Meren’s Thousand-Eyed Army [Primer]

Commander / EDH Control_Train

SCORE: 165 | 76 COMMENTS | 28657 VIEWS | IN 75 FOLDERS


Core 19, Modern Horizons, and Core 20 —Aug. 5, 2019

Three sets worth of changes and I defoiled the entire deck. This means Survival of the Fittest will probably be coming soon when I get some cash.

IN

  • Cavalier of Night - Ravenous Chupacabra with upside; card is very good
  • Dread Presence - card draw OR removal/life gain/kill condition; great combo with World Shaper
  • Field of the Dead - an insane value engine on it's own and completely bonkers with World Shaper; make enough blockers to save you from even the elves or just swing with them and win
  • Finale of Devastation - the fact that this searches graveyard OR library is absolutely huge; acting as a backup win condition with Izoni is just a bonus
  • Force of Vigor - exiling a card from your hand isn't great, but even hard cast this card is playable; hitting two targets is what really sells it for me
  • Gaze of Granite - hits all non-land permanents unlike Pernicious Deed, and Planeswalkers are relevant since WAR
  • Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet - graveyard hate that gives me creatures; exactly what I want
  • Lake of the Dead - sacrificing a swamp isn't that bad initially but making four extra mana in a pinch is quite useful
  • Moldervine Reclamation - counts token creatures AND gains life; it's an enchantment, which means it's harder to recur, and it is a forced draw, but these are rarely downsides
  • Nurturing Peatlandsigned - dual land that comes in untapped and can filter for a draw late game
  • Springbloom Druid - Harrow on a creature; ramp with no real downside
  • Thespian's Stage - here to copy Coffers, Field of the Dead, opposing Cradle's, or anything else of value like a Glacial Chasm or something
  • Twilight Mire - why I let myself cut this I don't actually know; untapped dual land with no life loss is an auto-include
  • Vesuva - see Thespian's Stage
  • Yawgmoth, Thran Physician - the godfather of all aristocrat decks; a truly, truly unfair card that I am more than willing to abuse the fuck out of until it's banned, because drawing a card, shrinking a creature, and being a sacrifice outlet is completely unheard of on a single ability

.

OUT

  • Agent of Erebos - not that great, honestly; I have Scavenging Ooze and Bojuka Bog, so I'm pretty set
  • Chainer, Dementia Master - this might seem uncanny to some people, but here's my reason(s) why; it takes the infinite combo out of my deck and it really wasn't THAT good to begin with because it's mana and life intensive, and early game it's hot garbage because there is little to reanimate
  • City of Brass - the worst dual land and I need a relatively high number of basics for Steve/Springbloom Druid and a high density of basic swamps for Dread Presence
  • Dark Confidant - neat, but bad
  • Destructor Dragon - useful, don't get my wrong, but not worth the six mana in a majority of situations
  • Forest - cut for a dual
  • Krosan Grip - quite a good card against something like Relic of Progenitus, but honestly any smart opponent cracks this the second they have priority
  • Mausoleum Secrets - it occurred to me that perhaps fifteen tutors was a bit much; cut this for Kalitas
  • Memorial to Folly - god this card is awful
  • Memorial to Unity - god, this card is somehow more awful than the one above it
  • Necrotic Ooze - has very few useful targets; has won me a game before with an opposing Kiki-Jiki, but I'm honestly never thrilled to see it anymore
  • Pernicious Deed - a hard cut, honestly, because I own both an original Apocalypse foil and non-foiled which are both signed, but Gaze of Granite is strictly better about ninety-five percent of the time
  • Swamp - cut for a dual
  • Silhana Wayfinder - just a slightly worse Satyr Wayfinder
  • Temple of Malady - cut for a better dual

Control_Train says... #1

Ripwater - Earthcraft for me never quite feels like overkill, even though late game it isn't the best topdeck in the world; I like it early too much to cut it, and it doesn't require haste like Cryptolith Rite

Frank_Glascock - Thanks for the compliment, it means a lot! :) Sylvan Library is certainly a playable card, and it's very good; I personally have strayed away from non-creature cards as much as possible to increase the consistency to be able to use any given card with Meren, and I feel the deck has enough draw as it stands

