|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Masterpiece Series: Amonkhet Invocations (AKHMPS)||Common|
|Eternal Masters (EMA)||Mythic Rare|
|Vintage Masters (VMA)||Uncommon|
|Masters Edition (MED)||Common|
|Promo Set (000)||Uncommon|
Combos Browse all
Force of Will
You may pay 1 life and exile a blue card from your hand from the game rather than pay Force of Will's mana cost.
Counter target spell.
|Have (5)||, CampbellStev , lorddarkstar , Bluboltar , KillDatBUG|
|Want (16)||nwsism , ItsJustGreg , xpo308 , Wulff , golgori_mage_odi , SUPSYNEPIS , oskullator , MaskCollector , JollyGyarados , CampbellStev , Harliti , darksideofthe444 , thundersleet , firemind12 , XaeroSpectre , Zyrook|
Force of Will Discussion
22 hours ago
So my first thought is that you should run a LOT of instants, rather than just 2. Vial smasher can trigger on ANY turn, not just one, so running something like Dig Through Time would be... really good. Generally, you'll want these instants to draw you more cards, so Fact or Fiction and Glimmer of Genius are also fine choices. Cards with alternate casting costs also tend to have high CMCs: for example, Force of Will is a Lava Axe in this deck, as well as a counter spell. While Force may be a pricey card, other cards from the same cycle aren't. Contagion is well under a dollar, and can potentially also 2-for-1 with opposing creatures, while Pyrokinesis is even stronger. Misdirection and Commandeer also come to mind. If you want to get REAL spicy, Mind's Dilation is another good way to cast spell on your opponents' turns, but bear in mind this card tends to be killed pretty fast.
Flash creatures like Torrential Gearhulk also seem like pretty good ideas.
I suggest replacing Vedalken Orrery with Leyline of Anticipation . It's (very) slightly harder to remove an enchantment than an artifact, but more importantly if Leyline is in your opening 7, you avoid having to pay its cost. I can see a world where you play both, though.
I see you're running a few mana rocks, but I advise more. Two mana rocks tend to be far superior to 3 mana rocks, so Dimir Signet and Rakdos Signet are likely better than Thought Vessel or Worn Powerstone . Talisman of Dominance and Talisman of Indulgence also come to mind. Being in green means you have access to a whole host of dorks, like Llanowar Elves , Fyndhorn Elves , Arbor Elf , and Elves of Deep Shadow . These 1-drops may not look like much, but being able to accelerate you into quickly casting your general and then the following high-cost cards is a good thing. Orcish Lumberjack is a personal favorite in any red-green deck. However, if you choose to go via artifact ramp and not dork-ramp, this opens you to using effects like Pyroclasm or Volcanic Fallout to keep opponents' creatures in check. Ancient Tomb tends to be REAL nice for powering out turn-one 2-drop rocks. Depending on how blue-heavy your meta is, Carpet of Flowers can range from good to a straight-up powerhouse. If you take this part of my advice, your curve will drop significantly and you will be able to run 32-ish lands with no real problem.
You'll also probably want a good card-draw package, if you're planning to cast a lot of spells. Azra Oddsmaker is a goldmine if you have an open opponent to attack, and black has access to enchantments like Phyrexian Arena . Night's Whisper and Ambition's Cost are also good, and work well with Kydele.
Delve spells will act sort of like X-cost spells, but be easier to cast late-game and harder early-game. Empty the Pits may be interesting, but you should also consider Logic Knot , Treasure Cruise and Tasigur, the Golden Fang . Tasigur will give you an out later in the game for excess mana, and will allow you a level of recursion. In order to make these cards powerful, you need cards in the graveyard. For that, I recommend Faithless Looting , Jace, Vryn's Prodigy Flip and Dack Fayden . While these last two are pricier cards, I think looting is the best here of the three, as you can cast it turn one to filter out a hand that may be too heavy in lands or spells. The flashback is also very significant. Jace is a powerful card in that he allows more card filtration on a permanent, and allows you to snap back a spell if you want. Dack Fayden is a boss in EDH, where stealing a Sol Ring is very common. So even if you don't need to filter your draws, stealing a rock should be an option about 98% of the time.
