At the beginning of each player's upkeep, that player discards a card.
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|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Necrogen Mists occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.01%
Necrogen Mists Discussion
4 weeks ago
I know this is probably one of the worst cards for multiplayer ever, but Grip of Chaos seems legitimately good for your deck as an on-curve way to protect Kaervek pretty much forever against any targeted removal.
Captive Audience is both a hug and a slug at once. Seems to fit the bill here.
Allure of the Unknown seems like a great way to get some card advantage and also get an opponent to cast a spell for you and trigger Kaervek.
Koskun Falls is a good way to dissuade attacks. You won't mind tapping even your Commander for this.
Xantcha, Sleeper Agent seems good to get opponents to spend mana to kill another opponent and get cards out of it.
Forcing opponents to discard their cards will also encourage them to play more aggressively. It also gives opponents less answers for your main strategy. You wouldn't want to focus on it too much, but a few key cards could be really fun. Rankle, Master of Pranks is pretty versatile, Sire Of Insanity might be overkill, Awaken the Erstwhile is still group-huggy, and then there's Bottomless Pit, Necrogen Mists and Cunning Lethemancer for continual discard.
Dash Hopes is one of the first cards I would remove from the deck. Gremlin Infesation, Tibalt and Judith all seem underwhelming.
1 month ago
Ah, I have piloted a mono-black discard deck for quite the number of years. I have Chainer, Dementia Master at the helm myself, as he is a rather powerful card when everyone's hands are empty, thus he reigns unanswered. Therefrom, a great amount of methods may be used to win.
Tinybones is less of a finisher itself, more so a value engine. As such, I would recommend possessing a lower curve to take advantage of the card draw and more potent finishers within the deck to hent for victory. Also, having card draw outside of the commander would grant a better backup plan. A discard deck's goal is to empty each opponent's hand and win by going unthreatened. If no players have cards to discard, Tinybones cannot provide draw.
The changes I would make are more instants so you kill things once they resolve as opposed to waiting a full turn, swifter discard in the early game to make your commander more effective, stronger finishers for the sake of ending the game betime, and just cutting some cards.
So, first, there are some things I would remove.
- Murderous Compulsion may go with the discard theme, but it's conditional removal at sorcery-speed.
- Bad Deal is ironically a bad deal, as it is six mana for two cards gone.
- Assassin's Strike is just egregious. A six-mana sorcery to kill one thing and they discard but one card. Begone.
- Unnerve is fine but not great. Being a one time effect at four mana, I dislike it, though Xantcha is a great character in the art.
- Haunting Hymn is six mana, which is far too late for discard effects to be effective. You want discard early, as it makes it far more difficult for decks to catch their footing.
- I have the same reason for Tasigur's Cruelty.
- Cabal Conditioning has an identical reason.
- I have a shortlist for this category, being creatures without long-game value; Burglar Rat, Liliana's Reaver, and Banshee of the Dread Choir have discard stapled to them, but don't do much else whilst lacking much in terms of evasion for Larceny.
- Scythe Specter is slow and other cards just do its job better, and Herald of Anguish is slow and lacks fodder for its second ability.
- Necrogen Spellbomb is just crap. Two mana for one card from a single player's hand is awful. Don't play this.
- Awaken the Erstwhile neglects the game plan of having more cards than your opponents whilst lacking the option of going back. I'd just add a stronger finisher.
Alright. With that out of the way, I may suggest other cards.
Upon card draw, you have none outside of the Trinket Thief, Rankle, and Geth's Grimoire. I'd add any of Phyrexian Arena, Sign in Blood, Underworld Connections, and Dread Presence. Necropotence may seem as if it negates the strategy, but it is always worth it.
Lightning Greaves just seem great.
Now, for the finishers I have many. Do note that these are meant to be played when people haven't any cards in hand, hence lacking answers for these once on the field. Sheoldred, the Whispering One grants value from each player's bin whiles eating at their board. Abhorrent Overlord offers a swarm of flyers to end the game. Grave Titan is much the same. Archfiend of Despair goes well with Tinybones's second ability. Though I am not too fond of it, Archfiend of Spite offers much. Geth, Lord of the Vault hents the opponent's graveyards to swarm the board. Kokusho, the Evening Star is a massive threat that harms upon death. Kothophed allows for a quite a bit of card draw. Lord of the Void is always fun. Lastly, Gray Merchant of Asphodel does so much every time it hits the field.