Greater Good is a fantastic card, don't get me wrong; however, it's more useful in decks that play a bigger top end of creatures, as my creatures generally have very low power, and thus it makes it a weird Bazaar of Baghdad, which isn't quite what I want out of a draw engine

Gaea's Cradle is obviously insane in most green decks that play creatures, especially those with tokens; for me, it's a twofold issue, the first being that the foil is absolutely out of my reach financially, and the deck has been 100% foil where possible for so long, it feels weird to think of adding non-foils that have a foil printing, and the other issue for me is that I'm not trying to ramp like that or produce the amount of creatures necessary on a regular basis to make it worthwhile

I'm generally keeping the board clear of anything, even if it means just looping Plaguecrafter and very, very slowly progressing my own board

May 14, 2019 1:43 a.m.

Frank_Glascock says... #2

Control_Train, thanks for the response. Sol Ring , Lightning Greaves , and Imperial Seal seem like plausible additions. Am I correct that Sylvan Safekeeper is your only protection for Meren?

Has Prowling Serpopard pulled it's weight? I would think that countering Meren's creatures would not be a viable long term strategy as you can get them back with Meren.

Agent of Erebos and particularly Destructor Dragon seem like overcosted solutions given all the creature and spell removal you are playing.

How has Savra, Queen of the Golgari performed?

Final Parting seems overcosted for the effect. Has it been clearly a viable card at that cost?

May 14, 2019 7:57 p.m.

Frank_Glascock says... #3

I am thinking of adding Living Plane with Minister of Pain . We have four tutors to get Living Plane. I may add a Imperial Seal in place of Final Parting . Birthing Pod becomes more viable with this option. What are your thoughts on this?

Have you considered Mindslicer ? It seems that we can play the top deck game much more easily utilizing our graveyard with just Meren in play.

May 14, 2019 10:18 p.m.

Ripwater says... #4

I agree with Frank_Glascock that Prowling Serpopard is not really pulling it's weight. I play in a control heavy meta and I rarely tutor for it. So that one goes out for Mindslicer . In my opinion as well Mindslicer is a ruthless card and much better against control then the more passive Prowling Serpopard

The other one that I've cut is Necrotic Ooze again, rarely pulled it's weight and often he turned into a sakura tribe elder... Not what I want to do for 4 mana. Chosen to add another copy of Plaguecrafter in the form of Merciless Executioner . My playgroup is really after removing plaguecrafter from the game ASAP. So another copy of it will make sure I can do my thing a bit more.

I don't agree with you, Frank_Glascock, on Destructor Dragon . At first I was a bit sceptic as well, but it is recurable removal that goes after anything that is not a creature. At first I thought why not Woodfall Primus , but 8 experience is just harder to get back than the 6. Especially since my playgroup loves to keep meren off the table...

Sol Ring I rarely have the feeling that I miss it.

Savra, Queen of the Golgari is really performing well. She is almost our Grave Pact since we dont run that card or Dictate of Erebos . But recurable.

Agent of Erebos is amazing in any Meren deck. Almost any deck plays some way of recursion and he is an all-star at keeping graveyards empty. I often dump him early game in my Survival of the Fittest to get him out of my graveyard later on.

Final Parting is a really decent tutor in this deck, cause it basically let's you get 2 creatures at the cost of 2.5 mana per creature. Wich is a bit more than a Demonic Tutor , but the fact that it's 2 tutors on 1 slot, I think is pretty amazing.

Control_Train, I have a hard time agreeing with all your cut's for WAR. New Lilly and Bontu are amazing for our decks! But I don't think Massacre Girl will perform that well. With the amount of Meren removal I'm experiencing, I'm quite reluctant in playing here and probably wiping my own meren off the battlefield.

Soul of the Harvest seems like an pretty okay card. Haven't got it out that often yet. If I would cut him it's probably for a Fleshbag Marauder . And play all 3 of them.

Guardian Project seems like a wrong idea to take out. It draws soooo much cards and at a 4 mana investment I'm quite happy with it.

Casualties of War is amazing and it went directly into the deck.

