Kaldheim official spoilers
Spoilers, Rumors, and Speculation forum
Posted on Dec. 16, 2020, 4:38 a.m. by Coward_Token
Where to Find Kaldheim Previews
The prediction/speculation thread got kind of long so I thought I'd start things over fresh. We got some early previews this week + Christmas Eve before January kicks things off in a more normal fashion.
15/12 band spoilers (see Twitter & Facebook) Show
DemonDragonJ says... #2
I still am very upset that WotC does not appear as if they shall reprint Frost Titan and Inferno Titan in this set, when it is absolutely the perfect place to do so, and I also am very disappointed that there are no krakens in this set, thus far, since krakens originated in Norse mythology, yet there were krakens in the Theors block.
January 13, 2021 10:07 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #3
Reidane is here to punish anyone who tries to get clever with Extraplanar Lens and snow basics
January 14, 2021 1:10 a.m.
Coward_Token says... #4
Hand-Pod, kinda: go cards with overcosted CMCs like Avatar of Woe to cheat out big stuff early
Runed Crown: Some very forgiving templating there, no anxiety about drawing a Rune you'd rather like to fetch
Axgard Armory: and/or? Whew, that's surprising. And it taps for colored mana too? Pretty nice
UB Axgard Armory equivalent: the mill 4 is just gravy, although the creature entering tapped sours things a bit
January 14, 2021 12:51 p.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #5
Coward_Token, do you think that it is possibly that WotC may print a card that destroys all snow permanents, or would such a card be too powerful?
As long as we are discussing utility lands, I must say that I am very pleased that each two-color combination shall have its own utility land, but most of them are terribly expensive, especially gates of Istfell; I want to like that card, but 5 mana and sacrificing the land is a very high price for two cards and two life.
January 14, 2021 10:12 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #6
DemonDragonJ: that sounds needlessly cruel
Cosima/Omenkeel: a bit slower mono- Tatyova, Benthic Druid? That's pretty weird. No proliferating exiled cards. The boat side doesn't seem all that for EDH, so I don't think mono- Vehicle tribal decks will be a thing
Niko Defies Destiny: the -mana can AFAIK be spent casting foretell cards directly from your hand
January 15, 2021 12:36 a.m.
Xianling69 says... #7
Coward_Token: it isn't limited to just your hand. you can use the mana to cast any spell with foretell.
January 15, 2021 1:06 a.m.
Xianling69 says... #8
i think golgari (or possibly even abzan) elves could be a good contender in standard.
January 15, 2021 1:06 a.m.
Dead2Value7theredo says... #9
They Printed Poison in this set great now i hate this set
January 15, 2021 6:27 a.m.
Xianling69 says... #10
Dead2Value7theredo which cards have poison? at least its not infect.
January 15, 2021 11:48 a.m.
Coward_Token says... #11
Xianling69: this card is basically a double Virulent Sliver for your deathtouchers
January 15, 2021 12:11 p.m.
Dead2Value7theredo says... #12
a card gives two very powerful cards Questing Beast and Nighthawk Scavenger infect basically and they are a pain to take out, you cant even chump them efficiently
January 15, 2021 1:13 p.m.
Xianling69 says... #13
Coward_Token: that will be perfect for my Hooded Blightfang deck.
Dead2Value7theredo: its not quite like giving those creatures infect. with infect, you'd be getting more than just 2 poison counters. plus if they're hittin you with creatures that big anyway, you could end up at 0 life before you end up with 10 poison counters.
January 15, 2021 1:40 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #15
Cosmos Elixir: For better or worse, draws about as fast as Phyrexian Arena. Obviously a pretty nice alternative for mono- lifegain decks.
The Raven's Warning: the dreaded "one or more" templating strikes again; the is no winged Coastal Piracy (although you can increase the number of triggers with first strike/double strike/attacking multiple opponents). Surprised that the can't get stuff from exile. Also, not!Odin is projectile vomiting his bird onto some poor woman.
January 16, 2021 12:58 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #16
Tyrite Sanctum: God tribal support increases. Eat it, divinity counters!
January 16, 2021 5:02 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #17
The Bloodsky Massacre: Not bad. Berserkers-as-a-tribe is picking up steam, even if I don't think they're quite there yet. Better make sure your attacking 'serkers from live to experience ! Also, art is a tattoo.
January 17, 2021 10:56 a.m.
Coward_Token says... #18
Doomskar: I first read the foretell cost as because the last pip was hard to detect against the background. Oh well, this is good regardless in EDH; you can set it up early so that you have a bit easier time rebuilding, and CMC 1 more than Wrath of God (and no anti-regeneration) is fine regardless; when trouble the board is that ripe you can probably afford it.
