- 2x Bloodmark Mentor
- 2x Goblin Chieftain
- 2x Goblin Chirurgeon
- 2x Goblin Fireslinger
- 2x Goblin Firestarter
- 2x Skirk Prospector
- 2x Voracious Dragon
- 2x Burn at the Stake
- 2x Dragon Fodder
- 2x Goblin Grenade
- 2x Goblin War Strike
- 2x Krenko's Command
- 2x Red Sun's Zenith
Noble limits you on rares and power. this does not. instead it forces you to focus on what are the best choices for your deck by forcing 2 of each card in your deck.
I'm not a big fan of the noble format, because it's far too limited in deck construction. I feel this format will be a lot more balanced and fun to build.
August 1, 2012 6:50 p.m.
Nice variation in that this format would requires some fancy deck building but no where near extreme as EDH or as limited as noble.
August 1, 2012 6:56 p.m.
This seems like a more expensive EDH. At least in EDH I only need one copy of the expensive cards I want to play with, and with the longer games of the format, cards that aren't viable in other formats -- and thus usually very cheap -- are playable.
Does the commander zone work the same way?
August 1, 2012 7:03 p.m.
It seems to me that the HERO is any creature. And isn't determined by rarity or Legend. As for the cards. The only restriction is "2 of" which unlike EDH or Noble as the '1 of' and Noble is 4 uncommons and the rest commons.
August 1, 2012 7:04 p.m.
KevinLS yes the commander zone works the same way. and Jokernaught when played i'm 100% sure this will have it's own feel to it. Yes any creature can be your hero, though that doesn't mean any creature will make a good hero.
I wanted to build this format to promote faster game play while keeping everything balanced. the most expensive cards won't particularly be the best in this format, and neither will the most "powerful" cards.
Commander is my favorite format, but I find a lot of people don't want to play 1+ hour matches.
August 1, 2012 7:51 p.m.
Also, this format looks a hell ov' a lot more combo friendly since you're not limited to one of each card and it's a 60(+1) card deck.
August 1, 2012 7:56 p.m.
yes combo's are allowed, though it is a casual format, so if too many people complain about an unfair combo it will probably be removed. this is currently the alpha, and there are bound to be rule changes. I'm hoping to get people to test this format and give feedback. I know i'm going to make a few decks to test out at my local store.
August 1, 2012 8:40 p.m.
I was just noting the similarities. It looks like it will catch on, I definitely will be building a deck around this and introducing it to my play group.
August 1, 2012 10:57 p.m.
I wonder if it will catch on enough to get it's own Format button.
August 1, 2012 11:06 p.m.
Here's my second Hero deck Sliver Hero just showing the kind of fun people can have with this format.
August 2, 2012 3:09 a.m.
Sweet. I'll be introducing this deck:golgari-hero to some friends in a few days. It does have a different feel the noble but is like shortcut EDH. I like it.
August 2, 2012 3:34 a.m.
I made three decks all based off of EDH decks I already own.
August 2, 2012 4:11 a.m.
I like the idea. I enjoy EDH a great deal and this seems like a similar style/challenge for deck building that is unique nevertheless. Seems I might try my hand at a deck of this type.
August 2, 2012 7:36 p.m.
I just played a few games earlier with some friends. It was really interesting.
Whats up with the banned list? Is that what's illegal in commander? I recognize most of that list but Griselbrand ? Really?
August 2, 2012 7:48 p.m.
And here's my hand at a deck. Hero of the Parish (Hero Format). I figured I'd use the fact that any creature may be the Hero. Another idea that crossed my mind was Merfolk, use a less useful lord or clone as a Hero and fill your deck up with Merfolk.
August 2, 2012 8:31 p.m.
Seems like a fun idea I might introduce it to my friends but I know it would turn into a excuse to use dumb combos. But i really hopes this catches on
August 2, 2012 8:48 p.m.
Jokernaught, Griselbrand has been banned from edh since the first week of avacyn because of crazy draw and win. I might playtest him in this format but i don't think the outcome would be any different.
August 2, 2012 11:02 p.m.
That I didn't know. Griselbrand is a little uber powerful.
But it seems that this is really catching on. the Champion of the Parish on looks really cool. We need to get a specific page that we can use to post one another's decks. Somewhere in the general form, so we can have an accurate way of swapping ideas and deciding which combos need to be looked into. Rather then clutter this deck page.