Other cards that I would like to discuss with the both of you are: Garruk, Apex Predator Old face smasher has been in my deck for quite some time now. And especially with WAR out he performs really well. His mana cost is most of the time not really the problem and if our deck performs well by the time he hits there won't be much creatures to deal with him.

Kokusho, the Evening Star quite soon I found out that playing meren makes me a target. And when you are a target your life goes down. Kokusho fills this gap and get's me my life back. The fact that he is a flyer (next to the dragon, we play zero flyers) is quite nice as well. He really was the card I was missing in this deck and won me the game already a few times.

Sheoldred, Whispering One Often people already spent most of their removal when she hits the table and that means they have trouble dealing with her. She is an absolute all-star and if not dealt with most of the time results in a win.

Would love to get your imput as well!

May 15, 2019 7 a.m.

Frank_Glascock says... #5

Would Bazaar of Baghdad have a place on this list?

May 19, 2019 3:15 a.m.

Frank_Glascock says... #6

Control_Train, what is usually the first creature for which you tutor? Ripwater said he usually gets Sakura-Tribe Elder .

I go back and forth on Lightning Greaves . Is spot removal on Meren an issue in your meta and do you find Sylvan Safekeeper sufficient? I find myself tutoring for it first as my opponents hold up instant speed removal for Meren.

May 20, 2019 7:47 a.m.

Frank_Glascock says... #7

Control_Train, as I play Meren I appreciate your list more and more. There are a few cards I question.

Could Sol Ring be better in the deck than Pitiless Plunderer ? Early game Sol Ring is the only option. It gets Meren out two turns earlier. It allows for multiple early turn casts. Pitiless Plunderer never sees the field before Meren.

Midgame, assuming Pitiless Plunderer is cast after Meren, how often do you see it generate mana that turn? Meren would have to return a creature to the battlefield or you would have to cast a one mana creature assuming the fifth land drop. Meanwhile, Sol Ring is generating mana every turn it is cast include a net positive of one colorless mana the turn it is cast.

Late mid game and late game Pitiless is the clear winner. Colored mana that can will be generated in bunches and stored for big turns finally beats the consistent colorless Sol Ring mana.

The argument to include a creature in a deck that has more means to tutor creatures (more so with the inclusion of Survival of the Fittest ) than artifacts is also suspect. That assumes Pitiless Plunderer is a common tutor target. My strong suspicion is that you rarely if ever tutor this creature. Am I wrong in thinking this?

May 21, 2019 2:59 p.m.

Frank_Glascock says... #8

I made a mistake concerning Pitiless Plunderer . I thought it generated mana from creatures etb. This would increase the chances it generates mana on the turn it is cast. I still think Sol Ring is the superior card for this deck.

May 21, 2019 3:52 p.m.

Frank_Glascock says... #9

May 30, 2019 3:23 p.m.

Control_Train says... #10

Definitely not ignoring you guys, just been very busy with finals etc. I'll try not to miss anything in my reply.

Sol Ring, Greaves, and Seal are all fine additions. I don't personally like playing too many artifacts because in my meta I find myself using Bane of Progress a LOT, and having targets for it myself isn't great, with non-creature non-lands being the hardest things to recur in the deck, meaning that I won't get nearly as much value out of them as I'd like. Sylvan Safekeeper is my only direct protection for Meren, yea, but I've never run into a game where I couldn't cast my commander. The deck still functions without her, just a bit slower. I ran Seal for a long time, but after enough situations where I'm behind and needed an answer then and couldn't get it because I didn't have a way to draw a card after I used Seal, I cut it.

Prowling Serpopard is a must have for my meta; almost every deck I play against is blue and going turn 3 Snake into turn 4 Meren is an unbeatable line of play. It's certainly a flex slot, because if you aren't encountering counterspells in every single game you play it can be a dead card at times. Agent is getting cut for Modern Horizons, and since I added Bojuka Bog I do find that I don't need Agent as much. For a long time it felt necessary, but with Bog and the need for cuts, it's gotta go.