Dream Devourer: Yeah this is pretty awesome, although it having base power 1 is a bit of a bummer. Go go Cosmos Charger! Sadly, Ranar the Ever-Watchful can't have this.
Birgi: Move over Kernaos and Toralf Flip, this is the real storm god! Boast doesn't have much support in EDH tho imo. I'm not sure about the artifact side, it can certainly be card advantage but CMC 5 is pretty expensive.
Dragonkin Berserker: Reminiscent of Dragonmaster Outcast
The Three Seasons: that last ability is pretty strange; would exiling other people's stuff have been too much of a bend?
January 18, 2021 12:42 p.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #19
I am very disappointed that The Three Seasons can return only snow permanents, since that severely limits that enchantment's usefulness.
The flavor text on Glacial Pillar confirms that Valki is an actual person, and not merely an alter ego conceived by Tibalt, so I wonder if the real Valki shall appear in a future set?
January 18, 2021 4:46 p.m.
Hi_diddly_ho_neighbor says... #20
Doomskar might just be top 3 in mono-white board wipes. Three mana to wipe the board is crazy strong. I still think the modality of Austere Command and Cleansing Nova put those two over the top, but I'd gladly play Doomskar over just about any of the 4+ cmc mono-white wraths.
January 18, 2021 6:26 p.m.
Xianling69 says... #21
DemonDragonJ: the card is clearly meant for snow decks. the card is fine the way it is. if it could return any kind of "non snow" permanent, the card would be absolutely busted and likely see play even in legacy for the ability to return fetch lands from your graveyard to hand.
January 18, 2021 11:39 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #22
Orvar, the All-Form: No doubt some combos to be had here, just mind that you're just getting one copy per spell, no matter how many it targets. No dice with Gigadrowse since you're not casting the copied spells. Spells that get bounced back by Krark, the Thumbless still trigger. Also, it doesn't just work with creatures!
Runeforge Champion: This along with Runed Crown makes me doubt they'll ever be able to go too far with Runes. Also, (narrow) mana fixing in .
January 19, 2021 12:37 p.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #23
I think that the black rune, rune of mortality, is too cheap at 2 mana, given that it grants deathtouch; I understand the desire of symmetry with that cycle, but I would have made an exception for that card, because deathtouch is such a powerful mechanic.
I see that there are pegasi on Kaldhei, despite pegasi originating in Greek mythology, not Norse mythology, but, I suppose that, if Theros can have krakens, then Kaldheim can have pegasi.
January 19, 2021 1:13 p.m.
Xianling69 says... #24
DemonDragonJ: rune of mortality isn't even good, let alone "too cheap". if it were 3 mana, it'd be a common that never saw play. even as is, it'll only be useful in standard. you seem to be in the habit of overestimating cards, as well as bringing up greek/norse mythology. enough with the kraken and mythology stuff, we get it already. seeing as how nobody has responded to your point of norse mythology having krakens, i think its safe to assume nobody cares. it's a card game called "magic". its not real to begin with.
January 19, 2021 1:38 p.m.
DemonDragonJ are you happy with the Kraken you finally got in the set?
January 19, 2021 2:51 p.m.
Hi_diddly_ho_neighbor says... #27
Wow Orvar...just wow. Ignoring the fact that it easily goes infinite with Naru Meha, Master Wizard or Peregrine Drake & Co shenanigans, this card is extremely versatile. The fact that Orvar's ability can target lands is disgusting. I want to like this card because it seems like an interesting design, but I just know this thing will be oppressive when folks vomit out 10+ copies of Tidespout Tyrant or Agent of Treachery or just Scourge of Fleets every turn.
January 19, 2021 3:26 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #28
Use temporary copy effects like Mirror Mockery or Mirage Mirror, then have Orvar make a permanent copy
Hi_diddly_ho_neighbor: I don't think the Naru Meha loop works here, since her copied spells aren't cast either
January 19, 2021 3:43 p.m.
Hi_diddly_ho_neighbor says... #29
Coward_Token - It works, just slightly differently than the normal Naru Meha combo. Normally you need to cast Naru Meha with Ghostly Flicker on the stack in order to copy the spell and kick off the infinite combo, but with Orvar you can start the combo if Naru Meha is already on the battlefield. The clone will hit the battlefield before Ghostly Flicker resolves allowing you to copy the spell. Then you can proceed to execute the combo.
January 19, 2021 5:06 p.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #30
Xianling69, I simply feel that it is better to err on the side of caution and make a overcosted, rather than undercosted.
Also, if no one cared about from which real-world mythology krakens originated, why did WotC go to the effort to ensure that every native human on Tarkir, Kamigawa, and Kaladesh looked Asian and that every native human on Amonkhet looked Egyptian?
