The most broken card in MTG?
General forum
Posted on Feb. 17, 2014, 5:44 p.m. by iamacasual
Earlier today I had a discussion with one of my friends about the SINGLEMOST most broken card in MTG (in other words, a card that doesn't rely on a brew/combo or board state to be broken/overpowered). We narrowed it down to Jace, the Mind Sculptor and Ancestral Recall but we couldn't decide which one was more broken. On one hand, JtMS wins games on his own because he can do quite literally everything: creature bounce (bye-bye, Show and Tell Emrakul), free Brainstorm , Precognition on any player, and his ultimate basically says, "You can try, but you won't win."
On the other hand, Ancestral Recall is an unconditional draw three, which, in Vintage, often wins you the game on the turn you play it.
In my mind, JtMS is more broken because he's used to great effect in both formats and AR is limited to Vintage, and just as a singleton, so its power is limited.
What are your thoughts on the most broken card in the game? Is my choice correct, or do you think another one is more overpowered on its own?
miracleHat says... #3
the Charging Badger (honey badger) don't give a shit about this vintage crap. anyways, my favorite overpowered card would be Channel , turn 1 most things sounds really good!
February 17, 2014 6:02 p.m.
Flying, can't be countered, protection from colored spells, Annihilator six.When you summon this card, take an extra turn after this one.When it goes to the graveyard, shuffle graveyard into library.
February 17, 2014 6:12 p.m.
miracleHat says... #5
I feel as though Emrakul, the Aeons Torn with Channel is pretty broken. Anybody agree? Also, i think that Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker deserves an honorable mention for being nicol bolas as a planeswalker.
February 17, 2014 6:15 p.m.
iamacasual says... #6
Emrakul is balanced with his high casting cost. Plus, just because you Sneak Attack and Show and Tell him out doesn't mean an insta-win (remember that cheating him out doesn't count as casting so you don't get that extra turn). I've seen someone come back from a Sneak Attack Emrakul.
February 17, 2014 6:17 p.m.
Bolas is an eight drop. By then the game is either over or something can kill him. Jace the Mind F***er is much more OP
February 17, 2014 6:18 p.m.
Force of Will is the most broken card in Magic hands down. Why is this even a debate?
February 17, 2014 6:20 p.m.
iamacasual says... #9
By the way, to all the people saying Channel + Emrakul: this isn't a 2-card OP play, it's a single card OP play.
February 17, 2014 6:21 p.m.
iamacasual says... #10
I don't think FoW is OP because you only use it once. JtMS is essentially unlimited uses.
February 17, 2014 6:22 p.m.
iamacasual Only problem with what you said is most decks that run Emrakul, run the deck with him in mind. I have a friend who runs him, he can get him out, consistently on turn 4. It's not fun to go up against.
February 17, 2014 6:22 p.m.
iamacasual says... #12
So the cheat-out-Emrakul combo is OP, but the card on its own is not, wouldn't you say? If those decks had no way to cast Emrakul without having 15 lands, he wouldn't be OP anymore. JtMS is OP because he comes out turn 4 and has an answer for just about everything. Also, Emrakul is put in decks that brew around him. JtMS can be put in any deck that runs blue--much more versatile.
February 17, 2014 6:26 p.m.
Its definitely a tie between Storm Crow and Charging Badger . Storm Crow has the advantage in my book. I really have to stop posting these things.
February 17, 2014 6:36 p.m.
miracleHat says... #15
@flyguy: YES! Somebody else who loves the honey badger!
