Vona, Butcher of Magan
Legendary Creature — Vampire Knight
, Pay 7 life: Destroy target nonland permanent. Activate this ability only during your turn.
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|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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Vona, Butcher of Magan Discussion
2 weeks ago
Aight so we've got some cuts to make! So I think a good benchmark to shoot for off the bat is 36 lands and 64 non-lands, though with the sheer number of transform lands you have you might be fine at 34 or 35 - I would NOT recommend going that low until you've played a respectable number of games or playtest hands (probably at least 4 games and 30 playtest hands) and you have a solid understanding of how consistently you come in with too few lands.
As far as the cuts, I'd say drop: Rushed Rebirth , Ecological Appreciation , Vona, Butcher of Magan , Silent Sentinel , Resolute Archangel , Aegis of the Gods , Path of Discovery , Shapers' Sanctuary , Springleaf Drum , Perpetual Timepiece , Accomplished Alchemist , Call for Unity OR Collective Blessing (probably the latter), Rune-Tail, Kitsune Ascendant / Rune-Tail's Essence , Elixir of Immortality , Heliod, God of the Sun , Huatli, Radiant Champion . I can give you my rationale one-by-one if you like.
Then add three lands, possibly modal spell-lands like Agadeem's Awakening Flip. Ideally, more of your lands should be multiple colours, as you have a large colour cost burden in black and white especially (lots of cards that need two or three of the same colour). The cheapest options are the snow taplands, guildgates, refuge lands (give 1 life when they enter the battlefield), and the showlands from Shadows over Innistrad and Strixhaven. There are definitely some mid-range lands that you can pick up for less than $10 that should be a high priority for you: Sunpetal Grove and Godless Shrine to fill out your buddy and shockland sets, the three scrylands a la Temple of Malady , Murmuring Bosk , Canopy Vista , and Scattered Groves . Since your deck doesn't currently have many ways to fetch basic lands, you really shouldn't have many since your colour demands are so high. Also definitely be on the lookout for legendary lands that fit into the deck well! Those will be sweet.
2 months ago
Wow, that's one hell of a deck description nice work, would love to see the description finished and get a look into all of your card choices reasoning. For now, I just wanted to run some questions past you on your deck.
Is this actually an aggro deck? In your description and discussion, you say it is so, but from personally playing Edgar Markov Aggro strategies I see my goal as building my deck towards the goal of ending the game as quickly as possible. However your deck includes cards like Vona, Butcher of Magan , Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief , Olivia Voldaren , Erebos, God of the Dead , Greed , Anointed Procession , Vanquisher's Banner and all your two mana mana rocks. These cards are cards that do not pay off immediately but accumulate value over time, cards more fitting for midrange or control strategies. I think that Edgar Markov midrange can work, I may not think it is the strongest way to build Edgar Markov, but it can be a fun and powerful way to play the commander. All of this is to say that I wanted to challenge you to think about your card choices, and how they further your intended strategies. I think all the cards I listed are generally powerful cards in commander and can be good inclusions for your commander deck. However, just because a card is strong does not mean it is going to help you achieve your goals.
As an example, in my Edgar Markov List My deck has two main strategies. One, to storm off, this strategy to work I need a large board presence of vampires on turns five and six with select cards integral to the combo to pull it off. My aggressive strategy wants a large board presence of vampires on turn 5-7 with select aggro enablers that allow my opponents to die very quickly. Both of these strategies have the same gaols a large board presence with strong card selection or very efficient card draw in order to attain the strategy. So if I'm evaluating a card like Olivia Voldaren or Vanquisher's Banner I am asking potentially four questions. One, which I will always ask, is this card good? For both of these two cards that are going to be a check yes. Two, does this card help me get a large board presence of Vampires into turns 5-7, this won't be a relevant question to ask of Vanquisher's Banner but for Olivia Voldaren that will be a no. Three, does this card give me the card draw or card selection that I need? For Olivia Voldaren that is a no and for Vanquisher's Banner it can get me cards, but it will be too slow and too late and does not buff vampires enough to make them a kill threat. Lastly, does this card enable my storm or aggro strategies? For both of these cards, the answer is going to be no. Olivia Voldaren is a card for removal and steal so does not enable either and Vanquisher's Banner is an anthem that accumulates long-term value which does not enable either.
Of course, the questions I ask about my own deck are most likely not relevant to your deck. You are the one that has to create and pilot the deck so you are the best person to figure out how you evaluate what cards are a good fit for your deck and what cards are not a good fit for your deck. Maybe for your evaluation of the card choices I asked about they are a great fit for the goals you wish to achieve with the deck. If they are then any of the questions I asked your deck are not very relevant, but still creates the opportunity to clarify in your strategy section more of your overall strategic purpose. I would love to hear personally if you could hone in on the criteria you evaluate cards for your deck on, as I can see from your updates and descriptions you clearly put a lot of thought into your card choices. Would love to hear back from you, and also to get your thoughts on my own decklist in which I posted a link earlier in the post.