Speaking of card filtration, Ponder , Preordain and Brainstorm are all potent cards in any blue deck. While they may not work particularly well with Vial Smasher, they all work rather well with Kydele while also giving you a cantrip to cast turn 1. A lot of times, these are the cards that make a boarderline-keep hand into a keep hand for me, as they are extremely good at finding lands and/or spells as need be.
With Kydele, cards like Windfall , Wheel of Fortune and Winds of Change all become rituals in addition to their usual effects. Running Notion Thief in conjunction with these 'everyone draws' spells is... good. Similarly, targeting an opponent with Dack Fayden 's +1 while Notion Thief is on the field is a pretty good way to tip the card-advantage scales in your favor.
I like Whip of Erebos . You should consider running some Entomb or Buried Alive effects with it, as that would allow you to get some one-shots in with powerful creatures when hitting an opponent or just when entering the battlefield. Nicol Bolas and Massacre Wurm comes to mind.
Good luck with deck building!
1 day ago
How about Chrome Mox , Mox Opal , Mox Diamond , Mana Vault , Mana Crypt and Sensei's Divining Top instead of the janky equipments? Also, I would probably run stuff like Mana Drain , Force of Will , Swan Song , Pact of Negation and the new Force of Negation in a mono blue combo deck like this (if money is not an issue).
You can also add Intuition and Reconstruction so you have an additional tutor to search for your artifact combo pieces. (Search for Reconstruction , Buried Ruin / Academy Ruins and the combo piece.) Good thing about these cards is that they are also useful on their own.
Tolaria West can be a useful tool to tutor for specific lands or your zero mana stuff (especially usefull if you add pact of negation).
4 days ago
Can we take a moment to discuss the name “force of negation”? RND literally combined
Force of Will
and just went “hey... force of negation!”
What a lazy name! And who picked that over “negation of will” given that this seems almost exclusively designed for counter wars
1 week ago
A fantastic example is Panharmonicon . This card allows you to search for Hammer of Nazahn in addition to helm, meaning that godo enters, gains indestructible and equips for no additional cost. Panharmonicon is also replaced in this instance by any "copy" effect - ie Heat Shimmer , Twinflame etc. all allow you to pull off this same effect for significantly less mana.
Admittedly, when you begin reviewing cards such as Soulbright Flamekin I can understand that the mana investment may not seem strong enough. Nonetheless, with all the fast mana available - the deck consistently pressures wins from 1-2 cards required. Though ritualling to victory is still an option
This point could be summed up with the above, but it's relevant for me to mention that many decks have switched from some of the above stax pieces to combat Flash -hulk decks, as they're just as fast as godo, but have more interaction and a greater consistent speed. While Torpor Orb & friends are great, most people have cut it from lists, as it doesn't do enough to combat the more common threats.
1 week ago
LiquidGaming if you are playing Faerie Trickery as a counterspell for the exile ability on it you might want to consider Dissipate and Void Shatter . Another counterspell I would HIGHLY recommend is Rewind . At first it seems good just slightly too expensive, but I'll just say from my experiences with this card it's a 10/10 as a counterspell. BTW, even if you don't add both Dissipate and Void Shatter to this list I would recommend you cut Faerie Trickery for Void Shatter only for a few very minimal benefits ( Tarmogoyf , Red Elemental Blast , Pyroblast , Iona, Shield of Emeria , etc). The only possible downside to Void Shatter that I will bring up is that you can't pitch it too Force of Will , but your mono blue so this will probably never cause an issue. If you do find this to be an issue I would still recommend you change Faerie Trickery to Dissipate for the very minimal benefit of slowing Tarmogoyf .
BTW, nice list and if you would like me to take the time to list any/all possible upgrades/suggestions for your list I would be more than happy to do so. Just let me know if you would like me to make these suggestions or not.
1 week ago
Murphy77 Thank you so much for your suggestions!
You can totally build an EDH deck around turning lands into creatures. The deck would definitively run a lot of the ramp that I run in my deck. However in EDH with Wrath of God , Damnation and many more field wipes in existence it is a risky strategy. Eldrazi Monument would be an auto include for this idea as well as Ramunap Excavator and Crucible of Worlds .