Of course, I'd add more ramp and reanimation. Mind Stone, Arcane Signet, Charcoal Diamond, and Lake of the Dead are great for ramp. Animate Dead, Reanimate, and Dread Return are fine ways to get stuff from anyone's yard, save for the Return.
That shall be all from me. Do enjoy your day!
1 month ago
Thank you folks for your comments and suggestions! I'll be addressing both of you and each of your suggestions in order of appearance within this message for the sake of being concise.
theseax After much playtesting, I have made the seemingly controversial decision of cutting Cabal Coffers and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth from the list. The pairing itself was a little too cute for my liking as I could never consistently boot it. Even then, on its own, Cabal Coffers requires three other land drops, specifically being swamps in order to net any sort of valuable return from it. Since the mindset of this deck is rather all-in, it often wants to pressure a win between turns 3 and 5, so I've personally opted in favor of a more consistent manabase by dropping the pair. As such, Manascape Refractor probably isn't for this deck I'm afraid. It sort of faces the same issue I had with running Urborg, making it rather dead outside of being used in conjunction with Coffers, especially since I wasn't on Mana Web either.
Meessee Chain of Smog is interesting, but I feel like it could often backfire onto me rather than being a comparable mass discard outlet. Arterial Flow seems solid, although I'm tending to favor permanents like Necrogen Mists and Bottomless Pit that can continuously accrue and churn out card advantage for me in the presence of Tinybones while disrupting my opponents. Tasigur's Cruelty is a rather high top end in the presence of Dark Confidant when I'm already running a risky top end on my curve with him.
Since I'm on Shadowbag, I greatly value the cleanup step at the end of my turn to serve as a sort of discard outlet in case I don't have Skirge Familiar or Zombie Infestation in play to do it for me. Anvil of Bogardan is probably not for my list.
Plain and simple, I like Karn, the Great Creator. Will consider.
For Geier Reach Sanitarium, I think my playgroup is going to appreciate me giving them looting effects a little too much, so I'm going to have to pass on that. I'm also not a huge fan of how Nezumi Shortfang Flip targets a single player and I don't get to see their hand and choose which card they discard.
I don't feel as though I have enough creatures to sacrifice consistently to Contamination in order to keep that sort of effect around, and through a similar vein, Infernal Darkness becomes heavily taxing on me with its cumulative upkeep trigger. I want the stax pieces I'm running to not heavily impact my lines of play while also being able to stick on the board once they resolve without any sort of maintenance conditions associated with them if that makes sense.
Conqueror's Flail is a little too dicey to run in my opinion. It's a bit expensive to boot for a Grand Abolisher effect, and I'm often sacrificing creatures on my board to Razaketh or fast mana outlets so that would be an added layer to play around and pay attention to. I like Defense Grid in here though, considering in conjunction with Shimmer Myr I could play it as a sort of interruption at instant speed to protect my combo from folding to interaction. It's just one of those cards that I should only play when I think I'm going to win and not play it just because I have to mana open to play it. The table often relies on interaction so I could otherwise kingmake if I'm not careful about it. Lastly, Boseiju, Who Shelters All probably won't get enough traction in this deck considering most of my instants and sorceries are either tutors or disruption. A protected Goryo's Vengeance or Shallow Grave would be nice, but if I was on more impactful instants like Ad Nauseam my answer might be a bit different.
Hope I addressed everything fully. Thanks again!
1 month ago
2 months ago
Land Tax is an auto-include if you never want to miss a land drop ever again. It also makes playing a turn 3 Blood Moon easy to work with. Makes surviving and using mass land wipes fun too. Goes great with Ghost Town if you never want to miss those triggers.
But Land Tax reaches Skullclamp levels of broken if you pair it with Scroll Rack, Tectonic Reformation, Neheb, Dreadhorde Champion, Necrogen Mists, Stronghold Rats, Raven's Crime or Seasoned Pyromancer with all the excess lands you can throw away. It even makes Sensei's Divining Top godly if you can shuffle your deck with Land Tax every turn before your draw step. (Even if there’s no more basic lands in the deck, that free shuffle can be great with SD-Top and Scroll Rack.) Without that extra oomph Land Tax doesn’t really bring much to the table late game, but it can feel like a Sol Ring in the early game if your deck runs a below average number of lands.