FSims81, yes, I am very happy that there is finally a kraken in this set.
January 19, 2021 8:28 p.m.
Xianling69 says... #31
DemonDragonJ: i simply feel that powerful cards are fine, and modern and legacy will become stale if we don't get powerful cards. and when i said nobody cares, i'm talking about the people here. not wotc. and with wotc, its obvious why they made those choices, because they don't want to get backlash for "whitewashing". your point of the appearances of humans is also completely irrelevant to your point of which mythology certain creatures come from. apples and oranges. i'd also say that of those 3 blocks, the only one where the people looked asian is kamigawa.
January 19, 2021 11:47 p.m.
I agree with Xianling69 - I would rather see Wizards push the envelope with powerful, undercosted cards than err on the side of overcosting. This is particularly true of cards with unique or unusual effects. Lots of really interesting effects are rendered unplayable because Wizards was too conservative with costing the effect.
A card that is overcosted becomes a dead card, languishing among the several thousand cards no one really cares about. Maybe it sees some play while it is in Standard, but eventually it will find itself consigned to oblivion. A card that is undercosted might cause problems for a while, but you can always ban it in formats where it is problematic, leaving it playable in one of the other formats where it might have an appropriate power level.
January 20, 2021 12:06 a.m.
RNR_Gaming says... #33
Way too much chaft in the current standard sets.
In zendikar rising you can pull a mythic showcase card and not break even. Basically, if it's not full art extended you're just burning money.
In Theros beyound death if you dont crack a Uro, kroxa or nyxbloom/show case cards you're probably netting a loss.
I hate that I cannot enjoy cracking packs anymore. Unless it's a special set.
January 20, 2021 12:33 a.m.
Xianling69 says... #34
RNR_Gaming if you're only cracking packs to get a return on your investment, then did you truly ever "enjoy" it to begin with? magic is a game. not an investment portfolio. if you want specific cards, buy singles. that has always been the better option for obtaining specific cards throughout all of mtg's history.
January 20, 2021 1:33 a.m.
Xianling69 says... #35
Mcat1999: i get that you're probably joking, but Karfell Harbinger likely won't see play outside of standard and pauper. spellslinger decks in nonrotating formats generally prefer Goblin Electromancer or Baral, Chief of Compliance. to put it another way, i don't think a white counterpart to harbinger would be the kind of white ramp you're looking for anyway. imagine if it produced white mana that could only be spent on enchantments. you probably wouldn't use it.
January 20, 2021 1:45 a.m.
Coward_Token says... #36
Mcat1999: jokes and power aside, has long had minor dork access by being secondary in permanent mana production
January 20, 2021 12:11 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #37
Anyway, wrapping things up with the Commander Decklist:
Pact of the Serpent: Cheaper Distant Melody, can also occasionally be used to kill/deck someone; passing the turn with infinitive* tokens can be dangerous.
Serpet's Soul-Jar: Kinda wished they let have this design space for itself trough Idol of Endurance but w/e. Also, would letting you choose the creature type on ETB have been too much?
Ethereal Valkyrie: Would have been kinda nice if this was mono- & CMC 4 or 5 with the draw part skipped
Spectral Deluge: Scourge of Fleets with the fins chopped off. Hard casting this feels a bit much, but the foretell cost makes this a fine wipe in mono- decks
Hero of Bretgard: I just wanted to express my happiness over "one or more" templating being followed by "that many"
PS. I'm kinda surprised Koma's Coil ended up being depicted as an actual separate creature; I figured it would be an image of the rest of Koma, Cosmos Serpent body which you could visually connect with it and each other recursively, S.N.O.T.-style, if you get what I mean
January 20, 2021 12:31 p.m.
Hi_diddly_ho_neighbor says... #38
So with everything revealed now, some final thoughts:
-
The new mechanics feel balanced and on the surface don't look too busted.
-
There are some strong cards but nothing crazy powerful. Overall the set as a whole looks like it is taking a step back in power level which I think is a good thing.
-
I love the fact that we have a new type of dual lands and that the entire cycle was completed in one go.
-
We have a squirrel legend finally, though it isn't tribal focused which is unfortunate, but it's still strong and I can't complain
-
They again did a good job with the set commander precons. I might actually pick up "Phantom Premonition" because Foretell seems like a cool mechanic and Ranar, unlike most blink commanders, actually feels like he is working towards ending the game instead of durdling. Plus it is already well put together
-
I definitely think I will be building Kardur. He is well designed, has a fun ability, and he fits right into the power level that I am looking for in my next deck.