Anyways, check out this link
the list for the lazy people is:
1. Black Lotus
2. Ancestral Recall
3. Yawgmoth's Will
4. The Moxes
5. Time Walk
6. Tinker
7. Force of Will
8. Demonic Tutor
9. Fastbond
10. Mana Drain
11. Sol Ring
12. Necropotence
13. Memory Jar
14. Balance
15. Strip Mine
16. Tolarian Academy
17. Yawgmoth's Bargain
18. Vampiric Tutor
19. Library of Alexandria
20. The ABU Dual Lands
21. Wheel of Fortunes
22. Mana Crypt
23. Timetwister
24. Brainstorm
25. Channel
26. Bazaar of Baghdad
27. Skullclamp
28. Flash
29. Time Vault
30. Dark Ritual
31. Mind's Desire
32. Oath of Druids
33. Mishra's Workshop
34. Wasteland
35. Earthcraft
36. Umezawa's Jitte
37. Maze of Ith
38. Demonic Consultation
39. Black Vise
40. Chaos Orb
41. Swords to Plowshares
42. Tarmogoyf
43. 44. Worldgorger Dragon
45. Windfall
46. Survival of the Fittest
47. Land Tax
48. Mind Twist
49. Daze
50. Hymn to Tourach
51. Counterspell
52. Lotus Petal
53. Imperial Seal
54. Show and Tell
55. Time Spiral
56. The Onslaught/Zendikar Fetchlands
57. Isochron Scepter
58. Dream Halls
59. Mystical Tutor
60. Dark Confidant
61. Gush
62. Aether Vial
63. Lion's Eye Diamond
64. Tendrils of Agony
65. The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
66. Entomb
67. Sensei's Divining Top
68. Reanimate
69. Natural Order
70. Gifts Ungiven
71. Grindstone
72. Fact or Fiction
73. Hermit Druid
74. Goblin Welder
75. Sneak Attack
76. Berserk
77. Goblin Recruiter
78. Frantic Search
79. Goblin Lackey
80. Chrome Mox
81. Burning Wish
82. Rishadan Port
83. Orim's Chant
84. Lightning Bolt
85. Moat
86. The Mirrodin Artifact Lands + Darksteel Citadel
87. Enlightened Tutor
88. Stifle
89. Eureka
90. Aluren
91. Jace, the Mind Sculptor
92. Pox
93. Trinisphere
94. Rancor
95. Standstill
96. Mishra's Factory
97. Armageddon/Ravages of War
98. Sword of Fire and Ice
99. Bridge from Below
100. Gaea's Cradle
And there was no way that i was going to take the time to link all of the cards.
February 17, 2014 6:43 p.m.
jace, the mind sculptor isn't even close to the most broken card in Magic. The only debate is between Black Lotus and Ancestral Recall . Third place goes to Time Walk , then something like:
- Black Lotus
- Ancestral Recall
- Time Walk
- Mox Sapphire
- Mox Jet
- Mox Ruby /Mox Pearl
- Mox Emerald
- Timetwister
- Tolarian Academy
- Sol Ring
- Mana Crypt
- Yawgmoth's Will
- Library of Alexandria
- Strip Mine
- Tinker
- Balance
- Demonic Tutor
- Vampiric Tutor
- Fastbond
- Mana Vault
- through 30. Mishra's Workshop , Mana Drain , Gush , Mystical Tutor , Imperial Seal , Black Vise , Yawgmoth's Bargain , Necropotence , Memory Jar , and Bazaar of Baghdad fill out the rest of the top 30 in no particular order.
A special shoutout can be given to Contract from Below . Seven cards for one black is ridiculous. The only downside is that it can only be used in games for ante. Otherwise, it would take the place of Ancestral Recall and maybe even Black Lotus .
The thing about jace, the mind sculptor is that he's a permanent that costs four. Repeatable Brainstorm s, Unsummon s, and fateseals is powerful, yes. However, it can come at a serious cost if your opponent has any answer. Countering a Brainstorm can be rough. But it only cost you a single blue, not 2UU. Brainstorm also doesn't get stopped by Lightning Bolt , creatures, and Dreadbore .
The "dies to Doomblade" argument is normally pretty bad. In this case, however, there are more comparisons between jace, the mind sculptor and other cards to find his power level. There's a reason he isn't banned in Legacy and is unrestricted in Vintage.
As for Force of Will , it really is one of the least efficient counterspells in the game. You get automatically two-for-one'd. It's card disadvantage. It's just a necessary part of the game, however, to prevent your opponent from blowing you out early in the game when you don't have the resources to respond with regular countermagic. Or when you have to tap out and make an important play.