Destructor Dragon I haven't found the will to cut yet, despite being a bit overcosted as you say, but it gets around Torpor Orb, which is hugely relevant in my meta. With as much spot removal as I have though, it may be time to look at it getting cut. It has never felt bad to resolve or recur, but it could be better given the right thing to cut it for.

Savra is a lifesaver against aggro decks, and part of the reason I'm willing to run Chainer because he's pretty life intensive. Final Parting was a strict upgrade to Jarad's Orders, and has always pulled it's weight.

Living Plane/Minister of Pain is a fine set of cards to play, if that's where you want to go with the deck. That's a little too brutal for my meta, but by all means play it. You could cut Final Parting if it hasn't felt good for you, but it's always been a nice topdeck for me.

I used to run Mindslicer too, and may add it in again soon, it's just this card that produces very weird play patterns and is only really good when you're ahead on board, and win more cards aren't exactly what my deck needed. It's definitely playable and definitely powerful, though, so don't be afraid to test it.

Necrotic Ooze for me has always pulled it's weight, but again if something isn't working for you feel free to cut it. Ooze feels like a safety valve for me and has singlehandedly won me a game before when I couldn't stick Meren. Woodfall Primus also goes infinite with Mikeaus and I didn't want THAT easy of a win swimming around in my deck, because if it's there I'll use it.

Massacre Girl is an "Oh Shit" button for me. It's tutorable off of Hulk (which is huge) and it almost always just cleans the board up entirely. Losing your own Meren isn't ideal, obviously, but in that regard it's not different than Damnation. The tutorable, recurrable board wipe, especially with as many creatures up the toughness chain as I run, makes her at the very least a Toxic Deluge for 4-5 almost every time, even more depending on the matchup and board state. I've been in love with it, but if it isn't working for you feel free to cut it (as I'll say a lot lol.)

Soul of the Harvest was good, just not good enough for me. It's still a fine card to play. I just don't like it. 6 cmc isn't where I want my draw engines. Guardian Project was pretty good for me, but it just never felt good, so I cut it for that reason.

Garruk seems like a solid addition, especially with WAR in the format now, I just don't have a slot because I see almost zero planeswalkers in my playgroup(s). We have one superfriends deck, but a single Garruk isn't gonna stem that tide by itself. I'd almost run Elderspell at that point to ultimate Liliana faster but that might be a bit too gimmicky lol.

Kokusho seems like a solid card. I play against Kokusho a lot and it's amazing for other decks, so it should probably be good here too. I just don't see myself using it that much since I have Savra for life gain and other things for win conditions.

Glad Sheoldred has been working out for you! I've been testing it myself and haven't been ultimately overwhelmed, but I'm gonna give it some time to see if I can really start to see it shine.

Bazaar is probably fine in this deck, but I would definitely not go out of your way to spend whatever ungodly amount of money they cost these days to get one if you don't already own one. I don't ever see card disadvantage as useful, even if it's a good discard outlet.

What I tutor for every game is very different. I have to play to the board state, but if I had to guess it's probably Rec Sage or Bane of Progress because of the sheer amount of artifacts and enchantments I encounter in every game that HAVE to be answered. Plunderer for me generates way more mana than Sol Ring every could, and for that reason I personally wouldn't make that direct swap. I would say add Sol Ring if you want, but Plunderer generates an unfair amount of mana for me any time it hits the table, and for that reason I don't think I'll ever cut it unless they print something even more broken.

Krav for me is way too good to cut, because it's a sacrifice outlet AND a card draw engine in one. Soul of the Harvest is a fine card to play if you want to make that swap though.

June 1, 2019 10:40 a.m.

Ilnez says... #11

Any reason to not run Survival other than Exorbitant foil?

August 4, 2019 2:10 p.m.

FuzenAkuhei says... #12

this may sound a bit dumb, but is there any point in running snow covered lands other than the reason that they look and sound cool, or can i just replace them with regular lands because i don't want to pay for more lands when i can just use the ones i already have

August 4, 2019 7:20 p.m.

Control_Train says... #13

Ilnez - there isn’t really, you trade haste and multiple activations for easier recursion; I’m going to be making the switch soon

@Fuzen - there is zero reason to use snow lands other than that I’m extra

August 4, 2019 11 p.m.