4 months ago
personally, I have been wanting to build an aryel commander deck myself, so here are some suggestions: Order of Yawgmoth out, Hero of Bladehold in. reason: hero of bladehold is just better, same mana cost but in white and a lot more impactful, wether it be turn 3 or turn 6 she is still good. Disrupting Scepter out, Shadowspear in. reason: its shadowspear, helps with hexproof and indestructible allowing aryel to blow up stuff
some other good, yet cheap knight cards to include: Drogskol Cavalry , Bloodcrazed Paladin , Belle of the Brawl , Basri's Lieutenant , Kabira Vindicator , Knight of the White Orchid , Knights of the Black Rose , Lena, Selfless Champion , Liliana's Standard Bearer , Livio, Oathsworn Sentinel , Paladin of Atonement , Silverwing Squadron , Vona, Butcher of Magan , etc.
4 months ago
A quick Scryfall search shows the only white or part-white cards that can "destroy target permanent" and are legal in Historic (can't use Brawl because stuff rotates) are Bounty Agent and Vona, Butcher of Magan . Everything else exiles.
5 months ago
Aegar, Freezing Flame: once lethal damage has been dealt to an enemy indestructible creature (not necessarily by you) (deathtouch counts), you can hit it repeatedly for 1 damage and get a draw each time
Saga: Kinda obvious, but like with Vona, Butcher of Magan you can tap vigilance Angels while they've attacking
6 months ago
Hello again man. First talking about the Vilis, Broker of Blood,I think he is a bit expensive for what we try to do, with all the other draw it´s a bit redundant, and he can´t be cheated from hand or GV.
Second, I know Divinity of Pride is awesome and thicc, but I could easily replace him for something like Archangel of Thune, same cost and can make herself and Liesa really big. Even Vona, Butcher of Magan has more utility and impact but I haven´t tested it enough.
Lastly the easiest one, Tainted Remedy is super narrow, powerful in some tables but in general meh.Erebos, God of the Dead seems way better as it is indestructible and preventing them for gaining life is the most important part of the card. The card draw it´s just the extra and it´s wonderful,because it balances the card draw if you cut Vilis.
If I may say another recommendation, I run Heliod´s intervention on nearly every white deck I own, just amazing value, and the second part of the card is sweet in this deck.
7 months ago
You want to be left alone until you can cast your angels. Cards like Thalia, Heretic Cathar & Kambal, Consul of Allocation can help while the other players are going to hate you more. Making it a little harder in the mid/late game. I would defiantly skip Thalia, Heretic Cathar for that reason. Kambal, Consul of Allocation can at least deal damage and gain your life.
Lives are a resource for sure. Just watch out with Vona, Butcher of Magan that he will not suck you dry. That is a woman's job XD.
Killing Wave you want to cast for x is high. Do really want to pay that much life for all your creatures? I would skip this and play a real board wipe.
I think that you will not use Obzedat's Aid very well. You can get back an artifact (mostly ramp in your case) == bad. You can get back a planeswalker (if they got it away once, they can it again if you spent your turn on returning it) == (in my opinion) bad. You can get an enchantment back == good (in some cases). Most of the enchantment won't reach the graveyard. But it can good. You can get back a creature == good for less mana. There are a lot of better regeneration spells. They can be used more or for less.
That is why I would suggest not to play Obzedat's Aid. It is not mana efficient enough versus versatility.
Your creatures will not always be the biggest on the table. But why do you use Ethereal Absolution instead of the cheaper options? Glorious Anthem, Always Watching, Commander's Insignia, Force of Virtue or Spear of Heliod. Graveyard hate is a benefit. But I think you can spend your mana better than that.
True Conviction is good but watch that one. Ask yourself "Do I want to play it? Or do I prefer something else? When is this good and when is it bad?". I think that it is bad in most cases and too late when you need it.
I understand that you want the lifegain and ping from Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord. But know that the -x you can use it on 9 creatures (for now) on the turn it enters the game. Also, remember that the lifegain is only for during your turn. Is it worth it?
I don't think that Ob Nixilis of the Black Oath can give you a lot of value. It can be me but I don't like this card.
Why Elspeth, Sun's Champion? You get tokens for 6 mana or destroy all your creatures and some of the opponent creatures. Is that worth it? Or do you play it because you have it lying around?
For Aetherflux Reservoir you probably will never be high enough with this on the board. You don't cast a lot of spells in a turn so you must be happy if you gain 3 lives in a round from it. This is not the deck for it.
Moonlight Bargain is 5 mana + 10 lives for draw 5. Promise of Power is the better version of it. It is on sorcery speed, but cost 5 lives less and you can also get a big beater from it if you pay extra.
For now I think that you are not using enough instant speed tricks that require you to hold up mana. That makes that when you hold up mana for Batwing Brume there is a big chance that you don't need it now and want to cast it later instead. Making you not spend some mana in the round. I would skip this card.