August 3, 2012 2:54 a.m.
I set up a page on the forum for posting decks and discussing the format. The link is in the description. I just can't get it to directly link.
August 3, 2012 3:28 a.m.
It seems like Griselbrand shouldn't be banned from this format given its constructed-style decks. It's crazy in EDH because that kind of card draw when you have 40 life to start with is just madness, but if you're running it like a more restricted constructed format (in which it is not banned) then there shouldn't be any problem with it. Perhaps banning it as a general but not as an element of a deck?
August 3, 2012 5:32 a.m.
It seems like this has a much different speed and different enough format to have a different banlist.
August 3, 2012 9:51 p.m.
Go ahead and run whatever you want. for now i just copied the ban list from edh, though sol ring was my personal ban. having 5 mana on turn one is too much. and you could still play a 3 cost colorless. thats not fun for anyone.
turn one play a land, play Sol Ring tap it to play another Sol Ring then tap that sol ring to play lets say Azorius Signet use the last floating mana to tap the signet and play a 2 cost creature or another signet. 6 to 7 mana turn one is too much and not fun for anyone.
August 4, 2012 12:22 a.m.
I agree with Sol Ring . 2 of them is way to powerful.
August 4, 2012 12:31 a.m.
I agree with Sol Ring . 2 of them is way to powerful.
August 4, 2012 12:32 a.m.
How does the Hero zone work? Just the same as commander zone, cause if so and without some of the ramp you can get in EDH, might it not be an idea to change the rules on Heros.
As an idea, what about letting Hero's go to the Graveyard, and be returnable to the Commander Zone by paying a mana cost? That way you can allow for more combos and reanimators. Or some other cost?
And are you going to relax the rules on card colour? For example, allow people to include lands that produce a colour according to hero and a colour that isn't a hero colour, but instead of producing the other colour, it produces colourless or something? I can just think of some good lands that are multiple coloured.
August 4, 2012 5:38 a.m.
Going outside of your heroes color identity utterly breaks the format. I won't be lax on that. The commander zone has always worked the same. you can choose to not use it after your hero/commander has been cast. shenanigans will all work the same.
I feel those rules are extremely solid and work well in this format. there are always going to be crazy combo's. regardless if you change the rules on the command zone.
August 6, 2012 12:28 a.m.
If this catches on let me know, TappedOut will officially support it if you maintain the list.
August 6, 2012 1:33 a.m.
I see this as being a great catalyst for those going from standard of vintage play to EDH.
August 6, 2012 5:50 p.m.
you guys inspired e to make one.
please take a look and give feedback
EDH is my favorite format, so i hope i can convince people to play this, to save those 1-5 hour games >.<
August 7, 2012 4:46 p.m.
I like this format idea a lot. My only concern is that it only seems to heavily favor tribal and possibly mill. It also doesn't seem to be able to go more than 2 colors but I would gladly be proven wrong. In any case I'll make a mill based deck and see how it plays out.
Here's a quick attempt at a UB Mill using Szadek, Lord of Secrets http://playtest.tappedout.net/hero-mill/
August 7, 2012 11:29 p.m.
Proven wrong. Haha deck:flicker-me-this-hero-format is a four color deck I built myself to see if it could be done. Check it out.
There is also a thread for Hero Decks specifically, instead of this deck.
August 8, 2012 2:02 a.m.
prototype deck, check it out you guys, let me know how you think it will do in this format.
August 8, 2012 6:24 a.m.
Just threw together Zendikar's Forest (Hero). I'm kind of digging this format. Looking forward to trying it out.
August 8, 2012 8:34 a.m.
If I have Dryad Arbor as my hero can I play a land and drop him turn 1? :-D
August 8, 2012 8:49 a.m.
No, basic rules of magic still are active. You can only play one land per turn, and Dryad Arbor is a land, regardless of it's Hero status.
August 8, 2012 8:52 a.m.
Please understand there is a forum thread for this.
There you can post your deck where other Hero Format players already posted thiers.
August 8, 2012 11:27 a.m.
If you want shorter Commander games, play with no more than 5 people (preferably 4), and try out 30-life life totals instead of 40. I'm not sure if a whole new Commander Lite format is needed to fix what a quick house rule could do. I'm assuming that since you didn't mention the Command Zone, that still exists in this format, in which case that's the only way the deck would play differently from a casual Krenko build, and the 2-of restriction is the only way the deck looks different on paper from casual builds. One thing I enjoyed about Commander was that it was obviously a unique format, in many ways; general/commander damage being one of them, which you've dropped (probably because you're playing 20 life instead of 40 or 30).