February 17, 2014 7:08 p.m.
February 17, 2014 7:09 p.m.
Ashnod's Coupon is OP. Some asshole targeted Crystal Pepsi with it. I didn't know what the fuck to do.
February 17, 2014 9:06 p.m.
PrimeEpoch says... #21
Clearly Broken Visage ! See what I've done there?
February 17, 2014 9:08 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #22
Is Crystal Pepsi a legal target? It was removed from the game after all.
February 17, 2014 9:27 p.m.
It totally was. Many are in exile, but there's still one or two hidden in play under some lands.
February 17, 2014 9:42 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #26
Wow just checked Ebay. They run over 20 bucks. That is quite the tab that person has to pick up there.
February 17, 2014 9:45 p.m.
I think it is Mindless Null (zendikar common)This card is so OP
February 18, 2014 1:48 a.m.
NotSoLuckyLydia says... #29
I can't take anything like this seriously, because people always comment on it saying Force of Will .
February 18, 2014 1:56 a.m.
@NotSoLuckyLydia: This thread was better than the last one I saw about the best card in the game. There were a bunch of people saying Consecrated Sphinx was better than Black Lotus because Black Lotus is a horrible topdeck lol....
February 18, 2014 5:10 a.m.
PrimeEpoch says... #31
sylvannos, tell me who they were, and I'll get myself a Consecrated Sphinx ;)
February 18, 2014 6:31 a.m.
@nayaftw: lol it was a thread from a few months ago. I don't remember who was talking there. I just remember thinking: "Am I playing the same game as these people?"
February 18, 2014 8:35 a.m.
lord_of_the_snakes says... #33
Apocalypse Chime , it burys everything from homelands
February 18, 2014 9:26 a.m.
PrimeEpoch says... #34
sylvannos, that's a shame, I was hoping to get a black lotus... :(
February 18, 2014 9:29 a.m.
nobu_the_bard says... #35
Particularly because there is no limit on the number that can be in the deck. It's also viable in all formats! I'm surprised it's still legal.
February 18, 2014 9:54 a.m.
PrimeEpoch says... #39
It's clearly Great Wall , cause those 4 creatures with plainswalk are going to cause big problems... Yes, there are only 4 cards in the entire game that have plainswalk, and one of them is from unhinged...
February 18, 2014 12:39 p.m.
jpgcoleman says... #40
What is the definition of broken? Is it the card that wins the game or the card that enables it to be done faster. Magic already has a list of broken cards which it maintains called the restricted and banned list. Ancestral Recall and Black Lotus don't win the game they enable other cards to do so. the best answer to the question is it depends.
February 18, 2014 1:01 p.m.
Chaos Orb strictly from the stories I have heard about people tearing them up in the early days. did this really happen? because if it did, then I'd say that the the most broken usage of a card I can imagine.
February 18, 2014 3:06 p.m.
Most broken Cards in MTG Rest in Peace , with Helm of Obedience . :)
February 18, 2014 3:44 p.m.
The legacy banlist is the way that it is for a reason. JTMS doesn't even register in the top 20 worst cards.
The number 1 most broken card is Contract from Below
But the runners up include(in no particular order):
Flash
Mind Twist
Tinker
Necropotence
Ancestral Recall
Yawgmoth's Will
Sol Ring
Black Lotus
Time Vault
Library of Alexandria
Memory Jar
Hermit Druid
Channel
Tolarian Academy
February 18, 2014 3:53 p.m.
with literally broken cards being
I'd consider those 3 the most "broken" because they're cards that were used in unintended ways, rather than just being abstractly good.
February 18, 2014 4:04 p.m.
NotSoLuckyLydia says... #45
You're right, Sam_I_am, and anybody who has ever played Shandalar will know exactly what you mean. That card is hilariously busted.
Bobgalarneau says... #2
Storm Crow
These threads have to stop........
February 17, 2014 5:48 p.m.