3 months ago
Chainer, Nightmare Adept is a pretty bread and butter reanimator strategy. The bonus is you save slot efficiency by having a discard outlet in the command zone. I'd also peek at the handful of "everybody discard" effects like Oppression Bottomless Pit and Necrogen Mists because Chainer plays well from the GY. You can also accelerate faster than normal by running Reanimate or Animate Dead or other cards that let you play from the GY for cheaper than casting cost.
4 months ago
I want to preface this with a couple of things. First, I'm not sure what power level you're building this deck for. I tend to build decks between 6-9, so some of my suggestions might not be the best fit. Second, based on the current price of the deck, I imagine this is more of a budget build. So I'll try to keep my recommendations within a decent price point.
Now, let's talk about what you've got. I don't want to pick apart your creature selection card by card. Rather, I want to know why you chose the creatures that you chose. Obviously, Kathril wants cards in your graveyard to have a bunch of keywords, but those creatures aren't always going to be there. You're going to need to play them some times. It's important that the creatures that you put in do something on the field too. I do want to call out a few cards that I feel like will not do what you want them to do.
- Gravebreaker Lamia: The CMC is much too high are what you're getting
- Night Incarnate: Same issue
- Anvil of Bogardan: You don't have a good way to make use of your opponents getting card advantage too
- Arguel's Blood Fast Flip: Doesn't do a lot
- Asceticism: It's a pricy card for a deck that should already be giving its stuff hexproof
I'm not seeing a wincon in here either. I know Kathril can be a big flying force, but if that is your main plan, you should be packing a pretty strong sub-strategy. I think hand destruction would be a strong choice for this deck. Cards like Oppression and Necrogen Mists give you a way to discard cards without making you fall behind. I saw Noose Constrictor in the maybeboard. That is a prime example of something that you should avoid. Yes, discarding a keyword-soup creature will help you with Kathril but you will not be getting a card's worth of value from that. When you discard a card, you want to make should that you are not falling behind. So, either everyone needs to discard too or you need to get a card back (like with Fauna Shaman).
Now, here's the fun bit. With group discard effects, there will be a lot of creatures in graveyards (or at least yours). I would run a suite of reanimation spells, Reanimate, Animate Dead, and even a finisher like Rise of the Dark Realms. This will turn already good discard effects into massive value.
Next, let's talk about ramp. A great way to work in ramp that isn't too pricy are two-drop rocks. In basically all of my decks, I run every signet and talisman (like Talisman of Resilience) that I can. In this deck, that's 6 cards of solid power. Also, Fellwar Stone goes in basically all my decks too. It's just solid. I also want to point out Knight of the White Orchid. It has a keyword that's relevant and ramps you. Also, it's not technically ramp but does a great job here, Life from the Loam.
Lastly, your removal needs work. I would try to work in some of the following because they are good and efficient.
Overall, I think you're well on your way to having a fun deck!!
If you want some inspiration of a hand-destruction/reanimation/aristocrats style deck, check out my Liliana deck here.
4 months ago
Sorry to hear about your playgroup! Mine sort of discontinued as well but that’s because everyone just got busy. After this whole Covid-19 shakes out I’m hoping to start playing at my local LGS on Friday nights (that’s their EDH night) and just maybe I’ll coordinate getting the old group back together. I think I’ve played about 6-7 games in the last 6 months. Not at all the amount I wish I was playing.
Yeah that’s a great way of looking at this deck, especially like you say Golgari is really good at bringing stuff back from the graveyard. With my meta, people finally started waking up to graveyard hate though so it became rather null and void if I brought him back from the graveyard or just kept paying the commander tax. Now the lockout creatures and empty hands is also very different too. I’m nearly tempted to adapt the latter (I really want to pick up a Necrogen Mists, brings me back to when I first started playing magic). The board full of creatures I’m sure works, but I feel more comfortable limiting the amount of creatures here unless they are big time plays like Forgotten Ancient or Necropolis Regent.
So I just found out about the Mystery Boosters the other day. Are they available right now and how much are they going for? Is there a list of what cards you can get from those packs? What cards are you considering at this time you werent before because of price?
Yeah you’re not kidding about Hydra's Growth. That card is dope! I actually picked up a Shadowspear a few weeks ago and I have to say that would be another fantastic card for this deck. I’m not sure if I’m putting it in this deck or my Jor-Kadeen brew (it’s more equipment/artifact focused). But my lawd, is that de-hexproofing ability friggin bonkers... I had to get it as soon as I saw that.