Why isnt boros prison/stax a viable deck?

Commander (EDH) forum

Posted on July 5, 2019, 8:42 a.m. by shadow63

Mono red prison is a very good deck outside of edh and I know white is one of if not the best stax color in edh. And I know that the color pair lacks card draw but over the last few years red has gotten some pretty good card advantage engines like Stolen Strategy Chandra, Torch of Defiance and Vance's Blasting Cannons  Flip those combined with stuff like Staff of Nin and Mind's Eye should keep you from gasing out. I just dont see why this deck cant be like 7/10 - 8/10. The combination of something like Ghostly Prison and War's Toll seems like a no brainer

DwaginFodder says... #2

1) Don't ask, just build it.

2) If you don't build it, I probably will.

3) How do you win once you lock them out? Burn doesn't work well in Commander, and I think that's how mono-red prison wins?

4) This deck will be funny to play against until it wins. Then we won't have friends anymore.

July 5, 2019 8:53 a.m.

TypicalTimmy says... #3

White can win with tokens and anthems. Things such as Coat of Arms will assist creatures of any and all types. So will Cathars' Crusade . There is also the weaker but still powerful Valor in Akros which pairs amazingly with Krenko, Mob Boss and Elspeth, Sun's Champion .

Combine these with the following God's for immense gains:

Ramp is weak in Boros, but since this is getting Enchantment heavy there is Serra's Sanctum , which plays nicely into using Academy Rector , Enduring Ideal , Enlightened Tutor and Idyllic Tutor .

As for red, having access to artifact removal means you can lock down opponents getting ahead with stones, thus reinforcing the prison you set up as it makes it harder for them to get out of it.

All you would need is a Commander who can do some of the following:

  • Cares about creatures
  • Combat enthusiast
  • Prison / Stax

My vote is for Basandra, Battle Seraph .

  • Fair CMC and 4/4 Flyer
  • Prisons out combat shenanigans
  • Force creatures to attack so they are open for cheap white removal or taken out as blockers come your next turn
  • Doubles down on prisons because if they can't attack you, they must attack someone else
  • Gives you political advantage

... Lol I should build this deck. I'm not a big fan of EDH, but this one sounds fun :)

July 5, 2019 9:15 a.m. Edited.

Joe_Ken_ says... #4

Something like Assemble the Legion would work really well with token generation since if it gets out of hand enough then you have an army.

Also Sphere of Safety is a really helpful card in the pillow fort style decks that you could use. Another that I always find helpful is Aura of Silence to slow your opponents down to give you a chance to pull ahead.

July 5, 2019 9:21 a.m.

Chhris says... #5

TypicalTimmy you almost make ME want to build that deck :P

July 5, 2019 9:33 a.m.

shadow63 says... #6

The reason I dont build it is I dont have the cards to do so

July 5, 2019 11:52 a.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #7

When I played this is modern way back before it was a deck with nahiri and emrakrul ... The win cons in my modern deck once the board state was stable were.

Ajani Vengeant Elspeth, Sun's Champion Assemble the Legion Elspeth, Knight-Errant Gideon Jura

Fast forward a few years and then that's when the nahiri emrakrul "combo" Again this was me back in 2014 my little home brew I wasnt playing chalice or ensnaring bridge like they were but I played blood moon. And granted it aas 60 card. Amd most of those listed above where one of's

Elspeth, Sun's Champion is just great after a board wipe or her -3 . she just shits out and army and when she gets to her ultimate the little 1/1's become 3/3's that plus Assemble the Legion ticking up every turn with and emblem is just stupid LOL. my personal favorite being able to use Elspeth, Knight-Errant to use her second +1 to jump either her own token, any other 1/1" or my personal favorite is to use her second +1 on a active Gideon Jura I would also assume if bot my personal preference to the deck style for boros prison in EDH is to be enchantment based in terms of cards like Luminarch Ascension Ghostly Prison Sphere of Safety Rest in Peace is always a good card Oblivion Ring if you decide to go rather enchant heavy Sigil of the Empty Throne . Just to name a few off the top of my head... Also the question is...whats the budget . Also my personal favorite win cons over the years Baneslayer Angel Sun Titan if you run an fair amount of. Cmcs of 3 or less. Entreat the Angels is nice because even though your not playing blue there are still ways to top deck manipulate for Entreat the Angels or just for better draws like Scroll Rack Sensei's Divining Top Crystal Ball Again just ranting off ideas and cards from too of my head

July 5, 2019 1:32 p.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #8

Oh other... Useful cards ...again sorry if bot bidget friendly I'm just giving ideas.

Land Tax , Smoke , Karmic Justice

July 5, 2019 1:39 p.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #9

If yoy end up playing a bunch of destroy effects like Wrath of God or Day of Judgment and you get the chance to have a Mimic Vat out .... Do the math lol Also Sunblast Angel + Mimic Vat .... Sweet combat step You have there lol

July 5, 2019 1:43 p.m.

TypicalTimmy says... #10

Sid_the_sloth, now this makes me wonder... In any EDH deck, you could play your Commander and exile it with Mimic Vat , then your boi returns to his CZ and Vat makes copied for you to play with.

Effectively, you bypass the tax and get them out for . You would just need a way to protect the vat, ala Curator's Ward / Darksteel Forge .

July 5, 2019 2:29 p.m.