As far as planeswalkers: If I were to build Simic Superfriends I would run Gilder Bairn , Deepglow Skate , and Doubling Season in addition to a lot of the Blue and/or Green planeswalkers. However as far as this deck I like winning too much off of Avenger of Zendikar , Rampaging Baloths and other landfall triggers. If I was to add in a lot of planeswalkers I feel that I would cut down on the lands matter synergy and end up weakening the deck as a whole. Not to say I wouldn't run a planeswalkers. If wizards printed a planeswalkers with a good + ability Kiora, the Crashing Wave 's -1 and and Nissa, Vital Force 's -6 ability or something similar I would totally run it. But as it stands there aren't any planeswalkers that fit the synergy of the deck enough for me to run with out changing to Simic Superfriends.
As for counterspells other then Force of Will which I would include if it cost less money. I have been considering Familiar's Ruse for the shenanigans that can be pulled with Eternal Witness and other ETB triggers. However I don't know if I have enough ETB triggers to justify it. I plan on testing it soon. Now that general tucking isn't a thing I typically try and not run counterspells over the CMC of 2 that don't have alternative casting costs. As for Rewind I would not run it in cEDH. But in a deck that can dump lands out and with Kruphix, God of Horizons 's ability to float mana on the opponent's end phase before your turn it is basically in this deck is a free counterspell and nine times out of ten you aren't losing the mana for.
Thanks again for the suggestions. I noticed you have a lot of standard and modern deck on your page. Are you thinking about getting into EDH? If you need any help I would be happy to help!
1 week ago
To clarify, I never said Teyo is the card to go here, just that he's better than misako :) If you want to try him out at all in commander, this is probably the only deck where he's worth mentioning. Yeah in my meta arcedes would never stick for a turn cycle. This deck is easily thwarted if you never let Arcedes, High Alert or Assault Formation stick, so being able to fight through that is a must. If you face many counterspells Autumn's Veil is a great addition here as well. I dislike Lightning Greaves and Swiftfoot Boots here since you don't get much for their cost. Ideally this deck goes someting like:
The nice thing about this is that noone is ever gonna remove or counter your walls. You just need to get Arcedes through. Cards like Force of Will Pact of Negation can help here in an extremely counter heavy meta if you want to play arcedes on curve, or you stay back build up to like 30 Damage wich on T7 onwards is often nearly lethal for a player and then play Arcedes for a big swing. Hardly any playgroup will let him stick for long since he also draws a lot of cards, which makes him so good. If you give him hexproof or shroud all you do is force out a sweeper which you don't want to happen at all, so counterspells are clearly the way to go here imho.
Changes I would do right now:
Cut: Masako the Humorless doesn't do enough Fog Bank 2 mana 2/2 flyer doesn't seem so good Skyshroud Claim ramps you when you're done ramping. average cmc of the deck is 2.2 Perimeter Captain cut for Wall of Runes Island Average cmc of the deck is 2.2
On a Budget add: Slagwurm Armor Might be really good. Will never get removed and 3 mana for +6 seems kinda broken Geist of the Archives Smooth out draws a bit Rampant Growth Fixing and Ramp Meekstone Defense Autumn's Veil Protection/Control
1 week ago
Depending on which browser I use, I can't comment on the deck page so I'll post here though I dunno if you'll see it here:
Played a few more rounds:
Game 1: I'm on the draw. Dude drops a turn 1 Arcbound Ravager , sacs everything, and proceeds to swing away with an 8/8 starting on turn 2. I take a profound beating but respond with Emmara, Soul of the Accord and attack, making chumps to feed his monster. He doesn't draw anything else after that and I bust him ftw. 1-0
Game 2: He's a little slower and only makes Frogmite and Arcbound Worker on turn 1. Ravager comes out turn 2. I get Hero of Precinct One and make dudes with Tajic, Legion's Edge and spank for 6 right away. He responds with all out attack. I block the Frogmite and he sacs out, pumping the Ravager up to 6, brings me down to 5, and finishes with Shrapnel Blast . 1-1
Game 3: On the play again. I have to mulligan, keeping two land and a mox, but make Hero while he makes Ravager and a pair of Ornithopter . He swings, I try Response / Resurgence on the Ravager so he sacs everything and makes the Ornithopter 5/7, just outside Collision range (in my effing hand, no less!). Whatever. I make a Swiftblade Vindicator while he attacks me down to 1, I throw Colossus on the vindicator and swing all out, pummeling him for 14... he's at freaking 15. One more freaking damage OMFG!!! Ornithopter finishes me off while I stare at the same two land and useless mox. 1-2