That said, if people like this format, enjoy. Personally, I think you should stick to the legendary creature restriction from Commander for the hero rather than leave it open to just any creature. There are plenty of legendary creatures, and while it's technically a restriction, it makes it easier for players new to the format to craft a deck, as they have a lot fewer choices than choosing from any creature in Magic. It's also a shame you can't keep in general/commander damage. I also still think just dropping Commander lifetotals to 30 is a way better way of having good, faster games than creating a new format; perhaps you should try that out at least, so you don't completely give up on Commander, as, after all, you're more likely to find games of Commander than a brand new format.
August 8, 2012 4:27 p.m.
would Memnarch be a valid commander in this format? Would he be counted as blue, or colorless, or not be allowed because his ability is not in his color?
August 8, 2012 6:01 p.m.
to sarroth, i love commander, it's my favorite format. I created this to be a more open ended version of it. I wanted a good middle ground between commander and noble. more open ended but using the same rules. I wanted to keep commander damage, and i'm thinking of adding it back in, but making it so if you deal 40 commander damage the game is over. seeing as how people will use infinite lifegain and what not. let me know if you think that's a good idea.
August 8, 2012 6:09 p.m.
If this keeps the same rules as EDH, I don't see how Memnarch would be legal. That's a mana symbol on the card outside of the commander's color identity. Are we not worrying about symbols on the card? Like you could use Lingering Souls in a Champion of the Parish deck?
August 8, 2012 7:55 p.m.
Official Commander Color Identity rules.
"903.4. The Commander variant uses color identity to determine what cards can be in a deck with a certain commander. The color identity of a card is the color or colors of any mana symbols in that cards mana cost or rules text, plus any colors defined by its characteristic-defining abilities (see rule 604.3) or color indicator (see rule 204)."
"903.5c A card can be included in a Commander deck only if every color in its color identity is also found in the color identity of the decks commander."
August 8, 2012 8:22 p.m.
so for the purposes of something like protection from blue, is Memnarch considered blue, or just a colorless legendary artifact creature wizard?
August 8, 2012 8:56 p.m.
Its considered colorless. Protection checks the colors of the source, which is colorless. Not the color Identity which is blue.
August 8, 2012 9:08 p.m.
@ieanbrewman: Your motives are understandable. I like the idea of keeping Commander Damage. You might even keep it at 21, as that's not much different than doing normal damage in a 20-life format but is still a choice against life-gain decks; plus keeping it at 21 requires less extra learning for Commander players moving over to the format.
Good luck with your format! Although, selfishly, I hope it doesn't catch on as much as Commander because the last thing I need is an excuse to build 3 more decks, lol.
August 9, 2012 4:24 p.m.
So with your current banned list i can play Ante cards
August 10, 2012 1:51 a.m.
Is there anyway we can get a featured article for Hero? With all the official Rules, Errata, and Current Banned list? At least what has been banned so more?
August 10, 2012 2:01 a.m.
This is a great deck i live it i think i will make the deck for myself i love my pesky goblins lol +1 from me
August 10, 2012 2:15 a.m.
I wish i had a little more help with this. however yes, give me time and I'll get an official page going. I just don't have enough time today.
August 10, 2012 2:25 p.m.
Ian -- elect someone to help you maintain it. I will add the format to TappedOut if you or whoever will commit to maintaining the list.
August 11, 2012 1:29 p.m.
seriously, commander/EDH is one of my favorite formats because of the combos and the gameplay, especially in multiplayer. Hero format, especially if it became endorsed or something, would be amazing. Even more amazing for TappedOut, since it would all start here and generate a lot of traffic
August 12, 2012 2:02 a.m.
Hero format added.
Feel free to edit your settings and add it to your Favorite Formats to follow new decks in the format.
Until the list is added to TappedOut none of them will show as legal--sorry!
August 12, 2012 2:14 a.m.
I'll get right on the changes. I think ianbrewman will have a side sight up(?) not sure. But I think the list of banned cards here is up to date. We will add to the list as the format is better explored. (like what as been down with the Noble Format)
I have been asked to help and have gladly excepted.
