silver Golem really fit here. He is a decent beater, but not really that great for the cost. I get that he can animate artifacts, but most of yours will become 1/1 or 2/2.
Not enough value for Panharmonicon here IMO. I love this card, but you only have a couple of triggers.
Gonti's Aether Heart seems a bit loose/greedy