Game 1: On the play, I get no red mana but two mox and Emmara, and which allows me to drop her and Hero on turn 2. Next turn Aurelia, Exemplar of Justice and swing for 6. All I see on his end is Anticipate and Eldrazi Skyspawner . 1-0
Game 2: I lose one Emmara to Harnessed Lightning , a second to Thopter Arrest . Stuck on two mana and a useless Mox, I make Hero and lose that to another lightning. Everything in my hand costs 3. He makes Jace, Unraveler of Secrets . I find another land and make Legion Warboss , he responds with Eldrazi Skyspawner . This allows Tajic, who gets traded but I take Jace down to 1. Chandra, Torch of Defiance torches the Warboss, leaving me with a 2/2 and a 1/1 goblin so he makes Heart of Kiran which takes 6 from Collision / Colossus allowing me to polish off his planeswalkers. Tajic happens again only to fall under Thopter Arrest. Then Aurelia happens, pumping the goblin and this is the first time I actually damage this punk. Next turn, eleven, one Chance for Glory dies to Negate but the second gets through ftw. 2-0
Game 3: Vindicator dies to lightning, Emmara dies to Thopter Arrest, I drop a second Emmara and he plays Felidar Guardian to blink the arrest, kills one Emmara to the legend rule and arrests the survivor. I have Tajic but he's not going to bust through the 1/4, he topdecks Saheeli Rai . GG. 2-1
Game 1: I'm on the draw. Thunderherd Migration reveals Ghalta, Primal Hunger and pumped Vindicator takes down Steel Leaf Champion early. He then ramps while Tajic pumps Vindicator for 7 to the face when he drops 6/6 Multani, Yavimaya's Avatar . Tajic pumps the Vindicator again at a loss to himself while Warboss adds another, bringing him to 6. He then plays another Champion, then taps 2 for Ghalta. Colossus and the double-striker trade for the 12/12 and it costs me the Warboss and Emmara so I get him to 3 but I got nothing left but tokens. He finds a Gigantosaurus and sends 8/8 trampling Multani over. I've got 4 attackers, he's got 3 blockers and I topdeck the Planeswalker. I have another Vindicator so I offer him to the 10/10. We trade, then he throws down another Ghalta and my next card is a land. 0-1
Game 2: I keep two Clifftop Retreat and a hero and wait to draw a green while he ramps into Steel Leaf Champion , Gigantosaurus , then Aggressive Mammoth . I can make some dudes but not that much, he makes another 10/10 and Ghalta. 0-2
Game 3: Hero, Emmara, and Vindicator jump out the gate while he ramps into Gigantosaurus. I trade Vindicator plus Colossus for the big guy and cast Chance for Glory but it wouldn't have mattered since I had so many dudes out by that point. 1-2
vs. Stars n Stripes
Game 1: Early Tajic and Vindicator get in for sixteen before dying to Wrath of God . Hero dies to Incinerate , Aurelia, Exemplar of Justice eats a Force of Will , and Vindicator knocks him down to 1 before eating another Wrath. Out of creatures, Huatli sits there and adds counters until he finds Rainbow Efreet to eat away at her. I finally start to draw creatures again but by this time he's got two Thawing Glaciers being fed by Brainstorm and everything I cast gets burnt, countered, or nuked. Efreet ftw. 0-1
Game 2: Both decks get a slow pull, much to his advantage, not mine. Hero gets Incinerate, Aurelia eats a Force of Will while he digs for Glaciers. A second Aurelia + Huatli bounces off a Rainbow Efreet turn after turn when he finds his land. I drop Tajic and smash, pumping the angel and knock him down to 3. He kills Huatli with the Efreet, phases out, and taps out for Wrath. With nothing left I draw into a land clump while he goes crazy with two Glaciers, every creature I find gets swallowed by Hammer of Bogardan while hasty Tajic gets lost to a Dissipate . 0-2
Game 3: I gain some life early from Swords to Plowshares and then spank his mana-screwed ass with Tajic. Colossus saves him from the Incinerate and repeats the beats. Huatli grows while Tajic dies to a second Incinerate. Rainbow Efreet comes out and starts to eat Huatli, Legion Warboss makes a goblin before getting the Hammer. I'm forced to use Response to take out the Efreet though I probably should have done so sooner. He throws the Hammer at Huatli bringing her down to 5 and plays a second Efreet and Kjeldoran Outpost . Then a gross misplay leaves the wrong mana untapped, Tajic kags, gets fed by Colossus and Huatli sacs to add 1 for exactly his life total... his three land are two Island and the Outpost. Oops. 1-2 but he shoulda won that last one.