Sarkhan420X says... #11

i don't think Ghostly Prison and War's Toll combo the way you think they do.

July 5, 2019 2:30 p.m.

dbpunk says... #12

It's a good synergy and making it so that they can't attack you with more than a few creatures is a viability. Also like using Insurrection as a wincon is viable. Also I think a prison deck might also be better if you made it Jeskai though for stuff like Isperia, Supreme Judge or make it Mardu for Dread type effects.

July 5, 2019 2:46 p.m.

Sarkhan420X says... #13

dbpunk: even with War's Toll , a player still has the option of using all their available mana to pay the cost of Ghostly Prison if they wish.

July 5, 2019 2:48 p.m.

dbpunk says... #14

Yeah that's true but it also means they can't cast attack and cast spells in the same turn. And having to pay for all their creatures mean theyd only be able to select a few to attack. It's a synergy, not a straight combo.

July 5, 2019 2:55 p.m.

dbpunk says... #15

Ok I would also say probably the better combo would be Silent Arbiter and War's Toll

July 5, 2019 3:01 p.m.

Mj3913 says... #16

shadow63 No need to have cards when cooking up a list. Sounds like fun though, you should totally go for it, then post your link here.

July 5, 2019 3:15 p.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #17

Oh yeah I wasn't thinking of putting your general on the mimic vat good point I was just pointing out in a dream game sunblast Angel on the vat... You'll never take damage. They declare attackers...before blockers are declared or even before damage is deal tech.... Activate mimic vat... What creatures Gideon Jura +2. They swing into Gideon Activate Mimic Vat with Sunblast Angel imprinted on it...LAWLS

Side not my phone keeps auto correcting mimic vat to mimic CAT lol

July 5, 2019 5:20 p.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #18

See I'm biased in a prison deck being semi super friends heavy. Enchant protection with your typical removal package. And a few not many but a few creature bombs. You dont need to be that guy and complete lock out ...just make their day hell and beat face lol

July 5, 2019 5:22 p.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #19

After work to help out the OP, I'll post my prefered style of red white prison/control ...for my play style and structure it like my old old modern boros prison. Take what ever you want from it just trying to help

July 5, 2019 5:24 p.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #20

FUN FACT: with mimic vat an manifest....

If the creature that dies is an instant or sorcery card that’s been manifested, Mimic Vat may have a nonpermanent card exiled. You can’t create a token that’s a copy of a nonpermanent card. No token is created in this case.

July 5, 2019 5:51 p.m.

enpc says... #21

I know I'm a bit late to the party, but there already is a Boris Stax deck based around Akiri, Line-Slinger and Bruse Tarl, Boorish Herder which uses a lot of artifact Stax pieces and then wins via commander damage through Akiri.

An example of this is:

Akiri-Bruse (RW) Aggro-Control

Commander / EDH cgomes


July 5, 2019 6:35 p.m.

jaymc1130 says... #22

@ TypicalTimmy, Sid_the_sloth You can't imprint your commander on Mimic Vat and have it return to the command zone. It must either stay in exile imprinted on the Vat to enable Vat to function and produce a token, or be immediately returned to the command zone the moment it is exiled via the imprint trigger unless you want it to remain exiled and imprinting the Vat indefinitely without the ability to return to the command zone outside of using a card like Riftsweeper to fetch it from exile.

July 5, 2019 6:41 p.m.

sagegrouse says... #23

So here's my run at boros political-prison. Took cards straight out of this thread to help build it. Maybe needs more forced combat? Unsure.

July 5, 2019 7:06 p.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #24

Yeah but end of day whats the difference if its exiled with imprint vs a path to exile the commander hits the exiled zone and the player has a choice...perm exile or return to command zone with the next casting being 2 more... Whats the difference its an imprint and the card goes to exile zone thus returning to command zone and still imprinted on the vat

July 5, 2019 7:40 p.m.

jaymc1130 says... #25

@ Sid_the_sloth The difference is huge, a card with the Imprint mechanic performs a functionality check when it "looks" at the card it Imprinted and the zone it looks at is the exile zone where the Imprinted card is tucked. In the event your commander is in the Command Zone the functionality check of the card with Imprint "sees" nothing in the exile zone where it is looking and then determines that nothing has been imprinted. In the case of Mimic Vat this means it produces a token of nothing. The Command Zone and the exile zone are not the same thing, there is a major difference.

July 5, 2019 7:51 p.m.

enpc says... #26

The command zone and the exile zone are two different zones. any object which moves from zone to zone is considered a new instance of that object. If Mimic Vat is looking for a "card exiled with mimc vat" then not only does it look for cards in exile only, but specifically cards exiled with that instance of Mimic Vat .

So you can imprint your commander on Mimic Vat , but if you then send your commander to the command zone (via the replacement effect) then you cannot make copies of it via Mimic Vat .

July 5, 2019 7:54 p.m.

Sid_the_sloth says... #27

You're right, my bad sorry

July 5, 2019 10:08 p.m.

Last_Laugh says... #28

If you go light on creatures/combat... Smoke .

July 6, 2019 1:51 a.m. Edited.

SMASHER101 says... #29

The cards you mention cost a lot which makes ur stax is better. Look up kerenos moon.

July 9, 2019 10:02 p.m.

shadow63 says... #30

You asked for it well here's the start of it Let's make boros glorious

July 14, 2019 1:17 p.m.

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