Reveal a card from your hand. Search your library for a card with the same name as that card, reveal it, put it into your hand, then shuffle your library.
Hellbent - If you have no cards in hand, instead search your library for a card, put it into your hand, then shuffle your library.
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|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Infernal Tutor Discussion
1 week ago
6 months ago
Might want to consider running 2x Bontu's Monument and 4x Myr Retriever With Heartless Summoning it goes infinite granted you have 2 of them, which comes to the tutoring idea. Most of the tutors in Modern aren't the greatest in B R G colors. I'd recommend dropping Red for White, grab yourself some Eladamri's Call Infernal Tutor (works great with Myr Retriever or Superion depending on whether you have Heartless out or Heartless+Bontu's. Path of Exile With white could be helpful as well.
8 months ago
Vman nice to meet you sir, it would seem were brothers in arms. I'm not exactly new to 8 rack anymore, I've been playing this list for a year or 2 now (I should probably update my deck description here since I made it when I first posted this deck back then). I occasionally get grunts and groans for playing it, but in my experience its less because the deck is a 'bad experience deck' (though I certainly see why it is and should be) and more because people don't see it as a 'real deck' and want to play against something stronger to practice for their gps. I sincerely enjoy watching those people writhe on the rack.
Alot of the changes you're suggesting I make are actually things I've gone away from over time due to my own experiences. For example, I used to run 4x Raven's Crime , and I agree it's one of the most powerful discard spells in the deck (I personally think it's second to Smallpox ). I went down to a 3 of not because I doubt it's power, but because each copy I draw after the first is effectively a land with fewer options. 3 allows me to consistently get to the first one, and less consistently just have my hand flooded with them.
Once upon a time I played Thoughtseize and Inquisition of Kozilek both as 4 ofs, and found that they weren't worth it. Turn 1-2 they're great options, but after I throw off my opponents early game I don't much care what they discard as long as they do, in fact, discard. Mid-late game after I have my opponent top decking helplessly, I found that when they drew a land they'd hold it, knowing that lands are the hardest things for me to make them discard, so when I draw a Thoughtseize and cast in an attempt to keep them on the rack I'm literally almost bolting myself for no purpose. I decided 6 of these was the number that allowed me consistently have one or 2 of them in my opening hand but not rely on them so much later. So far it's working out for me.
Infernal Tutor has only ever over performed for me. I frequently run with no cards in hand, so it's effectively a demonic tutor. And if a card is powerful enough to get restricted in vintage, I damn sure want it in modern. If I don't have hellbent, i hold it until I do. The only time it doesn't work out for me is if I have the misfortune of drawing the second while I'm still holding the first (which is why I only run 2 of it) in which case I'll often use one to tutor for a lili or a removal spell. Less good because I'm limited in what I tutor for. But still good. There's been exactly one instance where I had to fail to find a third copy of Infernal Tutor to keep my hand size down for bridge, but even that was fine because more often than not bridge is what I tutor for with hellbent.
Delirium Skeins I agree is generally more of a sideboard card, and more often than not it's one of the first things I board out. I originally had all 3 copies in my sideboard... I think I swapped it with the 2 Dismember s if memory serves. I find myself using dismember entirely too rarely, and when I get the rest of the cards I want for my sb it's on the chopping block. It's possible that maybe delirium skeins will be moved back to the SB someday, for now it's sorta main deck worthy... ish
The land issue you mention is sorta the one I've been running into. I'm guessing you found my deck from my post in the forums, in which case you probably saw that my lands are on the working list. I intend to cut the Mutavault s as soon as I find a better working alternative for an alt win con. I'm toying with the idea of Liliana's Caress as a 2 of. Something that allows me to still use it if I have to hide behind bridge. Plan for now is to have my 4 colorless lands be ghost quarters to help keep tron off their game and make sure revolt is easy to come by for Fatal Push . Plus I know from experience how much fun it is to ghost quarter 3 of their lands and use Shadow of Doubt to deny them their search, have to assume it's more fun with 4.
The actual number of my lands I may consider working on, there have been a couple games where I've been forced to smallpox aggressively due to them being the primary discard spell I drew in my opening hand and it took me a while to recover. I'll have to look for some cuts to make room for more lands
...and you thought YOUR post was a wall of text XD
8 months ago
Hello there good sir, I am an avid 8rack player (actually known as the resident "bad player experience" player) around my place specializing in Land destruction, infect, mill and discard. So I may be able to help you out =)
First of all, since im assuming you are still somewhat new to 8rack i just want to make a disclaimer. People will generally not really enjoy playing against you. *rack is the type of deck to cause grunts and make people want to go to the next game. so if you arent the type of player that enjoys seeing others in misery i do suggest picking up a different deck. Overtime it really gets to pilots of 8rack.