Game 1: I draw no red. He opens with Birds of Paradise and Wood Elves , equips Umezawa's Jitte so I kill the elf with Response / Resurgence and come at him with Hero of Precinct One and Tajic, Legion's Edge and spank for 7. He thinks he can stop me with Arashi, the Sky Asunder so I swarm him with tokens, save my dude with indestructible Chance for Glory , 5 damage get through and there's Colossus in hand. 1-0
Game 2: We both mulligan to six. He drops a turn-3 Kodama of the North Tree . Then Aurelia comes and pumps the Vindicator who eats a Saproling token. Kodama smashes again knocking me down to 3 while Llanowar Elves puts counters on Umezawa's Jitte to take out the Vindicator. No matter; with Aurelia, Hero, and tokens I've got 8 damage plus Chance for Glory and a +4/+2 combat trick on standby. 2-0
Game 3: Shanna, Sisay's Legacy comes, then Mox enables Aurelia to hit turn 3 and swing for 4. He answers with Loxodon Hierarch . I swing, he Seed Spark s the Mox and makes two Saprolings, I pump Shanna to save her and get through with two in the air, he answers with four on the ground. He then throws another Seed Spark at his own Pithing Needle to stack Shanna. I, pump to kill the elephant and he drops Yosei, the Morning Star . I play another Shanna and pass the turn. Yosei starts to beating and I make a Warboss. We trade blows, I get down to 6 and he kags a Selesnya Guildmage . My turn, I kag a Tajic and swing with just enough to force him to trade the guildmage along with the Saproling, he just made, leaving Aurelia to block the dragon ftw. 3-0
There were some cards I was thinking about that I no longer consider and others I'm more convinced of.
Mox Amber just didn't do much. 90% of the time it was just dead weight and even when it did do its job the best it did was bring me from 3 to 4. It doesn't give me colors I'm missing and when the Legends get killed it sits there worthless. I initially thought Lightning Strike would go here but now I think a simple Shock would do even better. Even if you don't draw it, the threat of instant damage should change the opponent's play to our advantage.
Aurelia, Exemplar of Justice I'm on the fence about. Sometimes she added just the right amount of damage, sometimes she looked pretty. Overcosted, she's the only flyer in the deck and sometimes that made a huge difference. I was thinking Gruul Spellbreaker . The advantages to him are haste, which was often the difference when Tajic, Legion's Edge , that it's not white though I don't see a lot of protection from white in Standard right now. He doesn't feed the combo, though that could be a plus. I dunno. I like the angel, just not as much as I'd like.
I request that you add this list to your sideboard so that it may be tested. There are dependent factors, such as are you more likely to go up against control/combo in which case Cindervines should be an absolute killer, or are you more bothered by the graveyard recursion in which case Return to Nature would be better. 4:2, 2:4, or keep it at 3:3.
Banefire I anticipate should be a control destroyer. Without testing we can't be sure, but I suspect it can double as a Teferi-blaster or a face-puncher just the same. It might be too expensive, not sure, but imagine playing Chance for Glory , bash with creatures, and then Banefire lets us throw the mana at him as well.
Unbreakable Formation is a total spoiler. The indestructible is similar to the Chance but if we don't have lethal on the table we can't take the Chance. (you like that?) Hold back in anticipation of Kaya's Wrath or even use in conjunction with Chance to pump creatures.
I put Shalai in there to protect YOU, btw; lot of the cards that killed us targeted the player.
Anyway so there we have a sideboard. If you try it out let me know how it works.
Force of Will occurrence in decks from the last year
All decks: 2.28%
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.08%
G/U (Simic): 0.55%
W/U/B (Esper): 0.58%
U/B/R (Grixis): 0.6%