Board Wipes / Wraths / spot removal

Commander (EDH) forum

Posted on July 25, 2014, 12:08 p.m. by peru_soldi

Hi all

i know this all depends on the type of deck, but it is nice to have a guideline

i was just wondering how many "wrath" effect cards and spot removal cards do you guys use in a commander deck. (regardless of colour)

I usually use 3 wrath effects cards and 7 spot removal cards (out of the 7, 2 are for artifacts / enchantments removal and 1 for permanent removal). for spot removal it does not have to be exile, it can be destroy or bounce.

thoughts? i am trying to figure out if there is a sweet spot or a minimum threshold

thanks :D

DrLitebur says... #2

I really think it depends on your deck. My own Damia, Sage of Stone deck uses I think 4 board wipes, including the new Perilous Vault , and several spot wipes. I like exile over destroy, especially for enchantments or creatures, because of the presence of Gods now, and that deals with them better. But anyways, I think it depends on your meta, and on your deck's needs.

July 25, 2014 12:46 p.m.

NoSkillManiac says... #3

My decks Vary. Hanna Runs 7 Sweepers and a good chunk of spot removal because she's a pillow fort deck. (I think 3 instant targeted removal and 2 repeatable targeted removal), whereas my teneb deck relies on Sheoldred and like 5 sweepers to keep the board clear.

July 25, 2014 12:58 p.m.

GoofyFoot says... #4

I have 2 EDH decks, both with very different removal. My Zur, Pillowfight Champion has 4 wipes and about 20 spot removal, most which is searchable by him.

My mono black edh has 4ish board wipes, and little to no spot removal. What spot removal I do have is things like Attrition .

It all depends on what you want to do with the deck.

July 25, 2014 7:02 p.m.

FancyTuesday says... #5

However many wraths you're running, add more. Always more. Don't stop until you're at 60 wraths and 39 lands.

My decks average about 6 board sweepers and I'm always looking for slots to add more. It's no more difficult for your opponents than it is for you to reach a board state that requires a wrath to stop them from winning in a matter of turns, if you don't have that answer you're done. Add to that the card advantage is just bananas in a multiplayer format.

Spot removal depends heavily on the colors, but as a general rule it has to be really damn good to be worth running. The name of the game is card advantage and that makes 1 to 1 card removal pretty weak. I look for things that:

The fewest I have in any deck is 6, but basically you put as many in there as you can fit while keeping your general theme functional and robust.

July 25, 2014 9:11 p.m.

phc says... #6

It really depends on the deck. I try to have at least four wraths and six spot removal in my decks, four of them being dedicated to creature removal/ exile. The more colors I'm running the better off I am usually. Mono white can do alright by itself, followed by black. Otherwise I'm relying on spells like All Is Dust or artifacts like Nevinyrral's Disk .

July 26, 2014 3:18 a.m.

peru_soldi says... #7

thanks guys!

sorry for the late response...

these are the cards that i usually use:

wipes:

Nevinyrral's Disk Oblivion Stone Cyclonic Rift

for spot removal i usually tend to stay with low costing cmc cards

July 28, 2014 10:01 a.m.

nobu_the_bard says... #8

It depends on the deck and circumstances. My LGS has a diverse crowd but the other players generally have stronger decks and more expensive cards than I do; I'm almost guaranteed to run into a Sword of Feast and Famine or Sword of Light and Shadow sometimes with a Umezawa's Jitte for some players, others will constantly play powerful enchantments like Mirari's Wake or an onslaught of expensive planeswalkers. The most cost-effective strategy for dealing with these things is having a removal suite that is flexible and fast (repeatable is less important, against the opponents I need the removal for, the game won't usually last long enough to matter, one way or another).

White is my favorite for removal, I like Swords to Plowshares , Return to Dust , Oblation , Illumination particularly. Wrath of God , Hour of Reckoning (my white decks tend to be token decks) have performed well. Against some opponents I need to hold back playing creatures until after the first board wipe usually to stall them and come out strong.

I like me some Tempest of Light and Leave No Trace for mass enchantment removal; wish I had budgeted for an Austere Command though.

Blue is pretty good but more conditional and more repeatable for removal; Capsize . Cyclonic Rift , Crystal Shard , Reality Strobe have all served me very well.

Black's alright for removal: Slaughter , Tragic Slip , Black Sun's Zenith , Bane of the Living have all served well.

Red and Green I don't have much removal for, but Hull Breach , Blasphemous Act , and Decimate have been pretty good.

Since my big threats are usually made worse by equipment, some of my decks run Tower of the Magistrate . It tends to throw those guys for a loop.

July 28, 2014 10:22 a.m.

NotSoLuckyLydia says... #9

Some of my decks run upwards of 25 pieces of spot removal with 5 board wipes (Zedruu), while some of my decks have as few as five pieces of creature removal, like ZoZu. It depends on what your goal with the deck is. Are you aggressive? Run less. Controlling? Run lots. Combo-y? Run lots of draw and tutors, maybe 1-3 board wipes, depending on your meta.

July 28, 2014 5:57 p.m.

masterosok says... #10

I run an Epser deck so lots of removal options. I prefer

Supreme Verdict (un-counteract itself), In Garruk's Wake (opponent only removal), Merciless Eviction (exile to get around indestructible), Cyclonic Rift (for Overload ... speaks for it self) Toxic Deluge (I gain a lot of life in my deck :P), Act of Authority (Enchant/Artifact removal but kind of risky the 2nd go around and I may end up replacing it)

The only spot removal I have is Ethersworn Adjudicator although I might find a spot for Slaughter due to the buyback.

July 28, 2014 6:28 p.m.

This discussion has been closed