Overall I think the set looks like pretty solid.
January 20, 2021 7:08 p.m.
Dead2Value7theredo says... #39
how is this set not insane they brought back posion and orvar is insanely easy to go off
January 21, 2021 8:22 a.m.
Xianling69 says... #40
Dead2Value7theredo the poison support is minimal and requires the deck be basically entirely devoted to deathtouch. as for orvar, i don't know of any blue decks outside standard that target their own permanents with anything. the set isn't "insane" because it doesn't offer a lot to nonrotating formats.
January 21, 2021 12:02 p.m.
Hi_diddly_ho_neighbor says... #41
Dead2Value7theredo - Poison isn't as strong as infect since it doesn't scale with a creature's power. It will always be two poison counters in regards to Fynn. I find it interesting that they are using poison again. My guess is that moving forward, poison will return in place of infect since the latter is such a powerful and controversial mechanic. Orvar is indeed pretty powerful though, definitely a kill on sight commander.
January 21, 2021 11:27 p.m.
RNR_Gaming says... #42
Orvar - will more than likely be the definitive High Tide commander.
Bigri - fits very well into a few high teir commanders but probably won't be enough on it's own.
Aegar - I think this card has real potential. It's basically overkill (mechanic from hearthstone) edric spellslinger.
Valki - has some cool interactions with cascade but I see it as more of an in the 99 card in specifically kroxa and Yidris.
Tergrid - too strong for casual too weak for cedh. This card is an incredible value engine it may slot nicely into a reanimator strategy but it'd be fighting for the slot against some very heavy hitters.
Jord - has a cool way to break parity with Stasis and is essentially a Bear Umbra for snow stuff but even with this set it wouldn't put him above the other BUG commanders in terms of power.
I personally don't think anything outside of tibalts tricky and mystic reflection will see more than fringe play and the power level overall is about a 5-6 for most of the set.
January 22, 2021 12:13 a.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #43
Tibalt's Trickery is a red counterspell, so what does everyone here think about it? Is it an outright break of the color pie, or merely a strong bend? I personally think that it is an acceptable bend because it embodies red's focus on chaos and randomness, but I definitely would have had it cost , because that effects very strongly red. Also, why does it have the player mill card before exiling and casting? Was there any good reason for that?
January 24, 2021 9:55 a.m.
Coward_Token says... #44
's polymorph effects are meant to be random, as opposed to 's more deterministic ones. The random mill is probably to make it so that you can't reliably stack your deck and then Trickery one of your own spells.
January 24, 2021 10:17 a.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #45
Coward_Token, that makes sense, but I find it interesting that WotC had the foresight to avoid that, but could not find a way to prevent Oko, Thief of Crowns from being overpowered.
January 24, 2021 7:14 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #46
Small update: while it was implied by new templating in the reminder text, the rules now explicitly states that Snow rituals like Tundra Fumarole also produce mana. (Previously, the rules only allowed Snow permanents to make .)
https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/comprehensive-rules-changes-2021-02-02
February 2, 2021 12:16 p.m.
Coward_Token says... #47
DemonDragonJ: maybe not the Standard-legalness you wanted, but...
February 10, 2021 12:19 p.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #48
Coward_Token, I just saw that article, several hours ago, and I am very pleased to see that WotC is reprinting both Frost Titan and Inferno Titan on the plane of Kaldheim, even if they were not in the actual set, and they even included Primeval Titan and Grave Titan as bonuses; I noticed that Sun Titan is conspicuously absent, so, apparently, WotC likely felt that that creature was not sufficiently "metal" compared to the others.
I cannot stand the sickeningly cute artwork on the cards in the Valentine's Day set, which is especially annoying, because Gisela, Blade of Goldnight is one of my favorite creatures in the game, and I definitely would like to have had alternate artwork of her that was actually awesome and aesthetically pleasing.
February 10, 2021 5:54 p.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #49
Coward_Token, I also am very surprised that True Love's Kiss is not in the Valentine's Day Secret Lair, since it would obviously be a perfect match for that set.
February 11, 2021 6:52 a.m.
DemonDragonJ says... #50
Apparently, WotC changed the functionality of the cascade mechanic, after the release of this set, but, since I really use cards with that mechanic, I do not fully understand this change; how, exactly did WotC change that mechanic, and why did they make that change?
Coward_Token says... #1
Aegar, Freezing Flame: once lethal damage has been dealt to an enemy indestructible creature (not necessarily by you) (deathtouch counts), you can hit it repeatedly for 1 damage and get a draw each time
Saga: Kinda obvious, but like with Vona, Butcher of Magan you can tap vigilance Angels while they've attacking
January 13, 2021 5:25 p.m.