If I look at the curve then I would think about playing 36/37/38 lands. You need a lot of mana for your creatures and you miss green to ramp well. You can use cards like Hagra Mauling Flip & Ondu Inversion Flip to make it a little easier.
10 months ago
Alright, I have some suggestions. Now, never have I dipped in the complot of nocent life-gain, but I do see some follies withal the current decklist.
So, ramp and card draw are necessities of any commander strategy. I typically play decks that dump their hands aggressively, thus I have far more draw than normal. Around 34 slots grant me card advantage and 11 slots are for ramp. Here, you have four cards of ramp and five cards of draw. Granted, one of the draw engines is your commander, but that's six-mana afore it does so.
Furthermore, there are plenty of cards in here that just lack reach. Ajani's Sunstriker is horrid to draw turn 8 and onwards. It may be aggressive betime in the match, yet it is outclassed far too quickly.
So, what I'd cut due to card quality: Agent of Masks, Ajani's Sunstriker, Drana's Emissary, Fog Bank, Goldenglow Moth, Grim Guardian, Night Market Lookout, Oreskos Sun Guide, Pride Guardian, Servant of Tymaret, Wall of Essence, Elixir of Immortality, Fountain of Renewal, Narrow Escape, Spell Pierce, and Mana Leak.
Alright, same drill but I wish to offer some substantiation afore I denunciate these.
Coastal Piracy is a very potent card in decks possessing cheap, evasive creatures. This deck does not, thence I would advise ablating it; merely too inutile.
Sinister Possession and Stab Wound, no matter how much I love the Wound, are easily removed. A sacrifice outlet just negates this effect. The Possession in particular doesn't seem to do anything against certain creatures. Chainer, Dementia Master or Oracle of Mul Daya just don't oft attack or block. Even if, it is a mere two damage. Sure, it may stack quickly, but there are better ways to do so.
Condescend is just outclassed so quickly. Counterspells above two mana must do something potent, and this is potentially more. Scrying 2 is fine, but that also doesn't do much.
Dismiss into Dream is sweet, but this deck cannot deem to hent much from it.
Lovely! Now upon what I would add.
Given that the curve is rather high, I'd add Pristine Talisman; Arcane Signet; the talismans of dominance, progress, and hierarchy; Orzhov, Azorius, and Dimir signet; Mind Stone; and Worn Powerstone. This should grant you later plays far earlier in any match.
Unto thee, benison in card draw. Painful Truths is one I much enjoy. Sign in Blood or Night's Whisper are cheap and efficient. Phyrexian Arena and Underworld Connections go in quite a few decks. Well of Lost Dreams is just splendid. Fact or Fiction is never bad. Dawn of Hope is slow but on-theme. Erebos, God of the Dead seems all too perfect due to its static and activated abilities. Dream Trawler is awfully enticing for gameplans such as this. Lastly, Unfulfilled Desires is a hidden gem that I play in any deck that produces blue and black mana.
Of course, just some efficient engines and finishers. Debt to the Deathless and Exsanguinate are each nocent once resolved. K'rrik, Son of Yawgmoth could also be fine, but lacking depending on your hand, for it cares only if the cost is black. Sorin, Vengeful Bloodlord fetches fallen utility creatures from the yard and proffers much in life-gain. Aetherflux Reservoir does much in murdering everyone, too.
I'd recommend some more wraths in this deck. Fumigate is perfect, Merciless Eviction or Austere Command deal with those pesky artifacts efficiently, Elspeth, Sun's Champion is never bad, Supreme Verdict is fine though pricey, or Kaya's Wrath is always lovely. Take your pick.
Okay, now for some other upgrades on the basics of the deck. Swords to Plowshares, Path to Exile, Abolish, Return to Dust, Murderous Rider, Anguished Unmaking, Despark, Hero's Downfall, Reality Shift, Generous Gift, Pongify, Rapid Hybridization, and Heliod's Intervention all remove permanents efficiently and at instant speed. Vindicate is fine but a sorcery.
Finally, some more life gain payoffs as consideration: Authority of the Consuls has oft shut down my strategies, Ajani's Pridemate gets far too large, Blind Obedience does something similar, Divinity of Pride and Serra Ascendant are giant threats in their own right, Bloodthirsty Aerialist does the same, Propaganda and Ghostly Prison make opponents pay to deal damage, Soul Warden and Soul's Attendant are early drops that allow for quite a bit of life to be gained, Archangel of Thune is always potent, Vona, Butcher of Magan is spicey, Angel of Vitality bolsters your engine, Boon Reflection doubles it, Twilight Prophet can get out of hand, Beacon of Immortality puts you heavensly ahead, Ajani, Strength of the Pride can win games on its own, and Felidar Sovereign demands an immediate answer.
That's all from me! Have a lovely day.
Thank you and farewell.