Now lets get to the deck:
Firstly i see you are running 21 lands 7 of which are colorless. 8 rack might have a very low curve but its been generally established you should run 23-24 lands (personally im a 24 fan)
Also people have done the math for AAAGGEESSSS. With 4 urborgs and 24 lands its been noted you can have up to 5 colorless sources. Most people only do 4 but some go for the additional 5th as either Field of Ruin , Hostile Desert or Blinkmoth Nexus . Ghost Quarter is cool and fast, but losing lands early unless its pox value does hurt the deck.
heres a few more core ideals of 8rack deckbuilding:
Usually theres 6-8 targetted 1 mana removal spells (and you always play these first) the most common form found is 3x Thoughtseize with 4x Inquisition of Kozilek but if budget is a concern Blackmail is the next best choice followed by Duress . I alongside the majority of people run 7 of these cards.
Delirium Skeins is generally a sideboard card. its boarded in versus that leyline that gives hexproof (making your targetted discard worthless) or against controll decks that draw so many cards where 1 for 1 discard isnt good enough. the reason why its not mainboard is because its too slow.
another important note is to play 4x Raven's Crime YES, i know the card looks weak. but that is what every new player to 8rack feels like. but ask any veteran and its easily one of the most important and best cards in the deck. many times on turn 2 will you ravens crime into discarding a land for another activation. assuming you were on the draw and played a 1 mana discard spell t1, and your opponent played 2 spells and 2 lands hes 1 card away from being hellbent already. the card makes lategame lands fodder and its easy to discard to smallpox or lily. PLAY 4 NO QUESTION.
Infernal Tutor is a card some people like, some dont. most people who do like it usually have it as a 1 of but ive never played with it personally so i cannot really comment on it.
This seems like quite a wall of text already, so feel free to ask any specific questions you may have, im always glad to help. also, 8rack is a deck that requires alot of practice to win hard matchups with. so be patient =)
10 months ago
APPLE01DOJ thank you so much! I had tried Infernal Tutor x1 and so long as I was hellbent it was great but usually it was lack luster. which do you prefer of the 2 mentioned. I think mastermind might be really good, but then again beseech is great as well. I had tested online with Liliana, the Last Hope and had her on the first version. as I was redoing the deck I guess I forgot to add her. Trinisphere is nuts and wouldn't hurt us. What do you think of this version? Thank you for your time and suggestions.
MarioSmallszs I read my previous comment to you and meant to write that she did help which is why I added her back to the deck. Thank you again for the suggestions and your time.
11 months ago
MediSyntax I'm incredibly biased with Rain of Filth as I play an all in Gitrog deck (and RoF is B U S T E D when he's out), and I'd be definitely willing to try it! The rituals I find are so vital to the build, but you make a reasonable case about Mindslicer . At worst he's a 4/3 that stops all players attacking you, at best he forces all opponents to topdeck. This is great, so I see your point.
Imperial Seal is bad. It's a twice the price Vampiric Tutor that is susceptible to players hitting you with a Ghost Quarter type effect. I think it's ok if you've a Dusk Legion Zealot in hand, but otherwise it's more likely to be too slow - whereas grim tutor adds it to hand. I don't personally own an Infernal Tutor , but I'd be willing to test that out. On the topic of tutors - Mausoleum Secrets has been doing work. Often it's only necessary in slightly more grindy games, but if you Buried Alive with a mana spare you can often chain that into a Songs of the Damned and into a win via any buried alive combo.
Luckily I've not had the chance to aggressively mulligan for Leyline of the Void vs the other cEDH decks I've tested it, so the card's not tested it's milage... watch this space.
11 months ago
Rhystic Tutor is in there for tutor density and for pitching to Chrome Mox when it's not useful. It's also not restrictive, as opposed to something like Mausoleum Secrets or Infernal Tutor , which are only good in certain circumstances.
Isochron Scepter isn't in, in part due to lack of space in the deck, and in part due to it's reliance on Paradox Engine to work. In the event of Null Rod and/or Stony Silence, we need to be able to pivot in order to get there.
1 year ago
Glistening Oil would be utterly brutal in this deck. Getting Haunt up to 5 power for a two swing kill is trivial, where as getting him to 10 for a one hit kill is almost as easy. Bonus points for putting in Dauthi Embrace to give your pumped up Infect Commander some Shadow goodness. Throw in Demonic Tutor Vampiric Tutor and Infernal Tutor and you're ready to fetch what you need when you need it.