August 12, 2012 2:32 a.m.
What ever happened to Noble? Still around? I could add that too.
August 12, 2012 2:49 a.m.
It is in the format list. I think* Graft was the one that ran it. But it has kind of died down in popularity I guess?
August 12, 2012 2:53 a.m.
Color Identity? what's that?
August 13, 2012 12:59 a.m.
Hey go check out my format roulette please! I think you'll like it
August 15, 2012 2:04 p.m.
Rule on lengendary creatures, only able to run 1 or can you run 2?
August 15, 2012 2:56 p.m.
Look! I made Affinity. It's really good. HERO Affinity
August 15, 2012 9:21 p.m.
Is there still "depth counters" on your hero when it dies?
October 26, 2012 9:43 p.m.
Personally I think that forcing 2 of each card is brilliant, it forces people to double up on what they think is good, if you change it to up to one of each you are playing just a smaller deck version of EDH, which granted is what i gather part of the point is, but still. It's just going to be EDH with 40 less cards.
October 27, 2012 2:31 a.m.
It has a real under ground movement here where I'm at, the fact that it is possible less money then most EDH decks are great. It is attracting people to both EDH and Hero formats.
October 29, 2012 5:34 p.m.
You should make it SINGLETON 60.here are some cards that you should think about banning.Dreaded returnlife/deathall dredge cardsdark ritualCabal ritualskull clamp
November 17, 2012 4:30 p.m.
the reason it should be singleton 60 is because a deck thats singleton is pretty much the same price as a deck that isn't.
November 17, 2012 4:35 p.m.
Um? Could you clarify your agreement better? Maybe make a claim, a statement that 60 singleton is better. Then provide the evidence to support that claim, like facts and things. Then provide with a firm reason why this is better. If we are going to edit the format, please provide us with at least this.
As for the suggested banned list cards, please us the [ [Brackets] ] (without spaces) and provide a reason why we should ban them.
November 17, 2012 8:19 p.m.
I see no reason as of now to ban skull clamp, as it's not the main problem. being able to draw cards shouldn't be frowned upon, especially in a 60 card deck where you can be milled quite easily.
As joker said please explain why you think those cards should be banned and please use the brackets to make it easier for us to review them.
This format is specifically not singleton because it forces the player to make crucial and much more difficult decisions while building there hero deck.
My exact reason for making this format was to let the lesser creatures everyone knows are awesome shine. that Vampire Nighthawk ? yeah he can be a commander now, that card:Ajani's Pridemate? yeah he can be a commander now. how about things like Restoration Angel ? playing at instant speed from the command zone? how freaking crazy would that be? the whole idea is to build a deck around that ONE creature you fell in love with when you started playing commander. but at the same time not making it super tedious to build or play.
now tell me how making this format singleton would in any way make games shorter, or decks easier to build? i'm not trying to exactly copy EDH, Hero has it's own feel. and needs to be experienced as such. with the idea of commander far far in the distance.
November 18, 2012 4:35 a.m.
Especially because you can have a commander zur -> necropotence -> win game type deck atm. Or dark ritual necro if you have it, and tutor is just... yeah, since this is a 61 card format with doubles. Basically, with demonic tutor in the doubles 61 card format you can essentially run an effective necropotence deck.
December 9, 2012 6:03 p.m.
Shouldn't Countryside Crusher be banned as a hero? Because you can make a deck that has him as your general, and then make your entire deck mountains, and Fatal Frenzy . (Idea taken from 11.7% OF THE TIME, IT WORKS EVERY TIME.)
But apart from that, I love this format, it would be a lot of fun to play
August 2, 2013 7:45 p.m.
Any disruption stops the entire deck. It's not broken, it's just a cool interaction.
August 3, 2013 9:16 p.m.
"Excluding your hero, you must have 2 copies of each card in your deck, with the exception of basic lands"Up to 2, up to.With enforced 2-of you may as well be playing 30 card singleton decks for all the variety of deckbuilding possible.
March 8, 2014 7:14 a.m.
I see that but leaving it at 60 also changes draw percentages 30 card singleton would be too harsh on the user and consistency would be higher.
Also note to everyone. I'm going to be updating the ban list soon.
March 25, 2014 7:40 p.m.
Hey, yeah. Partial mulligans sounds incredibly dumb. There's a reason why 60 card formats have to mulligan their entire hand.